Help me teach this class

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 29th, 2015, 1:19 pm

Here are two more sections of tomorrow's text that I'm struggling with:

Διδάσκαλε, τί ποιήσας ζωὴν αἰώνιον κληρονομήσω;

What's a good communicative approach to teaching the above text? Neither the verbs nor the nouns are all that concrete, and I'm not sure what questions to ask to bring out the meaning of this.

Also, in the following text, I am having some difficulties:

Ἀγαπήσεις κύριον τὸν θεόν σου
ἐξ ὅλης τῆς καρδίας σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ ψυχῇ σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ ἰσχύϊ σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ διανοίᾳ σου,
καὶ τὸν πλησίον σου ὡς σεαυτόν.


My difficulty is that the distinctions between ψυχῇ and διανοίᾳ are a bit too subtle for the approaches I am taking. I can hold my hands on my heart for καρδία (perhaps with some beating), I can make a muscle for ἰσχύς ... if I had only one of ψυχή or διάνοια, I could point to my head ... but I can't see an easy way to distinguish them with gestures, motions, or questions in Greek. How would you handle that?
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Thomas Dolhanty
Posts: 400
Joined: May 20th, 2014, 10:13 am
Location: west coast of Canada

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Thomas Dolhanty » August 29th, 2015, 2:29 pm

Jonathan Robie wrote:
Also, in the following text, I am having some difficulties:

Ἀγαπήσεις κύριον τὸν θεόν σου
ἐξ ὅλης τῆς καρδίας σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ ψυχῇ σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ ἰσχύϊ σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ διανοίᾳ σου,
καὶ τὸν πλησίον σου ὡς σεαυτόν.


My difficulty is that the distinctions between ψυχῇ and διανοίᾳ are a bit too subtle for the approaches I am taking. I can hold my hands on my heart for καρδία (perhaps with some beating), I can make a muscle for ἰσχύς ... if I had only one of ψυχή or διάνοια, I could point to my head ... but I can't see an easy way to distinguish them with gestures, motions, or questions in Greek. How would you handle that?
Unlike the way the Greeks usually intend the word, I think New Testament writers usually intend ψυχή to express the same thing as the Hebrew נֶפֶשׁ. It is more the idea of whole being or 'life force' as a single entity rather than a 'member' of the whole. I think the closest you could come with pointing, would be to sweep your hands to indicate 'all of me' or some other action to express essential / holistic entity. This one will take some words somewhere along the way because of different usages.
γράφω μαθεῖν

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 29th, 2015, 5:57 pm

Thomas Dolhanty wrote:
Jonathan Robie wrote:
Also, in the following text, I am having some difficulties:

Ἀγαπήσεις κύριον τὸν θεόν σου
ἐξ ὅλης τῆς καρδίας σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ ψυχῇ σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ ἰσχύϊ σου
καὶ ἐν ὅλῃ τῇ διανοίᾳ σου,
καὶ τὸν πλησίον σου ὡς σεαυτόν.


My difficulty is that the distinctions between ψυχῇ and διανοίᾳ are a bit too subtle for the approaches I am taking. I can hold my hands on my heart for καρδία (perhaps with some beating), I can make a muscle for ἰσχύς ... if I had only one of ψυχή or διάνοια, I could point to my head ... but I can't see an easy way to distinguish them with gestures, motions, or questions in Greek. How would you handle that?
Unlike the way the Greeks usually intend the word, I think New Testament writers usually intend ψυχή to express the same thing as the Hebrew נֶפֶשׁ. It is more the idea of whole being or 'life force' as a single entity rather than a 'member' of the whole. I think the closest you could come with pointing, would be to sweep your hands to indicate 'all of me' or some other action to express essential / holistic entity. This one will take some words somewhere along the way because of different usages.
Very good - thanks!
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 29th, 2015, 5:58 pm

Thomas Dolhanty wrote:
Jonathan Robie wrote:Any thoughts on how to teach ἐκπειράζω with TPR actions?
One thing is certain, all the children of Adam will grasp this concept pretty easily! ;->

One possibility would be to provide a list of simple phrases from which each class member could choose one.
  • οὐ θέλω φαγεῖν
  • οὐ θέλω λαλῆσαι
  • οὐ θέλω ἐξελθεῖν
Then, when they say their phrase, you could present the 'no eater' with food, the 'no talker' with insistent chatter, the 'no goer' with many beckonings to come, etc.
But the sense here is more "to try to trap" than to tempt.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 29th, 2015, 8:59 pm

Jonathan Robie wrote:Here are two more sections of tomorrow's text that I'm struggling with:

Διδάσκαλε, τί ποιήσας ζωὴν αἰώνιον κληρονομήσω;

What's a good communicative approach to teaching the above text? Neither the verbs nor the nouns are all that concrete, and I'm not sure what questions to ask to bring out the meaning of this.
Micheal Palmer wins the prize for best suggestion here - he suggested I make this sentence the introduction to the entire lesson, and just talk it out before going into the body of the lessson. I think that will work well.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 29th, 2015, 10:01 pm

Here are my materials for tomorrow's class. As always, feedback and corrections are very welcome. The plan is to start on page 2, and do the script on page 1 last.

