[B-Greek] POLLES

Iver Larsen iver_larsen at sil.org
Sun Jan 9 23:38:54 EST 2011


To answer your question: Yes, I think POLLHS modifies both nouns in both texts.

You can think of the underlying form as META DUNAMEWS POLLHS KAI DOXHS POLLHS. 
However, ellipsis is very common in Greek, so one of these would normally be 
elided in the surface form. Theoretically, you could elide any of the two, but I 
think it is more common in Greek to elide the first one, which gives you the 
Matthew and Luke order.

There are no textual variants in terms of order (D changed the genitive 
prepositional phrase to a dative phrase in Luke) and the Byzantine text is not 
different.

As far as translation goes, it depends on the language. In English, the normal 
order in translation for both phrases if the adjective is to modify both nouns 
would be: with/in great power and glory. But you can have the other order 
without much difference in meaning (DUNAMIS is powerful with or without "great") 
or you could have "great" in both places. However, that would put more emphasis 
on "great" than the Greek implies. In my language, POLLHS would be translated by 
different adjectives, depending on the noun it modifies. For DUNAMIS, we would 
say "big" and for DOXA we would say "much". I translated all three as "with 
power and much glory," but could easily have done it differently without any 
significant difference in meaning.

And it depends on the type of translation. Bible translation is traditionally 
very literal and tends to keep the order of the Greek words - if it can possibly 
make sense in English - without much focus on whether the translation is clear 
or natural.  But all of that has to do with translation theory, rather than 
Greek.

Iver Larsen

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Fridolin Janzen" <fjanzen at gmx.net>
To: <b-greek at lists.ibiblio.org>
Sent: 9. januar 2011 14:16
Subject: [B-Greek] POLLES


Matthew and Luke: META DUNAMEWS KAI DOXES POLLES
Mark: META DUNAMEWS POLLES KAI DOXES
We have three synoptic passages: Mathew 24:30, Mark 13:26 and Luke 21:27
using the adjective POLLES. Matthew and Luke use the adjective after DOXES,
while Mark uses it after DUNAMEWS. Harmonizing the text would make it: META
DUNAMEWS POLLES KAI DOXES POLLES.
My question: would the adjective in both texts modify both nouns? Should we
translate both texts with: with great power and great glory?


Abraços,

Pastor
Fridolin Janzen
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CAMPO GRANDE, MS
79104-360 Brasil
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