[B-Greek] Question about Luke 19:8

Will Dilbeck will.dilbeck at gmail.com
Wed Jan 23 09:31:03 EST 2008


I did some more research and Robertson in his "Greek Grammar in Light of
Historical Research," called it an "aoristic present."  I also consulted
Burton's "Tenses and Moods in The N.T." and he said in reference to the
present tense that it "may be used to describe vividly a future event."  He
then cites further examples of the "present for the future" idea, but doesnt
include Luke 19:8.  He also then defends his view of the present for the
future by saying, "the 'present for the future' is sometimes objected to,
but without good reason...The form which customarily denoted an act in
progress at the time of speaking was sometimes, for the sake of vividness,
used with reference to a fact still in the future, is recognized by all
grammarians."  Most of you may already know this but it has been quite an
education for me!

2008/1/22 Oun Kwon <kwonbbl at gmail.com>:

> 2008/1/22 Carl Conrad <cwconrad2 at mac.com>:
> >
> >
>  > On Jan 22, 2008, at 9:35 AM, Will Dilbeck wrote:
> >
> > > Hello all,
> > >
> > > This is my first post, but I was really perplexed about this.
> > >
> > > The verbs DIDWMI and APODIDWMI are both present active indicative.
> >
> > > However,
> > > the commentators were unanimous in saying that Zaccheus was
> > > demonstrating
> > > repentence here, and basically saying that he was guilty, and that he
> > > intended to pay everyone back.  If this was the case, would the
> > > verbs not be
> > > in the future tense or subjunctive mood?
> >
> > The subjunctive would not be used in any case unless it's in a
> > dependent clause that's dependent upon some other element, as, for
> > example, ARA BOULHi hINA DIDWMI ... "Do you want me to give ...?"  (=
> > "Do you want that i should give ... ").
> >
> > The present tense is not uncommonly used to indicate an intention that
> > is not immediately in process. Compare the English, "I'm going to town
> > today" -- which does not mean that the speaker is currently on the
> > road. If you Englished the Greek of Lk 19:8 as "Hey, I'm giving half
> > of my stuff to the poor, and if I've cheated anyone, I'm giving it
> > back quadruple," would that not be intelligible English to express the
> > intention to carry through with this assertion. This is rather like
> > the administration and politicians talking about the tax rebate
> > they're "putting in our hands" -- sounds like it's coming next week or
> > even today, but don't look for it right away!
> >
> <clipped>
>
> A best commentary on the current Washington scene!
>
> >
> > You pasted the text in, but didn't have the UTF-8 encoding, so it
> > doesn't show up properly. This is precisely why we ask list-members to
> > add a standard BG transliteration. It should be:
> > Luke 19:8 σταθεὶς δὲ Ζακχαῖος εἶπεν πρὸς
> > τὸν κύριον· ἰδοὺ τὰ ἡμίσιά μου τῶν
> > ὑπαρχόντων, κύριε, τοῖς πτωχοῖς
> > δίδωμι, καὶ εἴ τινός τι
> > ἐσυκοφάντησα ἀποδίδωμι τετραπλοῦν.
> > STAQEIS DE ZAKCAIOS EIPEN PROS TON KURION: IDOU TA hHMISIA MOU TWN
> > hUPARCONTWN, KURIE, TOIS PTWCOIS DIDWMI, KAI EI TINOS ESUKOFANHTSA
> > APODIDWMI TETRAPLOUN.
> >
> >
>
> Does EI clause tell us he was admitting the extortion/fraud or denying
> it in a tone of 'if I ~ ever'?
> NET has a footnote saying "This is a first class condition in the
> Greek text. It virtually confesses fraud."  What does it mean 'first
> class trip' on Greek text?
>
> Oun Kwon.
> ---
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