[B-Greek] KAN in John 11:25b

Beata Urbanek baurbanek at op.pl
Fri Mar 11 03:59:02 EST 2005



> >> At 10:45 PM +0100 3/10/05, Beata Urbanek wrote:
> >> >Hello
> >> >
> >> >hO PISTEUWN EIS EME KAN APOQANH ZHSETAI
> >> >
> >> >Forgive me if it ist not exactly B-Greek question, but I really got
> >stuck.
> >> >I can't understand why Barret insists that KAN means 'even if' and not
> >> >'though'. What's the diffrerence? Aren't they both concessive?
> >> >BDF says that KAN can be purely conditional (and if) or concessive (if
> >> >only, even if).
> >> >What does it mean here?
> >> >1. if he dies
> >> >2. even if he dies
> >> >3. even though he dies
> >> >And does APOQANH refer to the future or present/general?
> >>
> >> (1) KAN is a contraction for KAI EAN, and in the construction it really
> >has
> >> to mean "even if," in my opinion.
> >> (2) This is clearly a future condition: the apodosis is in the future
> >> indicative (ZHSETAI); the protasis is in the aorist subjective and
refers
> >> to the indefinite future: "Even if he/she ever should die, he/she will
> >> live."
> >> --
> >>
> >> Carl W. Conrad
> >> Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
> >> 1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
> >
> >Thanks a lot, Dr Conrad. Would you (or somebody else from the list) be so
> >kind and explain to me the difference between 'even if' and 'even
though'?
> >Is the first one 'more conditional' and the seconr 'more concessive'? If
we
> >translate 'even if' does that mean that not everyone has to die and when
we
> >say 'though' it is taken for granted that everyone dies?
> >[I did check my understanding of the English words].
>
> There's not really any great difference at all in Hellenistic usage,
> although I think earlier Greek would have used K'AN more strictly in a
> conditional sense; I think that any preference for using "even though" and
> seeing it as concessive derives from interpreting the ZHSETAI as
> adversitive: "even so--yet--will he/she live." The possibility that the
> believer will die is considered as remote but not as affecting the
> certainty of ZHSETAI. Some of this may have to do with the special
> characteristics of Johannine "realized" eschatology, but this is NOT the
> forum for any discussion of that.
> -- 
>
> Carl W. Conrad
> Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
> 1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
> cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu
> WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/

Thanks. I do not want to discuss eschatology here. But I've got one extra
question of which I forgot yesterday.
Can we say on base on Greek language itself what the meaning of ZHSETAI in
this sentence is? Is it: 'continue to live' or 'come back to life'?

Beata Urbanek




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