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by Stirling Bartholomew
February 5th, 2020, 6:59 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Orations of St Athanasius Against the Arians
Replies: 20
Views: 580

Orations of St Athanasius Against the Arians

Is this a reference to nephilim? ὡς τοὺς γίγαντας, πάλιν θεομαχοῦντας αὐτοὺς ὁρῶ . see in them the giants again fighting against God. Gen. 6:4 הנפלים היו בארץ the nephilim were in the land οἱ δὲ γίγαντες ἦσαν ἐπὶ τῆς γῆς Oration III Against the Arians § 41.5 Ἀληθινὸς γὰρ Θεὸς ἦν ἐν τῇ σαρκὶ, καὶ ἀλη...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 31st, 2020, 2:25 pm
Forum: The Verb in Koine Greek
Topic: Aorist indicative with future temporal reference
Replies: 83
Views: 43589

Re: Aorist indicative with future temporal reference

[*] More ambiguous instances where aorists are in a statement that, by context, seems to point to the future, i.e. “as if it were already done”. [/list] Setting aside the question of "spatial/temporal remoteness" for a minute, asserting the aorist is used to suggest "as if it were already done" is ...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 27th, 2020, 6:15 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

RE: using a translation The translation is like hiking/climbing off trail with a topographical map. The map gets you generally headed toward the location. It doesn't actually get you there (no GPS). Here is an example, I found this somewhat difficult to unpack. Oratio II Contra Arianos § 36.3 ὁ δὲ ...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 27th, 2020, 3:12 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

Here we see the main theme of the discourse reiterated once again. I hauled out Lampe while pondering the significance of τὰ ἐν τῇ πόλει δημιουργήματα . Athanasius employs members of the δημιουργ- word group frequently in a positive sense. § 47.2 ἐν αὐτῷ δὲ καὶ δι' αὐτοῦ, καὶ ἑαυτὸν ἐμφαίνει, καθὼς ...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 24th, 2020, 8:16 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

Barry Hofstetter wrote:
January 20th, 2020, 12:41 pm
Secondly, Ι think Newman's translation is somewhat misleading ...
Not the only example of this. Jonn Henry Newman wasn't aiming at a formal equivalence translation. He knew better, It would be unreadable. He wins because he is accessible. John Behr and Khaled Anatolios are books from libraries.
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 24th, 2020, 7:53 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

I am currently preparing my working texts for Athanasius Orations I and II Against the Arians. My pace is picking up somewhat, having acquired some familiarity with the jargon and the writing style. TLG has this work in their open corpus. May take advantage of that. But I don't intend to do this pro...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 18th, 2020, 3:38 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

The form of ποιήσωμεν Gen 1:26 is employed by Athanasius in this sample of grammatical exegesis . § 46.4 ἀφ' ὧν καὶ ἡμᾶς πείθει λέγουσα· Αὐτὸς εἶπε, καὶ ἐγενήθησαν· αὐτὸς ἐνετείλατο, καὶ ἐκτίσθησαν· καθὼς καὶ ὁ πάντα μέγας Μωϋσῆς ἐν ἀρχῇ τῆς κοσμοποιίας βεβαιοῖ τὸ λεγόμενον ἐξηγούμενος καὶ λέγων· Κα...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 13th, 2020, 3:12 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

πάντα μέγας in reference to Moses appears in Philo, Didymus the Blind and Athanasius. All three from Alexandria. Contra Gentes: § 46.4 ἀφ' ὧν καὶ ἡμᾶς πείθει λέγουσα· Αὐτὸς εἶπε, καὶ ἐγενήθησαν· αὐτὸς ἐνετείλατο, καὶ ἐκτίσθησαν· καθὼς καὶ ὁ πάντα μέγας Μωϋσῆς ἐν ἀρχῇ τῆς κοσμοποιίας βεβαιοῖ τὸ λεγό...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 10th, 2020, 3:52 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

... because a teaching cannot be the one to "abolish the godlessness etc" ... Peng, I understand an share your reservations. Here is a third example from the same context where Athanasius appears to make θεοπνεύστου γραφῆς , which is coreferential with ἡ ἔνθεος διδασκαλία , function as an agent or ...
by Stirling Bartholomew
January 9th, 2020, 1:00 pm
Forum: Church Fathers and Patristic Greek Texts
Topic: Athanasius Contra Gentes
Replies: 61
Views: 20107

Re: Athanasius Contra Gentes

The attributive position can be filled with arbitrarily long and complex phrases. God/Word (focus of entire §45) is the subject of ἀνελών, because a teaching cannot be the one to "abolish the godlessness etc", and as you've noted, the case mismatch is a strong clue as well. Thus imho Newman transla...

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