[B-Greek] re: Genitive in 2 Cor 1:5, H GENIKH PTWSIS
Carl W. Conrad
cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
Fri Jun 4 09:33:47 EDT 2004
At 2:45 PM +0200 6/4/04, R Yochanan Bitan Buth wrote:
>E. Mishoe EGRAPSE
>>How can we keep the number of Genitives
>>to a workable size?
>
>By starting with 1.
>
>Then by grouping according to structure rather than by interpretation in
>another language.
>
>E.g., similarly to what Carl did, but a little differently:
>
>1 ONOMA META GENIKOU ONOMATOS [KAI/H ANTWNUMIAS KAI/H EPIQETOU],
> a noun with a genitive noun [inc. pronouns/adjectives](marks possession or
>relationship to be determined by context)
>2 RHMA META GENIKOU ONOMATOS,
> a verb with a genitive noun object (idiomatic to the verb, or less
>affected than an AITIATIKON ONOMA [accusative])
>3 PROQESIS META GENIKOU ONOMATOS,
> a preposition with a genitive noun (idiomatic to the preposition)
>4 GENIKON META METOXHS
> a genitive with a participle (this is most frequently an adverbial use of
>the genitive mentioned immediately below, and is traditionally called
>'genitive absolute' in English)
>5 GENIKON "EPIRRHMATWS", META PROTASEWS
> a genitive 'adverbially', with a clause (idiomatic, like TAXEWS 'quickly'.
>The GENIKON META METOXHS above is a common use of this, though usually with
>more than one word)
>
>EPEITA Afterwards (!) someone may profitably subcategorize these by semantic
>structure, especially 1, depending on whether the ONOMATA are animate (human
>and being humanized as a speaker/participant, or non-human), or thing,
>transitive process (e.g., writing, loving, etc., where the genitive may
>refer to either side/end of the process), intransitive process (e.g.,
>walking, growing old), quality (e.g., brightness), thought process (e.g.,
>calculation), result (e.g., victory, defeat [see 'process']), etc. This is
>the legitimate function of someone writing a reference grammar, or of
>someone collecting examples in pedagogical material, though the naming of
>categories is not normally a detailed part of learning a language. It is
>normally part of looking at a language after a foundation is internalized
>and is in extensive use.
>
>
>
>In general, the GENIKH PTWSIS is used where either
>
>(a) the relationship is inferrable from the context, and/or
>
>(b) ambiguity can be tolerated because the main point is elsewhere and the
>writer/speaker did not want to distract from the main point by using extra
>energy to make some relationships specific.
Splendid post, Randall; thank you very much; you have stated much of what I
intended with the far greater finesse of one with linguistic training as
well as a better way with words (both Greek and English) than mine.I think
you've resolved the question I left open in my last response to Iver in
this thread--and you have also clarified the points I ought to have
conceded regarding exegesis of Greek texts involve genitive constructions:
that there are factors that assist reading a context to clarify semantic
implications of genitive-case usage.
>These last two points are very important for properly interpreting a
>message. They are part of what is called 'pragmatics' and 'relevance' within
>linguistic theory. They are a very useful 'rule of thumb' to remind one to
>keep a proper perspective. Greek readers get to enjoy their Greek.
>
>These last two points are also quite tricky for translation into another
>language because clarifying them can skew the focus of a message if care is
>not taken, yet not clarifying them can block a message, or misdirect a
>message. Translators earn their living! And Greek readers get to enjoy their
>Greek.
Tricky indeed; and good translators do indeed earn their living! but the
perils of translation are surely comparable to those of threading a way
between Scylla and Charybdis; hence the old saw TRADUTTORI TRADITORI, which
is to say, translators may give us the goods--or they may surrender the
treasure to the enemy.
>[[Btw. APO THS KRHTHS? OUXI. DIAMENW MEXRI THS KURIAKHS. TA ARNIA
>EUFRAINESQW KAI AGALLIASQW!]]
>
>ERRWSQE
>
>Randall Buth
hO D' EUKOLOS MEN ENQAD', EUKOLOS D' EKEI!
--
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/
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