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- To: B-GREEK@virginia.edu
- Subject: voice.matters.again
- From: BTHURMAN@unca.edu
- Date: Fri, 30 May 1997 08:56:54 -0400 (EDT)
- Organization: University of North Carolina at Asheville
i remain almost completely unconvinced of observations to the effect that
connections in the ancient greek mind between middle form and middle function
or between passive form and passive function will not have existed.
my instinctive reaction will have been that, without a rather large cast's (of
characters) here having known it, they are mentally englishing the ancient
greek wording in ways that seem smoothest to their minds and then reaching
conclusions about disappearance of distinctions &c. on the basis of what will
thus have functioned as gestalt-ic blinders to the actual hellenic/-istic
to put it another way with a partial illustration, vis-a-vis some comments
dropped here on lambavw = lambano > lh[m]yomai = le[m]psomai (or -ae, to be
consistently latinizing): in the first place comparing the present here to the
future's like comparing apples and oranges, becausee the future's more
primitive, as not having the accretion, namely the added suffix -av = -an. in
the major, second place, if i'm going to mentally english the middle form
future relative to such a present, i could just as easily go with something mean
between (which is what to mecov = to meson or h mecothc = he mesotes seems to
have meant in ancient grammatical learning -- not to say education, for that is
something now for those who cannot learn -- for the mean, now less
appropriately termed middle and interpreted almost altogether morphologically)
the evepghtikh = energetice and na0htikh = pathetice even in my mental
englishing. for example, it could fudge things in the direction of "i'm a
taking/ receiving" for the active form present, but more in the directin of
something middle-esque for the future, say "i'll get me a ...".
some on the list seem to be fascinated into the comfort of non-solving
solutions, largely on the basis of english gestalt.
it was a pleasure to susan and me to have carl here with us yesterday and i do
hope that what he has had to say on this subject will indeed curb the silliness
of students' thinking that, when they translate certain middles or passives,
they have to show that they know what form it is by constantly injecting
awkward 'for myself' -s or the like into their renditions.
must run to dance and practice my ballet combinations.
bearded bill of asheville <firstname.lastname@example.org>
unca not having approved either whom or thereof.