[B-Greek] Learning Greek, Experiences, and Thoughts

William Zeitler william at faithfulbible.com
Tue Mar 1 23:06:42 EST 2005


In other words, 'left-brain' vs. 'right-brain' learning. The complete person
uses BOTH halves of their branes! Alas, not so easy with ancient languages,
as you point out.

:-)

william zeitler

-----Original Message-----
From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org]On Behalf Of Eric Inman
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 7:20 PM
To: bendersa at earthlink.net
Cc: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: RE: [B-Greek] Learning Greek, Experiences, and Thoughts


Interesting thoughts. Thanks for sharing them. One concept that I've found
helpful in learning skills in language as well as in music, athletics,
programming, etc. is that of "hard mastery" versus "soft mastery." Hard
mastery tends to involve learning from books, rules and the like. Soft
mastery tends to involve learning by "feel" and from experience, etc. You
can google for more information on this. Each approach seems to provide
insights not available from the other, and so a combination seems to be
best. In Indonesia I once was wondering how I was going to figure out the
rules for using a certain feature in their language, and then it occurred to
me that I really didn't need to worry about it, since in a few weeks I would
just be doing it. Sure enough, that was the case. Our grammars, lexicons,
etc. can only document what we've been able to become consciously aware of,
yet language is largely subconscious, so sometimes we just need to let our
subconscious have at it. The opportunities for soft mastery of an ancient
language seem rather limited, however, in comparison with a living language
we can immerse ourselves in.

-----Original Message-----
From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
[mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org]On Behalf Of Amos Bender
Sent: Tuesday, March 01, 2005 7:21 PM
To: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
Subject: [B-Greek] Learning Greek, Experiences, and Thoughts





Amos Bender
bendersa at earthlink.net
Why Wait? Move to EarthLink.

