[B-Greek] A question of meaning

Carl W. Conrad cwconrad at ioa.com
Mon Jan 9 17:04:52 EST 2006


On Jan 9, 2006, at 4:54 PM, Joe Hightower wrote:
>
> Thank you for correcting two mistakes.  Yes the spelling is wrong,  
> that
> is what I get for trying to double task.  And yes the Galatians  
> passage
> uses the noun.
>
> The second reference in the Galatians passage is the first word in  
> verse
> 21 - FQONOS which the NIV translates as envy.  That actually makes  
> error
> number three on my part since I said that the word ZHLOW (ZHLOS)
> referred to envy, the NIV translates this a Jealousy in Vs 20

FWIW, my own opinion of the Gal 5:19-21 passage is that these terms  
are not intended to be precise and comprehensive listing of distinct  
conceptions of ALL of TA ERGA THS SARKOS but rather a suggestive list  
to show what hH SARX ERGAZEI. Certainly ZHLOS in this list must refer  
to ill-will or covetousness. FQONOS might be translated "envy" but it  
can be "spite" -- a characteristic motif of archaic Greek literature  
is the FQONOS TWN QEWN, the spite of the gods directed at human  
beings who get "too big for their britches." I just don't think that  
the items in that Gal 5 list should be so sharply differentiated.

> I think that your explanation makes sense.  That would help explain
> distinction between jealousy that has a good purpose and jealousy that
> has a bad.  The good jealousy seeks to protect, to keep secure,  
> both for
> the sake of the one who is jealous and for the sake of that which they
> seek to protect.  Envy is more difficult, to see.  There is a negative
> to envy, but there does not seem to a positive to desiring what my
> neighbor has.  The ill-will is expressed in the former, but the latter
> would be a zealous desire to defend what my neighbor has.
>
> Based on this, you seem to be indicating that the 1 Corinthians  
> passage
> is more focused on the negative side of expressing ill-will regardless
> of whether it is towards what another has or towards keeping what I
> have.
>
> But how does this distinction help with the Galatians passage where  
> the
> two ideas appear to be treated distinctly separately?

As I've indicated, I apparently look at the Gal passage differently  
from you.

> One note, the BADG definition alone does not make any reference to the
> desire to keep for oneself (jealousy).  It is focused on what someone
> else has.  I do not have my references in front of me, but I found the
> reference to this meaning in at least one other lexicon.  Also, I  
> recall
> reading a passage from Josephus where he describes Herod's jealousy  
> over
> his wife and his position using ZHLOW.

It seems to me that ZHLOS as used in all these passages is  
fundamentally passionate yearning for something; it is negative in  
those instances when it is covetousness of what another is enjoying.  
I rather think you're trying to fine-tune the conception in every  
instance a bit too precisely.

Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Emeritus)
1989 Grindstaff Road/Burnsville, NC 28714/(828) 675-4243
cwconrad2 at mac.com
WWW: http://www.ioa.com/~cwconrad/




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