John 20:31 was Re: [B-Greek] Phil 2:11
Stephen C. Carlson
scarlson at mindspring.com
Fri Oct 17 13:53:01 EDT 2003
Doug Hoxworth <dhoxworth at charter.net> wrote:
>perhaps this may not add anything substantial to the
>discussion but just to throw it out considering the "rule"
>of the articles, how should the following be translated?
Before getting to the examples, I would like to clarify that
I certainly did not want to give out the impression that rules
have no exceptions. I've been studying language too long
to believe that. That's why I had asked for clear counter-
examples to the principle being applied in distinguishing the
(articular) subject from the (nonarthrous) predicate noun.
It is by working through the (apparent) counterexamples
that we can appreciate the correction or operation of the
rules people formulate to explain how the language works.
As for not explaining other English translations being "wrong,"
the scope of this list is the meaning of the Greek. Translations
have a variety of goals in addition to communicating the sense
of the Greek (e.g., clarity, style, reading level, dialect, continuity
of the English Bible tradition, etc.), and many of these goals are
considered more important than transmitting the grammatical
structures of the Greek.
In a case like John 20:31, both sides of the ESTIN are individuals,
and they are being equated, regardless of what the subject and
predicate noun are. It is this semantic equation between Jesus
and the Christ that gives translations the flexibility to meet their
other goals. Now, their other goals are not necessarily the same
as mine, such as knowing the subtle emphases of the Greek. In
fact, I began studying Greek 20 years ago because I wanted
different things than what English translations usually deliver.
>John 5:15 ...hOTI IHSOUS ESTIN hO POIHSAS AUTON hUGIH
Here, hO POIHSAS AUTON hUGIH is the subject, IHSOUS is in
the predicate, so roughly "... that the one who made him healthy
was Jesus." Alternatively, if it is felt that the cadence of the
English does not emphasize Jesus as strongly as the Greek
suggests, one could use move the subject to the end, putting
it in apposition: "... that it was Jesus who made him healthy."
>John 6:42 ...OUX OUTOS ESTIN IHSOUS hO UIOS IWSHF
"... isn't this Jesus, the son of Joseph?"
>John 19:19 ...IHSOUS hO NZAWRAIOS hO BASILEUS TWN IOUDAIWN
Not a sentence, but "Jesus the Nazorean, the King of the Jews."
Hope this helps. Only John 5:15 probes the rule.
Stephen Carlson
--
Stephen C. Carlson,
mailto:scarlson at mindspring.com
"Poetry speaks of aspirations, and songs chant the words." Shujing 2.35
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