[B-Greek] First Corinthians 14:18

Glendon Gross gross at xinetd.com
Wed Sep 24 11:43:26 EDT 2003


One thing that helped me here is that my French textbook, when studying in
Geneva at L'Ecole Moser, was called
"Cours de langue et de civilization Francais".  (please forgive the lack of
correct accents due to my keyboard configuration.)
Well, as a 13 year old I had to ask,  "What does 'langue' mean?  Well, the
obvious answer is "tongue".... yet not "tongue" in the sense
of "a part of the body".  So that insight I gained as a 13 year old has greatly
helped me avoid theological confuson regarding  Paul's use of
the Greek word.   If my French textbook had been a study in anatomy, that would
have allowed for a different interpretation.

Regards,

Glendon Gross
Amateur Greek Student



Mark Wilson wrote:

> Carl wrote:
>
> > >All it says is "more than you all." It probably does NOT mean that he
> >speak
> > >more languages inasmuch as the "tongue-speaking" under discussion here
> > >would seem, from the immediate context of 1 Cor 12-14 to refer to
> >ecstatic
> > >speech as a religious phenomenon rather than to the languages of human
> > >culture.
>
> I find it hard to believe that THIS is moving into theological discussions.
> Clearly one must translate/interpret what is going here. Carl, in my
> opinion, has chosen a way of understanding
> the Greek text. He indicates that this tongues speaking "would seem" to be
> ecstatic speech,
> not that IT IS. One must come to an understanding of what this speaking in
> languages is when
> wrestling with the Greek text only. Or, are we to leave it in its Greek form
> and pretend we
> cannot translate it?
>
> Iver has indicated that the adverb modifies the verb and therefore it cannot
> mean that
> one speaks "more languages." This is NOT at all true. It does modify
> speaking, of course,
> but that says nothing as to whether or not the speaking is look upon with
> frequency
> or number of languages. Since GLWSSA is plural, we already know that there
> are MORE THAN
> ONE LANGUAGE being referenced. Paul tells us that there are many kinds of
> languages,
> hETERWi GENH GLWSSWN. So, yes, the understanding that Paul speaks more
> species (GENH)
> of languages than others makes perfect sense grammatically.
>
> Carl said it "probably" doesn't refer to number of languages because of his
> understanding
> of GLWSSA. Iver says it does not refer to number of languages because the
> adverb modifies
> the verb, "not the noun." But Mitch's question was "can" it mean both, and
> the answer is Yes.
>
> I may be out of line here, but I think we all need to grow up a little. One
> can not respond
> to any post without some predisposition toward the Greek text. Mentioning,
> in passing, an understanding one has of the Greek text, such as "ecstatic
> speech," is not entering into theological
> discussions. We all knew what Carl meant. He was not peddling some theology.
> If you ask me, we
> can't keep pretending that we can be totally objective in this forum. Having
> said that, I AM all for
> keeping theological discussion out of this forum!
>
> And finally, we all know when someone crosses the line into peddling some
> theological position.
>
> Oh well, just venting.
>
> Mark Wilson
>
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