This time, I plan to have some of the students asking questions of each other, not just me.
Luke10.25-37.pdf
(87.6 KiB) Downloaded 31 times
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Stephen Hughes
Posts: 3323
Joined: February 26th, 2013, 7:12 am

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Stephen Hughes » August 30th, 2015, 6:32 am

Jonathan Robie wrote: I can hold my hands on my heart for καρδία (perhaps with some beating)
It may be a misrepresentation to portray καρδία as the physical organ within the context of Biblical Greek.
Γελᾷ δ' ὁ μωρός, κἄν τι μὴ γέλοιον ᾖ
(Menander, Γνῶμαι μονόστιχοι 108)

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 30th, 2015, 6:52 am

Stephen Hughes wrote:
Jonathan Robie wrote: I can hold my hands on my heart for καρδία (perhaps with some beating)
It may be a misrepresentation to portray καρδία as the physical organ within the context of Biblical Greek.
I think it is, and I also think it may be misrepresentation to imply that they believed thinking is done with the brain. But for North American learners, I'm thinking of this as an oversimplification that helps make things concrete.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Eeli Kaikkonen
Posts: 395
Joined: June 2nd, 2011, 7:49 am
Location: Finland
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Eeli Kaikkonen » August 30th, 2015, 8:06 am

Stephen Hughes wrote:
Jonathan Robie wrote: I can hold my hands on my heart for καρδία (perhaps with some beating)
It may be a misrepresentation to portray καρδία as the physical organ within the context of Biblical Greek.
On the other hand the prototypical καρδία would probably still have been the organ for the ancient Koine speaking people. Nowadays it's more about romantic feelings, but English speaking people understand both concrete and abstract meanings of heart easily. If you would teach the English word as second language you would teach the concrete meaning first, right? Many languages today have such concrete/abstract connection for the organ. Teaching the abstract meaning of καρδία is difficult and requires a lecture on ancient anthropology.

Jonathan Robie
Posts: 3304
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Help me teach this class

Post by Jonathan Robie » August 30th, 2015, 2:57 pm

Post mortem for today's class ....

We had one new student, who had two semesters of Greek from Stephen Carlson in Duke Divinity a few years back. The other three have varied backgrounds - one knows modern Greek but is just learning Koine, one knows Koine fairly well, one knows Latin well and is just starting with Koine.

On the whole, I was a little over-prepared. People knew a bunch of words I was prepared to teach, if they showed that they recognized a word I didn't teach it. I got through the whole Greek portion of the lesson in about 35 minutes. Those who have had the class before clearly are learning, they know how to ask and answer questions much better now.

I added two new techniques this time:

1. I had students ask each other questions and give each other commands. Since we have a small group, I just went around the circle and let people do two questions or commands. Since they had questions and commands written out and had heard them, it wasn't all that hard, but they mostly didn't look at the sheet as they were doing this. It was only hard for one student, and he managed to do it. I will definitely use this technique again.

2. In lists that illustrate the grammar, I have included incorrect choices, indicated by strikethrough font. I can't do strikethrough here, so I will use font colors and the word strikethrough to simulate.

(a) τίς εἶπεν πρὸς τίνα;
(b) αὐτός εἶπεν πρὸς αὐτόν
(c) ὁ νομικός εἶπεν πρὸς τὸν Ἰησοῦν.
[strikethrough](d) τίνα εἶπεν πρὸς τίς ;[/strikethrough]
[strikethrough](e) αὐτόν εἶπεν πρὸς αὐτός;[/strikethrough]

Both went well.

Three things I want to do better next time:

1. While the beginners are working on cases, the more advanced people are working on participles. When we hit a form like ποιήσας, I know that I will remind them that because it is nominative and not genitive it means that the subject is the same as the subject of the main verb, and someone will want to know what the corresponding Genitive would be, so I should write ποιήσας / ποιήσαντος down on the sheet so they can compare. I need to have different language objectives for different learners.

2. I need to provide tables for reference after class.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest