[B-Greek] APO KATABOLHS KOSMOU in Rev 13:8 and 17:8
Albert & Julia Haig
albert_and_julia at yahoo.com.au
Tue Nov 8 23:10:56 EST 2005
This debate seems to have diverged into several
streams, some of which are off-limits, and I can't
respond to what has been posted. However, let me make
some final comments on the grammatical issues that
have been raised.
As to the claim that GEGRAPTAi refers to a state to
the exclusion of the process which, when completed,
brought that state into existence. This, it seems to
me, is clearly refuted by various examples in which a
clause introduced by a preposition following GEGRAPTAi
refers to the process of the writing. For instance:
GAR GEGRAPTAi DIA TOU PROFHTOU (Mat. 2:5)
The phrase DIA TOU PROFHTOU, it seems to me, quite
clearly refers to the process of the writing, not the
completed state of the writing. So there can be no in
principle objection to interpreting APO KATABOLHS
KOSMOU in this way in Rev 13:8 & 17:8, with the sense
"since the foundation of the world", as in Luke 11:50
& Heb 9:26.
Some have argued that APO KATABOLHS KOSMOU in 13:8
doesn't modify GEGRAPTAI but KATOIKOUNTES. I don't
agree, but that wasn't the point I was raising to
discuss. If you are strongly convinced of that point,
then I would agree with you that APO KATABOLHS KOSMOU,
at least in 13:8, must mean that the lamb was slain at
the foundation of the world, because the slaying of a
lamb is a one-off event, and not something that
conceivably could be spread over a long period of
time. But since I don't agree with the claim that this
phrase is connected with the slaying of the lamb, this
objection, from my point of view, is irrelevant. Even
if true, the fact that APO KATABOLHS KOSMOU has the
sense "from the foundation of the world" in one part
of a text, does not imply that it has to have that
meaning elsewhere - compare the use of the phrase in
Heb 9:26, where it clearly means "since the foundation
of the world", with its use in Heb 4:3, where it
apparently means "at or from the foundation of the
world".
As far as I can see, that deals with all the strictly
grammatical arguments that have been advanced against
the reading I suggested.
Dr Albert Haig.
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