Mislabelled manuscript?

Forum rules
Please quote the Greek text you are discussing directly in your post if it is reasonably short - do not ask people to look it up. This is not a beginner's forum, competence in Greek is assumed.
Post Reply
Alan Bunning
Posts: 299
Joined: June 5th, 2011, 7:31 am
Contact:

Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Alan Bunning »

I posted the following on the New Testament Textual Criticism facebook page, and thought I would post it here in case someone here can help:

I am having trouble tracking down what appears to be a mislabeled manuscript that could be from as early as 300 AD and may be a possible candidate to receive a GA number. It is LDAB 2926 http://www.trismegistos.org/ldab/text.php?tm=61774 , Trismegistos #61774, Van Haelst 0390. These databases as well as the original publication list the manuscript as containing Mark 6:11-12, but the Greek portion clearly contains Luke 11:27, 30-31. The reason why I suspect the manuscript might need a GA number is that the Greek portion on the recto seems to be continuous text. I don’t know what the Coptic portion contains, but from what I can tell it does not contain either Mark 6 or Luke 11, although perhaps it contains a reference to one of those passages. Does anyone here know Coptic? I emailed Brice Jones but never got a response from him. I am assuming that Van Haelst simply recorded the text as it was mislabeled in the original publication and then the error was repeated in LDAB and Trismegistos. I searched the INTF database and could not find any manuscript that matched these verses.

The original publication is from “Memoires publiés par les membres de la Mission archéologique française au Caire” 1889 (MMAF) with an article written by Urbain Bouriant called “Rapport Au Ministre De L’Instruction Publique Sur Une Mission Dans La Haute-Egypte (1884-1885)”. On page 406 he describes fragment 9 which I have included.

My best guess is that the manuscript is currently being held somewhere in the archives of Institut français d’archéologie orientale (http://www.ifao.egnet.net/). I emailed them twice about it but never got a response back. Can anyone here shed more light on this manuscript?
image.jpg
image.jpg (78.79 KiB) Viewed 1292 times
Jonathan Robie
Posts: 4165
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Jonathan Robie »

Have you tried contacting Mark Depauw <Mark.Depauw@kuleuven.be>, who leads http://www.trismegistos.org/? If he doesn't know, he would probably know how to find out.
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/
Stephen Hughes
Posts: 3323
Joined: February 26th, 2013, 7:12 am

Re: Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Stephen Hughes »

The 6:11,12 reference is correct for the Coptic in the second column (beginning from the 3rd line of actual writing), but it is John not Mark from whose Gospel it is taken.

There is a transcription error in the Coptic as printed there; The first "word" of the fourth line of the second column of the Coptic is actually 2 words. What is printed there as ΙΟ, is actually the abbreviation for the name - ΙΣ (written with a lunate sigma).
Γελᾷ δ' ὁ μωρός, κἄν τι μὴ γέλοιον ᾖ
(Menander, Γνῶμαι μονόστιχοι 108)
Alan Bunning
Posts: 299
Joined: June 5th, 2011, 7:31 am
Contact:

Re: Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Alan Bunning »

Someone was able to identify it as Paris, BnF Copte 129(9), f. 96 which is said to be dated to the 8th century. Waiting to see if it should be assigned a new GA number.
Jonathan Robie
Posts: 4165
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 5:34 pm
Location: Durham, NC
Contact:

Re: Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Jonathan Robie »

Alan Bunning wrote:Someone was able to identify it as Paris, BnF Copte 129(9), f. 96 which is said to be dated to the 8th century. Waiting to see if it should be assigned a new GA number.
If that someone wants to tell us how they were able to identify it, I'd love to know!
ἐξίσταντο δὲ πάντες καὶ διηποροῦντο, ἄλλος πρὸς ἄλλον λέγοντες, τί θέλει τοῦτο εἶναι;
http://jonathanrobie.biblicalhumanities.org/
Stephen Hughes
Posts: 3323
Joined: February 26th, 2013, 7:12 am

Re: Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Stephen Hughes »

ΟΥΩΜ in the first column of the verso (Coptic) is the Coptic word for "eat", which is in John 6:5. That might be a first stop logical choice, but I am wondering whether it is Psalm 21:27, φάγονται πένητες καὶ ἐμπλησθήσονται καὶ αἰνέσουσιν κύριον οἱ ἐκζητοῦντες αὐτόν ζήσονται αἱ καρδίαι αὐτῶν εἰς αἰῶνα αἰῶνος, which has a verbal allusion in the Gospel account, is a better fit or not?
Γελᾷ δ' ὁ μωρός, κἄν τι μὴ γέλοιον ᾖ
(Menander, Γνῶμαι μονόστιχοι 108)
Alan Bunning
Posts: 299
Joined: June 5th, 2011, 7:31 am
Contact:

Re: Mislabelled manuscript?

Post by Alan Bunning »

Jonathan Robie wrote:
Alan Bunning wrote:Someone was able to identify it as Paris, BnF Copte 129(9), f. 96 which is said to be dated to the 8th century. Waiting to see if it should be assigned a new GA number.
If that someone wants to tell us how they were able to identify it, I'd love to know!
Alin Suci found it who is a researcher who is apparently acquainted with the holdings in Paris. Jan Graefe has since been able to identify it as GA l1741 and sa 347L in the SMR database. Now Trismegistos/LDAB should probably be notified so that they can correct the mistake and update their records. Thanks for everyone's help in getting it tracked down!
Post Reply

Return to “New Testament”