[B-Greek] English Grammar as a Prerequisite to Learning Greek?

Hirokatsu Yoshihara likeluke at bg8.so-net.ne.jp
Thu Dec 11 10:23:47 EST 2003


Maurice


Speaking from my experiences of 1) traning Japanese people who wanted to
be teachers of the Japanese language as the second language, 2) working
together with English teachers who were teaching in Japan with the only
qualification that they were native speakers, and 3) myself, a native
Japanese speaker, having been formally trained as a linguist specialized
in my own mother tongue, it always seems quite difficult for a native
speaker to be well trained in analyzing his/her own native language
UNLESS one has had a good quality of education on it at any level from
elementary to college.

Even in my multinational class of Biblical Greek, only Amerian students
find it difficult to understand Mounce's explanations on English
grammar from the beginning till the end. Other students, who are mostly
Asians and had to study English as their second or third language, can
easily compare English and Greek. (By the way, I have found a lot of
linguistically awkward or inconsistent explanations in Mounce when he
explains English, again, his own mother tongue).

Therefore, though it may be true, as you have pointed out, that recent
textbooks have more pages on English grammar probably because of certain
unpleasant decline of the first language education for native English
speakers, the situation is not really new but inherent to the human
nature.

To most native English speakers, learning a classical language such as
Greek is simultaneously a process of finding English, their own mother
tongue, afresh. In fact, John F. Collins, in my favorite textbook of
ecclesiastical Latin, says:

"Learning ecclesiastical Latin has two bonuses for the student. Recent
studies have shown that the formal analysis of a highly structured
language such as Latin gives the student an improved understanding of
the purposes and possibilities of language and greatly advances his
ability to write and speak effectively . . . Thus the study of
ecclesiastical Latin, while an enjoyable and profitable study in itself,
looks back to the improvement of English . . ." (p. v)

I have no intention to attack your thesis. I totally agree on your
statement that it is difficult for one to learn Greek without
understanding the language in which his/her textbook is written. I just
wanted to add and suggest that not many will be ready to learn Greek if
they first have to have a good grasp of their own mother tongues. It is
perhaps more practical for a teacher to encourage his/her students to
learn the medium language (English, in our discussion) afresh than to
cry for their lack of knowledge on it.

Sincerely


==========
Hirokatsu Yoshihara <likeluke at bg8.so-net.ne.jp>
Asia Pacific Theological Seminary, Baguio City, Philippines
December 11, 2003 (Thurs) 22:58 +0800



----------------------- Original Message -----------------------
From:    "Maurice A. O'Sullivan" <mauros at iol.ie>
To:      "Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu>
Date:    Thu, 11 Dec 2003 10:47:54 +0000
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] oudeis
----

| At 00:39 11/12/2003, Carl W. Conrad wrote:
| 
| >Who's "we"? The expression "none of them" in Greek is just as it is in
| >English: singular pronoun with a dependent partitive genitive. "None" in
| >English is singular, so the Greek OUDEIS AUTWN just like TIS AUTWN.
| 
| Carl:
| Is it any wonder that text books on Greek, etc nowadays have to have up to 
| 40 pages on the elements of _ENGLISH_ grammar, as a necessary introduction?
| 
| If one cannot analyze one's own native language, what hope is there of 
| doing so in a "foreign" language?
| 
| Regards,
| 
| Maurice
| 
| 
| Maurice A. O'Sullivan
| [Bray, Ireland]
| mauros at iol.ie
| 
| "Mere description is impossible. Language forces you to an implicit
| comment." C.S. Lewis
| 
| 
| ---
| B-Greek home page: http://metalab.unc.edu/bgreek
| B-Greek mailing list
| B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
| http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek

--------------------- Original Message Ends --------------------





More information about the B-Greek mailing list