[B-Greek] atelic histrocal present

Elizabeth Kline kline_dekooning at earthlink.net
Fri Apr 10 15:12:17 EDT 2009


On Apr 10, 2009, at 12:47 AM, Randall Buth wrote:


> But I am not claiming that it is iimpossible for a historic present to
> naturally encode to an imperfective, only that that is the norm. I do
> not know of my own knowledge that a story could not begin
> HN DE LEPROS 'there was a leper' . . .
> or that a historic present might be used
> ESTIN DE LEPROS.
> Rijksbaron does make that claim, which needs checking out and
> which would only strengthen my own claim. i.e., that the
> historic present is a rhetorical device of a semantic marker, that
> it uses its semantic marking against the grain for rhetorical
> effect and therefore is ABUSED by the aspect only people when
> they claim that they have no problem whatsoever with an
> no-time whatesoever aspect theory. If Rijksbaron is correct, then
> the historic present is used in cases where both the time and aspect
> are being used rhetorically/pragmatically. If not, then at least the
> majority of cases is a pragmatic play on the aspect and tense, with
> the remaining cases only a play on the tense. In either case, the
> aspect-only/no-tiime people are pulling the wool over
> students eyes', maybe their own, too. They make students
> feel guilty/unsupported by claiming that 30% of Mark's presents
> negate a tense theory but 100% fit an aspect theory. In Hebrew
> we say פויה, whichmight be etymological calque with
> Greek "φευ!", don't know.
>
> Randall Buth

I agree, you really don't need 100% compliance with a rule for it to  
be valid. Using the pattern X does something and then does Y where X  
is in the present tense I found one famous passage where the X verb  
might be atelic. In Jn 1:29  BLEPEI could be analyzed as atelic. Verbs  
of seeing are often atelic according to D. Crystal's definition, i.e.,  
an action without a *clear* terminal point.

John 1:29 Τῇ ἐπαύριον βλέπει τὸν Ἰησοῦν  
ἐρχόμενον πρὸς αὐτὸν καὶ λέγει·  
ἴδε ὁ ἀμνὸς τοῦ θεοῦ ὁ αἴρων τὴν  
ἁμαρτίαν τοῦ κόσμου.

JOHN 1:29 THi EPAURION BLEPEI TON IHSOUN ERCOMENON PROS AUTON KAI  
LEGEI: IDE hO AMNOS TOU QEOU hO AIRWN THN hAMARTIAN TOU KOSMOU.

I might argue that MARTUREI in Jn 1:15 is atelic, representing a  
general activity not a discrete event, but I could also argue the  
other way.

John 1:15 Ἰωάννης μαρτυρεῖ περὶ αὐτοῦ  
καὶ κέκραγεν λέγων· οὗτος ἦν ὃν  
εἶπον· ὁ ὀπίσω μου ἐρχόμενος  
ἔμπροσθέν μου γέγονεν, ὅτι πρῶτός  
μου ἦν.

JOHN 1:15 IWANNHS MARTUREI PERI AUTOU KAI KEKRAGEN LEGWN: hOUTOS HN  
hON EIPON: hO OPISW MOU ERCOMENOS EMPROSQEN MOU GEGONEN, hOTI PRWTOS  
MOU HN.

The semantics of AFIHMI is complex (see Louw&Nida). In Matt. 4:11 it  
could be understood as movement within space which would be telic. It  
could also be understood as "leave him alone" which could be analyzed  
as a state of affairs (atelic).

Matt. 4:11 Τότε ἀφίησιν αὐτὸν ὁ  
διάβολος, καὶ ἰδοὺ ἄγγελοι  
προσῆλθον καὶ διηκόνουν αὐτῷ.

MATT. 4:11 TOTE AFIHSIN AUTON hO DIABOLOS, KAI IDOU AGGELOI PROSHLQON  
KAI DIHKONOUN AUTWi.


Elizabeth Kline







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