[B-Greek] Reading The Philosophers in Greek and other extra Biblcal reading
Carl Conrad
cwconrad2 at mac.com
Fri Feb 27 13:39:52 EST 2009
I'm not sure that these are currently in print, but I would guess that
used copies are available:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
J.A.C.T. Greek Course
A World of Heroes: Selections from Homer, Herodotus and Sophocles
Joint Association of Classical Teachers
Joint Association of Classical Teachers Greek Project
Subject: classical studies
1979 5 1/4 X 8 1/4 152 pp. 5 maps 35 plates
Paperback 0-521-22462-4 $19.95
------------------------------------------------------------------------
J.A.C.T. Greek Course
The Intellectual Revolution: Selections from Euripides, Thucydides and
Plato
Joint Association of Classical Teachers
Designed to take students from "Reading Greek" to wider reading.
Joint Association of Classical Teachers Greek Project
Subject: classical studies
1980 5 1/4 X 8 1/4 172 pp. several tables several
maps
Paperback 0-521-22461-6 $19.95
Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
On Feb 27, 2009, at 8:45 AM, Suttles, Andrew C. (GRC-DSI0) wrote:
> Thanks, Mark. I just wrote someone off-list yesterday and told them
> that your advice is always very helpful (at least to me).
>
> I know there are many on the list who are beginning to intermediate
> koine readers who are always interested in additional resources for
> learning/reading outside the New Testament. As to Plato, do you
> know of any "second year" readers, or any second year readers of any
> Attic author that reference the readings in the work to standard
> grammars like Smyth or Goodwin?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Andrew Suttles
> Cleveland, OH
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org
>> [mailto:b-greek-bounces at lists.ibiblio.org] On Behalf Of Mark Lightman
>> Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 11:51 PM
>> To: B- Greek; Stephen Baldwin
>> Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Reading The Philosophers in Greek and
>> other extra Biblcal reading
>>
>> I found Frank Beetham's Reading Greek with Plato to be very helpful.
>> He presents the entire Greek grammar and then has you read
>> through some of the Meno with lots of notes, with exersises
>> (and an answer key!) that prepare you for the Meno. In his
>> notes he often rearranges Plato to fit normal English word
>> order, which helps.
>>
>> As far as what else to read outside the NT, I bet there is a
>> consenus that the single best thing to read to help your NT
>> Greek is the Apostolic Fathers.
>> Hermas is probably the easiest real Greek I have ever read.
>> It's not great literature or theology but it's long and will
>> help drill your forms and NT vocab and will introduce you to
>> other vocab that you will need. Bauer is the best thing to
>> help you with it, as there are lots of words in the Apostolic
>> Fathers that are not in even the big LSJ and Bauer helps you
>> with some idioms.
>>
>> The other thing I would recommend is Morice's Stories in Attic
>> Greek, if for no other reason than Anne Mahoney's 2006 reprint
>> has the largest Greek font I have ever seen and she prints
>> Morice's notes on the bottom of the page, instead of in the
>> back of the book. These stories are actually a bit tough in
>> terms of the vocab, which is very extensive and includes some
>> rare Greek words, but the syntax is simple by design.
>>
>> Then there is Homer. I have been reading Homer for the last
>> few months. There is one huge drawback to reading Homer and
>> two huge advantages. The drawback is his ridiculously
>> extensive vocablulary. He has two or three or more synonyms
>> for every word you learned in your NT Greek. The guy must
>> have fifteen different words for "noise." I wish there were a
>> Reader's Greek Iliad with all the words that don't appear in
>> the standard textbooks in footnotes, but there is not.
>> The advantages to reading Homer are (1) his syntax is very
>> simple, with parataxis and word order closer to English and
>> (2) his Greek is magnificent.
>> You read a simple sentence and you are struck that every word
>> is perfect.
>> It's just like Shakespeare, beautiful in words, drama, and
>> ideas. I don't know how helpful Homer finally is to my NT
>> Greek, but I don't care. Much of the Greek that we read is
>> uninspired, like Marcus Aurelius, or inelegant translationese
>> like the LXX, or unsteady, like Ignatius, or overly fancy,
>> like Plato. Homer is the only Greek I have ever read outside
>> the early Letters of Paul that leaves me 100% satisfied with
>> the Greek. So I would make it a long term goal to read Homer,
>> but read the Apostolic Fathers first, and don't neglect your
>> re-reading of the NT itself.
>>
>> Mark L
>>
>> --- On Wed, 2/25/09, Stephen Baldwin <stbaldwi at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> From: Stephen Baldwin <stbaldwi at hotmail.com>
>> Subject: [B-Greek] Reading The Philosophers in Greek and other
>> extra Biblcal reading
>> To: "B- Greek" <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
>> Date: Wednesday, February 25, 2009, 7:05 PM
>>
>> Brethren:
>> A marginally off-topic question.
>> In reading theology books, much discussion mentions and quotes
>> the Greek philosophers.
>> I just wondered whether it is idiotic for an amateur Koine
>> minnow to dip into the philosophers (Plato, Socrates etc.) in
>> their original Greek and hope to make anything at all from it?
>> I'm not studying for a PhD or presenting a conference paper.
>> It is more-or-less just for fun.
>>
>> If the idea is not entirely off the wall, are there particular
>> editions aimed at the less competent amongst us?
>>
>> A supplementary question too:
>> When reading the GNT, it is very difficult, once one has fixed
>> the passage, not to guess and assume meanings -- because one
>> is subconsciously hearing the familiar English as one reads
>> the Greek, and anticipating the meaning of the Greek which of
>> course is a capital offence. Reading brand-new stuff is a way
>> round that problem. So I was going to ask: Outside of the GNT,
>> where is a good place to start reading other Koine? I presume
>> the Fathers? Are some easier than others?
>>
>> Rgds
>> Steve Baldwin
>> stbaldwi at hotmail.com
>>
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