[B-Greek] interlinears

Harry Jones hjbluebird2002 at yahoo.com
Wed Dec 20 12:09:37 EST 2006


Hello All,
   
  I wonder who on the list can read the GNT completely unaided?
   
  Best Regards,
   
  Harry Jones

"Carl W. Conrad" <cwconrad at artsci.wustl.edu> wrote: 
  
On Dec 20, 2006, at 6:24 AM, CTCE wrote:

> Carl W. Conrad wrote:
>
> FWNH BOWNTOS EN THi ERHMWi (MHDE TOU BAPTISTOU):
>
> There are some topics that recur on this list on a regular basis ad
> nauseam. One of them is the "right" pronunciation of Biblical Greek,
> another is the utility of interlinears and/or parsing guides. I
> really think those who have been reading B-Greek posts for a few
> months know very well just who thinks what about these issues. I have
> my own opinions about them that I have expressed in the past, and
> it's occurred to me that one might even compose a "stationery"
> message on one of these topics and send it when the occasion arises
> anew. But I won't. What I haven't seen in these recurrent threads is
> any indication that anybody's convictions regarding these matters
> have been changed by the kinds of arguments adduced for one side or
> another of them.
>
> Dr. Conrad,
>
> I think you misunderstand the response of the true-believers. They 
> are not out to convert the true-believers of the other camp, rather 
> they are attempting to sell their model to the un-committed, the 
> inquirer.
>
> In pronunciation, there are three models: the COIN KNEE, the KEY 
> KNEE, and the BUTH modified KEY KNEE. The responders are barkers, 
> attempting to show why their model is better, etc.
>
> I do not have much to say about interlinears, for us beginners the 
> "old man" isn't around, he will not take off the training wheels. 
> Changing my metaphor, if one has the where-with-all, the self- 
> discipline to strengthen your muscles, then use the crutch and when 
> you are strong enough, get up and through that crutch away. But if 
> you do not have that grit and you think you will become addicted to 
> the crutch, then don't use it.
>
> These questions will not go away, at least I think we would hope 
> they do not go away, because they come from individuals who are 
> interested in learning the language, they want to know how to 
> being. If you do not want to take up space in this area, then set 
> up a show room, another section where those who have an opinion can 
> set up the displays, their reasons for using this model or that 
> model. Then when someone inquires, you can direct them to that 
> show room, where they can browse and choose at there leisure.
>
> John Sanders
> Suzhou, China

Thank you, John, for a THOUGHTFUL contribution to this round of 
exchanges on this topic. It is refreshing to read comments that are 
something other than the knee-jerk one-line reminders that so-and-so 
still opines about interlinears as he or she always has opined hitherto.

Less than quite seriously: I think if we see "stationery" responses 
on pronunciation, interlinears, and the like, the moderators might 
very well agree that such responses constitue SPAM and act 
accordingly to protect the list from such (30-40+ pieces of spam 
every day are filtered out of our incoming B-Greek messages -- the 
problem of moderation is trying to be sure that what's NOT spam gets 
through to the list). Another way of dealing with the knee-jerkers 
might be to adapt a procedure that has been adopted on the Classics-L 
list: fatigue and nausea over political flame-wars has led to a rule 
that any messages concerning political matters must be written in 
Latin. I think we might comparably insist on B-Greek that comments on 
interlinears and the right pronunciation of Koine Greek be composed 
in Koine Greek -- but only Randall Buth would be able to say 
anything, so I guess that wouldn't be fair.

I've voiced my opinions about interlinears -- and about pronunciation 
of Koine Greek -- too many times. But a point related to those 
matters (somewhat, at least) is one I have attempted to say less 
often: all of us, from the novice who's just learned the Greek 
alphabet and is struggling somehow to vocalize the written Greek 
words in a textbook to someone like myself who have confronted the 
challenges of ancient Greek language and literature for half a 
century, all of us are subject to the illusion or delusion that we 
understand the Greek text under consideration better than we probably 
do understand it. I believe that we are all prone to error and 
misunderstanding; I used to think that beginners were more vulnerable 
than those who have worked with ancient Greek texts for many years, 
but I have, over the years, become increasingly cognizant that I 
myself am wrong on a Greek issue that I've been confident about for 
ages and that beginners may not infrequently teach their teachers 
something about ancient Greek never before quite understood. In fact, 
one of the most gratifying aspects of teaching ancient Greek to me 
was that I found every semester of it a learning experience myself. I 
still do not think there is any "royal road" to competence in ancient 
Greek, but by the same token, those of us who have trod the dirt 
paths and gravel and paved roads of ancient Greek for years are still 
often moving uphill and into unfamiliar terrain. I think that it ill 
behooves any of us who "deal" in ancient Greek to put on airs and 
look down our noses at those who are earnestly endeavoring to read 
ancient Greek texts but are not walking on the same pathways that we 
have chosen.

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad2 at mac.com
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/


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