[B-Greek] Tranlsating the Imperative: John 4:7
Iver Larsen
iver_larsen at sil.org
Fri Apr 8 00:16:11 EDT 2011
Yesterday I sent my comment on this thread two times but it did not go through.
I'll try one more time and paste it here:
This is mainly a translation and cultural issue.
Granted that the text is a command, the translation point is one of politeness
and cultural norms for making such a request.
When I first came to live in Africa for the purpose of helping to translate the
Bible into a local language, I was surprised that people - even an inferior to a
superior - routinely make commands like this one: "Give me water!" They never
said: "Please." There is no word for "Please!" in that language. Is there in
Greek or Hebrew? I think the same applies here. Jesus said: "Give me something
to drink." It was not an affront and not impolite, but normal. (A similar
question of politeness occurs in the well-known John 2:4).
Therefore, a literal translation like the NASB will carry over that cultural
form into English, even though it violates English cultural norms, and therefore
miscommunicates the tone of the original. NIV is a modified literal version. I
am not sure whether "Will you give me a drink?" refers to water or other drinks.
I think the CEV has the most polite command in English: "Would you please give
me a drink of water?"
Iver Larsen
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jason Hare" <jason at thehebrewcafe.com>
To: <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: 8. april 2011 01:10
Subject: Re: [B-Greek] Tranlsating the Imperative: John 4:7
> Might be worthwhile to note that in Hebrew (if you consider this
> relevant), it is extremely common to use a simple command where we
> might use a more polite question form in English. It's familiar, for
> sure, but it isn't considered rude in the slightest. Was δός μοι a
> translation from Hebrew or Aramaic? Perhaps outside of B-Greek
> limitations, but it's something to take into consideration. A Semitic
> underlying original dialogue could probably be assumed, if it causes
> problems in the Greek text itself.
>
> Don't need responses. I just wanted to throw that out there --
> off-topic though it may be.
>
> Best regards,
> Jason Hare
> Rehovot, Israel
> ________________________________________
> יהיו לרצון אמרי פי והגיון לבי לפניך, ה' צורי וגואלי
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 3:22 PM, Mark Lightman <lightmanmark at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Hi, Stephen,
>>
>> One of my all time favorite imperatives is Archimedes:
>>
>> δός μοι ποῦ στῶ και κινήσω τὴν γῆν.
>> DOS MOI POU STW KAI KINHSW THN GHN.
>>
>> He's not literally asking for a place to stand. It's really a future
>> more-or-less vivid condition: "If I had a place to stand, I would move the
>> world." The imperative is not a request, polite or otherwise, but is a
>> rhetorical devise to involve the hearer more vividly in the absurdity of the
>> proposition. Wallace would call it the protastic pseudo-imperative.
>>
>> We do it in English. "Give this guy fourteen runs and he is tough to beat."
>>
>> Mark L
>> Φωσφορος
>>
>>
>> FWSFOROS MARKOS
>>
>> ________________________________
>> From: Stephen Baldwin <stbaldwi at hotmail.com>
>> To: B- Greek <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
>> Sent: Wed, April 6, 2011 9:03:52 PM
>> Subject: [B-Greek] Tranlsating the Imperative: John 4:7
>>
>>
>> Ladies and Gentlemen:
>>
>> e.g.
>> NASB: 7There came a woman of Samaria to draw water. Jesus said to her, "Give
>> Me
>> a drink."
>> NIV: 7 When a Samaritan woman came to draw water, Jesus said to her, “Will
>> you
>> give me a drink?”
>> Greek: DOS MOI PEIN
>>
> ---
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