[B-Greek] Another example of a qualitative QEOS
Rolf Furuli
furuli at online.no
Sun Jul 9 04:01:17 EDT 2006
Dear Kelton,
See my comments below.
----- Original Message -----
From: <kgraham0938 at comcast.net>
To: <B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 09, 2006 12:25 AM
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Another example of a qualitative QEOS
> @Rolf: See below:
> -------------- Original message --------------
> From: "Rolf Furuli" <furuli at online.no>
>
snip
> Response: I also think it is important that we look at the imperfect EIMI
> in verse 1. I remember you disagreeing with the evangelical
> interpretation in your book but I have not read your book in a number of
> years and cannot remember your response so if you have already addressed
> this I apologize. But as you know the typical view is that since this
> EIMI is imperfect this illustrates that the LOGOS was with the Father from
> eternalty, this relationship would help explain in what since this LOGOS
> is MONOGENHS. In otherwords, how is this LOGOS unique? He is unique
> with respect to his existance from eternalty along with his relationshp
> with the Father. I hope that was not too theological, kind of hard not to
> go there in dealing with this particular text. Another issue that I don't
> know if you addressed already is EIMI vs GINOMAI, it appears that Jn is
> contrasting everything that was created to the LOGOS which 'was already.'
RF:
To say that the imperfect of EIMI shows that LOGOS "was with the Father from
eternality" betrays a misunderstanding of the Greek aspects. The text only
says that LOGOS existed "in the beginning," and whether or not this
"beginning" is the beginning of the universe is a matter of interpretation.
I see no reason to accept Plato´s idea (Timaeus 38) that time came into
being with the heavens".
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> Rolf:> MONOGENHS. M. J. Harris "Jesus as God: The New Testament use of
> Theos in
>> Reference to Jesus" (1992) refers to seven translations and and nine
>> commentators who take MONOGENHS as a substantivized adjective (giving the
>> rendering "God, the only Son" or something similar). He refers to one
>> Bible
>> translation and sixteen commentators who take MONOGENHS as an adjective
>> that
>> qualifies QEOS (giving the rendering a/the onlybegotten/unique God" or
>> something similar), and he refers to two translations and fifteen
>> commentators who in different ways avoid using MONOGENHS as an adjective
>> qualifying QEOS, (giving the rendering "the only One, who is the same as
>> God" or something similar).
>
>
>
> Response: Not to play devil's advocate but how do you feel about Gal 3:9?
> TWi PISTWi ABRAAM is it not possible to take this to be Abraham, the one
> who believed?
RF: I take the phrase to mean "the faithful Abraham"; the adjective modifies
the noun. I see no reason for taking it differently.
> ---------------------------------------------------------
snip
> --------------------------------------
>>
>> On the background of the use of adjectives that precedes nouns in the NT,
>> in
>> 1:18 we have a passage that can help us decide the meaning of the word
>> QEOS
>> in 1:1c. The adjective MONOGENHS can hardly qualify a quality, but it
>> naturally qualifies a generic count noun. Thus "a unique/onlybegotten
>> god"/"the unique/onlybegotten god" justifies the rendering "a god" in
>> 1:1c.
>> A footnote, or an appendix discussing 1:1c with some of this would be
>> very
>> fine.
>>
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> Rolf Furuli
>> University of Oslo
>
>
>
> Response: But if we are linking this verse back to verse 1, and we are
> taken the EIMI verb here to represent hO LOGOS existing from eternalty
> then this being is not apart of a class of sons or gods but unique with
> regard to his relationship with hO PATER.
RF
As already mentioned, EIMI alone does not signal eternality; this is a
theological and not a linguistic argument.
> --
> Kelton Graham
> KGRAHAM0938 at comcast.net
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Best regards,
Rolf Furuli
University of Oslo
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