[B-Greek] ARCHES KITSEOS in Mark 10:6 and 2 Pet. 3:4
George F Somsel
gfsomsel at yahoo.com
Fri Jan 19 18:46:12 EST 2007
Mk 10.6
APO DE ARXHS KTISEWS ARSEN KAI QHLU EPOIHSEN AUTOUS
2 Pet 3.4
KAI LEGONTES POU ESTIN hH EPAGGELIA THS PAROUSIAS AUTOU, AF' hHS GAR hOI PATERES EKOIMHQHSAN, PANTA hOUTWS DIAMENEI AP' ARXHS KTISEWS.
That just indicates how you can't rely on any one translation since the RSV and NRSV translate Mk 10.6 as "from the beginning . . ." which would be more in accord with the NIV at 2 Pet 3.4. I can defend the NIV version of Mk 10.4 on the basis that the Bible only speaks of one creation so "from the beginning . . . God made . . . ." might lead one to the conclusion that some continuous creation has taken place. In 2 Pet 3.4, however, it does speak of a continuation of things from a previous point (PANTA hOUTWS DIAMENEI). Yes, context does play an important part in the way one translates, but this list isn't really about translation.
george
gfsomsel
_________
----- Original Message ----
From: David Opderbeck <dopderbeck at gmail.com>
To: b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org
Sent: Friday, January 19, 2007 6:06:33 PM
Subject: [B-Greek] ARCHES KITSEOS in Mark 10:6 and 2 Pet. 3:4
I'm an absolute beginner at learning Greek and was having a conversation
with someone about a phrase in Mark 10:6 and 2 Pet. 3:4.
The Greek formulation is exactly the same in Mark 10 and 2 Peter -- arches
kitseos -- kistseos and arches being in the genitive, and both pasages
include the preposition apo ("from"). Interestingly, the NIV translates the
phrase in Mark 10 as "*at *the beginining of creation" and in 2 Peter
as "*since
*the beginning of creation." As far as I can tell, this difference would be
based on context, not on grammar. Is that right?
"At" sounds much more specific than "since" or "from," which also could be a
meaing of apo. "From the beginning" sounds more general and idiomatic than
"at the beginning," which sounds more precise. Given that the speakers of
this phrase in 2 Peter are the scoffers, this seems to suggest that this
"from / since the beginning" phrase is perhaps idiomatic -- like we might
say, "it's always been this way." In 2 Peter, the scoffers are making a
general idiomatic reference to their (false) belief that human affairs will
never be interrupted by Christ's return, and in Mark 10, Jesus is making a
general idiomatic reference to life-long committment in marriage as part of
the created order. Neither is a specific reference to the order, nature,
etc. of how God acted in bringing about creation.
Does that sound like a reasonable approach to the Greek text here?
--
David W. Opderbeck
Web: http://www.davidopderbeck.com
Blog: http://www.davidopderbeck.com/throughaglass.html
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