Dear Friends at B Greek,
            I thought I maybe should give a little report on my personal
experience in learning Greek, as it might help someone else.  About a year
ago I started my Greek study.  I now am very thankful that I can listen to
Marilyn Phemister reading the Greek New Testament and can understand a
significant part of what she is reading.  Although in many chapters, I at
this time still cannot get every word and lose the train of thought, yet in
those chapters which I have studied and listened to repeatedly, I can
basically understand everything she is reading.  I have learned she reads
very well and with very good expression.  I am simply thrilled to hear the
Word of God being read in Greek, and often thrilled to discover how the same
message can be spoken in such a very different manner!
In my Greek study I have found the following study aids and methods to be
very helpful.  Zondervan has a nice CD set available whereon Jonathan T.
Pennington reads all the Greek words that appear 10 times or more in the NT,
and therewith gives the definition of the words.  With that program is
included a small booklet of the Greek words and definitions which he is
reading.  I in using Zondervan's program further filmed the Greek words as
he was reading them with my camcorder and transferred this to my VCR so now
as I work in my small business (which often requires little thought) I can
see the actual Greek text on my VCR screen as he reads it.  Repeatedly
listening to him reading these Greek words with their definitions, while
also being able at a glance to see the actual Greek text on my VCR screen
has helped me a lot in getting very familiar with the words.  Yet one must
not only get very familiar with the individual words, but must also get very
familiar with the language
 by repeatedly hearing these words being read in sentences.
I while listening to Marilyn Phemister read in the Greek New Testament,
filmed the verses she was reading in my English Bible, and transferred this
to my VCR, so while she is reading in Greek I can look on my VCR Screen and
see what she is reading in English.  This also can help a lot, as when one
gets behind or loses the train of thought, he can simply look at the VCR
screen and see the English version of what is being read, which very much
can help one get back on the train of thought.  If someone wants copies of
this I might be able to provide them, as Marilyn Phemister kindly allows
copies of her Greek Bible reading.
What really helped me in my endeavor to understand Greek by ear, was I at
first listened to those Bible chapters which I was very familiar with, and
thus while hearing them being read only had to catch the Greek way of saying
what I already knew was in that chapter.  Yet even then it took much
repeated listening, to start to catch the Greek by ear alone.  Note,
learning to understand Greek by ear alone, also has greatly helped me learn
to read Greek text, as the written words then make sense just like the audio
words do.  I at first in trying to learn Greek, felt sort of bad as I felt I
had to sacrifice Bible study and knowledge to try to learn Greek, but now I
am thankful that I in listening to Greek Scriptures being read, can
significantly review the Bible and learn Greek at the same time.  I started
to be able to understand a few Greek Scriptures by ear, about two months
ago.  I now like to listen to Greek Scriptures being read several hours a
day and the Greek just keeps
 getting clearer.
In learning Greek words, it also has helped me very much to carefully study
an alphabetic list of those Greek words which are used most often in the
Scriptures.  Learning the root words, the prefixes and suffixes, and the
peculiar features about each word is very helpful.  It also has helped me
very much to do lots of reading in my Greek interlinear Bible where I can
see the English text right below the Greek.  It reminded me of learning to
ride a bicycle by using training wheels.  The English words under the Greek
text are the training wheels.  I now am trying to put away the training
wheels, but I still often encounter words that I do not know what they mean.
I have often wished for a Greek study aid where one would sing well known
hymns (choruses) while inserting the corresponding Greek word into the
melody, so the beginning Greek student could automatically know the Greek
words that are being sung by the melody that accompanies them.  Although in
doing this the normal Greek word order would often need to be disregarded
and the English word order rather followed, yet by listening to such music
one could still accurately learn many basic Greek words.  Later after one
has already learned many Greek words, such songs could also be sung
following the normal Greek word order, to thus also teach the student the
normal Greek sentence structure.  If any one knows where this type of music
or singing can be found please let me know.
To me it seems language very much involves both relativity and familiarity.
Concerning "familiarity", one must be familiar enough with the words to
instantly know what they can mean to thus be prepared for the next words as
they are swiftly added.  Concerning "relativity", most words simply very
much need the assistance of the related words about them to reveal their
true meaning.  Without the vital and immediate assistance of the related
words and subject, one quickly gets lost among the individual words.
Although language does consist of individual words, yet language really
consists of special combinations of these words, and which all need to
become a part of one's subconscious mind.
To me it seems quite possible that many Greek students in trying to learn
Greek are required to focus upon many technical principles and details about
Greek and language, while not really getting into actual Greek like they
should or could.  To me it seems quite possible that in times past some who
learned Greek very well, then continued on and discovered many technical
details and principles about the language, and then they in teaching Greek
to beginner students, too much have tried to teach their advanced knowledge
about the language before one even knows the language.  And further one
really does not even need to know those details to learn the language.
I after speaking English for forty years, likely could still take an
advanced English course that would be quite difficult for me to learn and
make me pull my hairs, as some say about learning Greek.  Yet I fear such a
English study might not really help me speak or write English any better,
and might even subtract from simple, common, and understandable English.  I
might start to focus on technical laws of speech and language, rather than
simply trying to use plain speech.  Did William Tyndale, who largely
translated our English Bibles, know all the high tech Greek terms and
aspects many Greek students must learn today?
Concerning learning language, a young child simply cannot communicate with
anyone in this world without learning language, and is totally submersed in
language by his family and friends.  If we were in that setting, with Greek
being spoken by everyone around us and all day long and seven days a week,
and we had no way of communicating without it, we too likely would learn
Greek quite fast.  It obviously doesn't take a great education to learn a
language, or no one could learn to speak until they got that education.
Further to try to learn to speak English by only learning many English words
and many technical principles about these words and without practice and
experience in the language obviously would not work.  Possibly some are too
much trying to learn Greek by memorizing Greek words and by learning
technical principles about the language.
I am very thankful for the wonderful audio and written study aids I have
found to help learn Greek.  Yet even with the wonderful study aids I have
incorporated in learning Greek, it has taken me tremendous effort to gain
what I have gained.  Although I am encouraged with what I have gained, I
sure wish I knew Greek better.  Feel free to email me at
Bendersa at earthlink.net.  Your helpful thoughts are very welcome.  God Bless.

Amos Bender
Minerva, Ohio



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