[B-Greek] Caution: AGAPAO in the NT

Carl W. Conrad cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
Fri Feb 6 05:42:03 EST 2004


In my judgment this thread has passed beyond discussion of the Greek text
into discussion of background issues which are inappropriate for list
discussion. If there is any further discussion of FILEW and AGAPAW, that
would be appropriate, but I am asking that any further discussion of these
background issues concerning the identity of BD and the author of the
Gospel of John be conducted OFF-LIST or taken to the Johannine Literature
list for further elaboration:

	http://groups.yahoo.com/group/johannine_literature/messages

At 11:25 PM -0600 2/5/04, Daniel Gleason wrote:
>Kevin Riley: The obvious problem here is that John the Baptist was dead not
>only before the Gospel of John was written, but before much of the action in
>the gospel occurred.  Whatever the link, it can't be that John the Baptist
>is the Beloved Disciple, as the writer definitely identifies himself as the
>BD [21:24].
>
>Hi Kevin
>I agree with you on that point. That's why I said "as impossible as seems."
>Perhaps the problem is theology from the 2nd century till the present.
>Perhaps the three stories in John 21 are not actual reports of historical
>events. I am just analyzing how the gospel and the stories in it are
>structured. John leaves many things unsaid in his accounts where the reader
>has to fill in the words himself. If ones mind is made up that the stories
>are historical, any unsaid word seems obvious to a reader. However, if a
>story is viewed with a totally open mind, as an allegory, the impossible
>becomes plausible. After all, the Greek text does say ...  "Went-forth
>therefore this The Word into the Brothers, that The Disciple would not die."
>(Jn 21:23).
>
>The entire theme of John 21 is about being raised from the dead. I have just
>shown you a verse that links the BD with this theme. Perhaps the unnamed
>disciple is the raised from the dead John the Baptist? An impossible
>conclusion from an impossible story?
>
>Scripture interweaves the imaginative with the historical, sometimes
>introducing what is utterly impossible, sometimes what is possible but never
>occurred.
>Early church father, Origen, Philocolia 1.8

This gets into Hermeneutics, also outside the domain of proper B-Greek
discussion; see the FAQ:

	http://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek/faq.txt
-- 

Carl W. Conrad
Co-Chair, B-Greek List
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/



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