b-greek-digest V1 #867

b-greek-digest          Thursday, 21 September 1995    Volume 01 : Number 867

In this issue:

        Fonts for Perseus WWW
        Re: Trinity and Deity
        Re: Mark 16 hRHSSW/hRHGNUMI 
        Re: Teaching accents 
        Re: Calling Jesus "God" in the NT


From: John Baima <jbaima@onramp.net>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 16:42:05 -0500
Subject: Fonts for Perseus WWW

I have not seen this cross posted here, and some of you may be interested in it:

>Date: Tue, 19 Sep 1995 10:47:46 -0400
>From: Greg Crane <gcrane@perseus.tufts.edu>
>Anyone with Windows Netscape interested in seeing Greek texts, LSJ and other 
>sundry tools available on the Perseus Web Page  can now do so. We have a
>workaround that is not perfect, but does get things going.
>Thanks to John Baima, we have a workaround so that people with
>Windows machines can see Greek via Netscape. He has prepared a special
>font that you can download and then use to see Greek. There are still
>some oddities: you need to set the Fixed Width Font to his Greek, but 
>the font really isn't fixed width. The spacing looks odd when you see it,
>but it *is* Greek and its a good start.
>You can find the Fixed Width Greek font on John Baima's Silver Mountain
>Software Homepage:  http://rampages.onramp.net/~jbaima/
>Once you have installed this and made it the fixed width font for Netscape,
>you can go to the Perseus home page: http://www.perseus.tufts.edu
>Once you get to a Greek text, all you need to do is set the transliteration
>to Greek: our software checks to see if you have a Mac or a Windows 
>version of Netscape and chooses either the appropriate transliteration 
>scheme for SMK GreekKeys or John's SGreek.
>You can start with either the sampe LSJ Entry for fero or the the sample 
>We are very interested in seeing how to make this new medium as useful
>as possible for classicists. *Please feel free to play with the site and to
>pass this announcement on to anyone else who might be interested.*
>Greg Crane
>Editor in Chief
>Perseus Project


From: Charles David Miller <malik@unm.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 19:30:30 -0600 (MDT)
Subject: Re: Trinity and Deity

>From the Catholic perspective, you might try Raymond E. Brown's _Biblical 
Exegesis and Church Doctrine_. The chapter on the Holy Spirit is 
espcially of note. Also, Brown's book that deals specifically with the 
exegesis of Jesus as God in _An Introduction to NT Christology_ and his 
_Jesus God and Man_ (an older version of the former) deal with the 
passages and problems associated with finding Jesus called God in the NT. 
Brown also deals with the issue of the Nicaean Council in relationship to 
the NT.

R.H> Fuller's _The Foundations of NT Christology_ also goes into the 
problem from a "Titles" historico-traditional approach. J.D.G. Dunn's 
book, _Christology in the Making_ is a comprehensive, methodical study of 
the texts and issues involved with this topic. From the Catholic 
perspective again, which combines theology with NT biblical exegesis, you 
might find Walter Kasper's work, _Jesus the Christ_, helpful. And then 
there's Martin Hengel's book, _The Son of God_. I have found all these 
very useful in disentangling the problems you discuss.

Best of luck,

Chuck Miller


Charles David Miller, University of New Mexico (graduate student in
philosophy, with an emphasis in philosophy of psychology) Department of
Philosophy Home: (505) 867-1892 Work: (505) 883-5959

"God grant the philosopher insight into what lies in front of everyone's

[Moge Gott dem Philosophen Einsicht geben in das, was vor allen Augen
				--Ludwig Wittgenstein

- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------


From: Edward Hobbs <EHOBBS@wellesley.edu>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 21:43:41 -0500 (EST)
Subject: Pneumonics

In the spirit of ignoring the acute pain involved in teaching accents (since 
ignoring them is a grave error), and being sure the students are circumflexed 
by the eighth lesson:  May I add my favorite pneumonic when teaching 
non-Greek-reading, English-only-speaking students the Gospel of John.  The 
constant puns make little sense in English, but I try to help in chapter 3 by 
mentioning that one can remember that *pneuma* means "breath" by recalling 
"pneumonia", breathing-trouble, and that pneumatic tires are pumped full of 
breath, and that Jayne Mansfield was noted for her pneumatic personality (the 
younger ones don't get that one); so it is with the Holy Breath.
	If that isn't _real_ pneumonic help, I wouldn't know a pneumonic if I 
were inspired (which I am only occasionally, mostly when I am windy).
	As with Nichael, my day brightened quite a bit when I read that 
delicious "typo".  (And may I remind all of you that Nichael once suggested 
that you take up a collection to buy me a decent editor for writing on the 
Internet, since I make so frightfully many typo's myself, though never one so 
lovely [and inspiring] as pneumonics.)

