[B-Greek] Phil 1:29

yancywsmith yancywsmith at sbcglobal.net
Mon Jun 26 15:01:49 EDT 2006


I inserted "the opportunity" because of the naturalness of the phrase  
in English "to give some one the opportunity to do something." It  
isn't so natural to say, "to you has been granted to believe, etc."  
So, the grammatical reason for inserting it is a target language  
reason, not a Greek grammar reason. In Greek "to you can be granted  
to do something or the other" in English we usually give someone a  
chance/opportunity to do something or the other. I think the  
theological pay dirt is in the verb ECARISQH, in effect, God had  
granted them grace not only to believe but to suffer. BTW, I don't  
think "a grand opportunity has been given" is not a bad translation  
of ECARISQH is not too far off the mark.

BTW, I garbled my previous answer, it should have read
> Infinitives are used either adverbially (purpose, result or something
> like that) or as nominals (subject, adjective, object, object of a
> preposition). In this case, both infinitives TO ... PISTEUEIN and
> TO ... PASCEIN are being used as nouns, specifically as appositonal
> extensions of the subject of the passive verb ECARISQH, which is this
> case is TO hUPER CRISTON. Neither of the infinitives is the object of
> the prepositions EIS and hUPER, rather, AUTON and
AUTOU
> are the
> objects of these prepositions. So, a pony translation would be: "To
> you has been granted the [following thing] on behalf of Christ, [that
> is] not only the in him to believe but also the on behalf of him to
> suffer." Or better English: To you has been granted on behalf of
> Christ, not only [the opportunity] to believe in him but also to
> suffer for him."


Yancy  Smith
yancywsmith at sbcglobal.net
5636 Wedgworth Rd.
Fort Worth, TX 76133
817-361-7565


On Jun 26, 2006, at 1:09 PM, Muz wrote:

> Thanks for the answer.  I see how the TO's are working together,  
> with the last two apparantly being attributive prepositional  
> phrases that have little to do with the infinitives.
>
> One futher question on your translation: Is "the opportunity" a  
> theological insertion or a lexical/grammatical one?
>
> Michael faber
>
> On 6/26/06, yancywsmith <yancywsmith at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> Infinitives are used either adverbially (purpose, result or something
> like that) or as nominals (subject, adjective, object, object of a
> preposition). In this case, both infinitives TO ... PISTEUEIN and
> TO ... PASCEIN are being used as nouns, specifically as appositonal
> extensions of the subject of the passive verb ECARISQH, which is this
> case is TO hUPER CRISTON. Neither of the infinitives is the object of
> the prepositions EIS and hUPER, rather, AUTON and hUPER are the
> objects of these prepositions. So, a pony translation would be: "To
> you has been granted the [following thing] on behalf of Christ, [that
> is] not only the in him to believe but also the on behalf of him to
> suffer." Or better English: To you has been granted on behalf of
> Christ, not only [the opportunity] to believe in him but also to
> suffer for him."
>
> Yancy  Smith
> yancywsmith at sbcglobal.net
> 5636 Wedgworth Rd.
> Fort Worth, TX 76133
> 817-361-7565
>
>
> On Jun 26, 2006, at 7:57 AM, Muz wrote:
>
> > 29  OTI hUMIN ECARISQH TO UPER CRISTOU, OU MONON TO EIS AUTON
> > PISTEUEIN ALLA
> > KAI TO UPER AUTOU PASCEIN.
> >
> > 29  For to you it has been granted for Christ's sake, not only to
> > believe in
> > Him, but also to suffer for His sake
> >
> > I apologize for not having my Wallace/Mounce with me...
> >
> > However, aren't "to believe" and "to suffer" more than simple
> > infinitives?
> > They appear to either be articular infinitives with EIS and UPER
> > prepositions, or articular prepositional phrases.
> >
> > Obviously the latter doesn't make a whole lot of sense...
> >
> > But the former would seem to be better translated "in order that
> > you might
> > believe" and "in order that you might suffer", reflecting a purpose
> > and a
> > result subjunctive feeling that often comes with articular
> > infinitives...
> >
> > Did I miss something?
> >
> > Michael
> > ---
> > B-Greek home page: http://metalab.unc.edu/bgreek
> > B-Greek mailing list
> > B-Greek at lists.ibiblio.org
> > http://lists.ibiblio.org/mailman/listinfo/b-greek
>
>




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