Origen Fragment

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Bunny7
Posts: 3
Joined: January 13th, 2024, 1:31 am

Origen Fragment

Post by Bunny7 »

Hello, I have a question about the exact translation of a passage of one of Origen’s fragments on the gospel of Matthew. The passage is a little difficult, so even though I have a good idea of what he’s saying, I just want to make sure my translation is correct. Here is the passage:

Δεῖ τοίνυν μὴ μακροὺς ἀναλίσκειν λόγο‹υ›ς,531 ἀλλὰ τοῖς αὐτοῖς κεχρῆσθαι ῥήμασι συχνῶς, μηδὲ μακρὰς ποιεῖσθαι τὰς εὐχάς, οὐχὶ τῷ χρόνῳ, ἀλλὰ τῷ μήκει καὶ πλήθει τῶν λεγομένων. Παραμένειν μὲν γὰρ χρὴ τὰ αὐτὰ αἰτοῦντας, οὐχὶ τῷ πλήθει
δὲ τῶν αἰτημάτων ἀδιαφόρως αἰτοῦντας δόξαν ἢ πλοῦτον καὶ τὰ ἑξῆς, ἀλλὰ μόνα τὰ ψυχωφελῆ.

I believe the passage is talking about the necessity of avoiding long and vain prayers. Instead, he favours repeating short and simple prayers directed towards heavenly rather than earthly things. An exact translation of the passage would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
Sarah Wilkinson
Jason Hare
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Re: Origen Fragment

Post by Jason Hare »

Shalom, “Bunny7.”

This is your first post to B-Greek, and I’ve approved the post. However, we do not allow anonymous posting on this forum (see the policy). The easiest thing to do is to add a signature to your profile that will appear at the bottom of each of your posts, such that it contains your first and last name and (if applicable) any academic association that you have. You can do that by clicking here. Otherwise, let one of the forum team know if you would like to change your username to match your real name.

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Bunny7
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Joined: January 13th, 2024, 1:31 am

Re: Origen Fragment

Post by Bunny7 »

Ok. The profile has been updated.

Thanks
Sarah Wilkinson
Ken M. Penner
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Re: Origen Fragment

Post by Ken M. Penner »

Bunny7 wrote: January 13th, 2024, 2:03 am Hello, I have a question about the exact translation of a passage of one of Origen’s fragments on the gospel of Matthew. The passage is a little difficult, so even though I have a good idea of what he’s saying, I just want to make sure my translation is correct. Here is the passage:

Δεῖ τοίνυν μὴ μακροὺς ἀναλίσκειν λόγο‹υ›ς,531 ἀλλὰ τοῖς αὐτοῖς κεχρῆσθαι ῥήμασι συχνῶς, μηδὲ μακρὰς ποιεῖσθαι τὰς εὐχάς, οὐχὶ τῷ χρόνῳ, ἀλλὰ τῷ μήκει καὶ πλήθει τῶν λεγομένων. Παραμένειν μὲν γὰρ χρὴ τὰ αὐτὰ αἰτοῦντας, οὐχὶ τῷ πλήθει
δὲ τῶν αἰτημάτων ἀδιαφόρως αἰτοῦντας δόξαν ἢ πλοῦτον καὶ τὰ ἑξῆς, ἀλλὰ μόνα τὰ ψυχωφελῆ.

I believe the passage is talking about the necessity of avoiding long and vain prayers. Instead, he favours repeating short and simple prayers directed towards heavenly rather than earthly things. An exact translation of the passage would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
How's this:
Therefore, one must not spend time on long speeches, instead use the same phrases often, nor make your prayers long, not by time, rather by the length and number of things spoken. For one must persist in asking for the same things, but not through the abundance of things asked for indiscriminately asking for glory or wealth and the like, rather only for what benefits the soul.”
Ken M. Penner
Professor and Chair of Religious Studies, St. Francis Xavier University
Co-Editor, Digital Biblical Studies
General Editor, Lexham English Septuagint
Co-Editor, Online Critical Pseudepigrapha pseudepigrapha.org
Bunny7
Posts: 3
Joined: January 13th, 2024, 1:31 am

Re: Origen Fragment

Post by Bunny7 »

Ken M. Penner wrote: January 15th, 2024, 10:13 am
How's this:
Therefore, one must not spend time on long speeches, instead use the same phrases often, nor make your prayers long, not by time, rather by the length and number of things spoken. For one must persist in asking for the same things, but not through the abundance of things asked for indiscriminately asking for glory or wealth and the like, rather only for what benefits the soul.”

Thank you. This is what I was looking for.
Sarah Wilkinson
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