Edward C. Hobbs


From: WINBROW@aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 21:57:05 -0400
Subject: Re: Mark 16 hRHSSW/hRHGNUMI 

We treated these words as variant spellings of the same word in the
Morphology.  We generally followed BAGD in these matters.
Carlton Winbery
LA College, Pineville, LA


From: WINBROW@aol.com
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 21:57:13 -0400
Subject: Re: Teaching accents 

I would like belatedly to say a work about accents for beginning students.  I
do emphasize learning the basic rules of accent, the rule in nouns and the
rules in verbs.  The accent mark often affords another piece of evidence to
help the student identify forms, such as the circumflex accent on the ultima
of the genitive plural of first declension nouns, the accent on TIS/TI makes
it who? rather than anyone, the circumflex accent on contract verbs in the
present and sometimes imperfect tenses helps students recognize the
contraction, the accent on words like FA/NHi = aor. active subj. but FANHi/ =
aor. pass. subj.  

I am aware that the accents were developed in the Byzantine period and had
something to do with chanting.  I do not try to emphasize rising or falling
inflections, but the accents help the students recognize.  Others that
provide another clue are the Perfect pass part, the relative pronouns and the
articles, demonstrative pronouns (AUTH/ and hAU/TH), the article hH and the
relative hH/, etc.  Anything that gives students another clue as to what form
they are dealing with seems to me to be important.

Carlton Winbery
LA College, Pineville, LA


From: David Moore <dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us>
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 1995 23:04:48 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: Calling Jesus "God" in the NT

Paul Moser <PMOSER@cpua.it.luc.edu> wrote:

>Regarding Heb 1:8, the marginal
>translation of the NRSV seems clearly preferable to
>the translation in the text, especially after one
>examines Psalm 45 in the LXX.  The vocative of
>"theos" is definitely not what the original context

	There is no reason, grammatically speaking, not to take hO QEOS as
vocative in both the Hebrews passage and in the LXX.  The use of the
nominative forms for the vocative is easily established for NT Greek.  In
reference to this usage in the LXX, Conybeare and Stock, in their _Grammar
of Septuagint Greek_ say, "QEOS has a vocative QEE.... Usually, however,
the nominative is employed for the vocative...." ([Peabody: Hendrickson]
p. 26).  The vocative fits the Hebrew of Ps. 45:6 equally well. 

	It is the context, however, to which Paul Moser is appealing; but
his exegesis, IMO, misses the mark.  "God is your throne," is without
parallel, as a concept, in all of the OT.  But reference to rulers as
'ELOHIYM (Are they cases of hyperbole?) are not difficult to find (eg. Ps.
82:1,6).  There is nothing in the surrounding context of Ps. 45:6 (or of
Heb. 1:8 for that mattter) that stands against taking QEOS ('ELOHIYM) as
vocative.  In fact, that most translations render these passages, "Your
throne, Oh God," or something similar, suggests that this is the most
natural way to take the Greek (and the Hebrew) here. 

	The son's identification with God as stated by Heb. 1:8 (if we
take it that way) is also echoed in the immediate context both in v. 6 and
v. 10.  It seems to me that the context doesn't support anything but a
vocative understanding of hO QEOS either in Ps. 45:6 or in Heb. 1:8. 

David L. Moore                             Southeastern Spanish District
Miami, Florida                               of the  Assemblies of God
dvdmoore@dcfreenet.seflin.lib.fl.us           Department of Education


End of b-greek-digest V1 #867


To unsubscribe from this list write


with "unsubscribe b-greek-digest" as your message content.  For other
automated services write to the above address with the message content

For further information, you can write the owner of the list at


You can send mail to the entire list via the address: