[B-Greek] translation for O POPOI ??

Carl Conrad cwconrad2 at mac.com
Thu Jan 13 06:48:27 EST 2011


On Jan 13, 2011, at 6:45 AM, Carl Conrad wrote:

> 
> On Jan 12, 2011, at 11:32 PM, George F Somsel wrote:
> 
>> Excrement, once again something got lost in transmission.  Hopefully this will 
>> do better.
>> 
>> ποππύζω, Dor. -ύσδω, onomatop. word, smack on the lips or cluck: hence, 
>> I.III.IV.tootle (on a crude musical pipe), Theoc.5.7. smack, of loud kisses, 
>> AP5.244 (Maced.), 284 (Agath.). call to horses, etc., Ar. Pl.732, cf. 
>> D.S1.83:—Med., call to a horse, SFR.878: Com., call to a man, πόρρωθεν ἀπιδὼν 
>> ἐπόππυσεν Tioncl.21.7; παιδίον ὑποκορίζεσθαι ποππύζων Thphr.Char.20.5; 
>> Ποππύζουσα, title of play by Alexis; κἂν ἀτράψω ποππύζουσιν ..οἱ πάνυ 
>> σεμνοί Ar.V.626 (cf. ποππυσμός). II.applaud, Phld.Acad.Ind.p.14 M.:—also in 
>> showing disapprovl, tut-tut Pass., εἰ ποππυσθείη καὶ κροτηθείη Pl.Ax.36id. 
> 
> It seems to me that people have been making assuming

Please pardon my anacoluthon. I won't say that I won't do it again,
but it comes from changing foxes to ducks in midstream -- if you
take my drift.  CWC

> a close relationship
> between the exclamation W POPOI and POPPUZW -- which assumption seeems
> to me to be a variety of the fallacy, "If it walks like fox, it must be a duck."
> 
> What LSJ says about W POPOI:
> 
> πόποι, exclam. of surprise, anger, or pain, ὢ π. freq. in Hom., always at the beginning of a verse and sentence; ὢ π., οἷον ἔειπε .. Od.17.248; ὢ π., οἷον δή νυ .. 1.32; ὢ π., ὡς .. 10.38, al; ὢ π., ἦ μάλα .. Il.16.745, al.; ὢ π. οὐδέ νύ σοί περ 8.201, cf. Od.17.454; ὢ π... καὶ δὴ Il.21.420; in later Ep. and Eleg., A.R.3.558, al., Ap5.253 (Paul. Sil.); Trag. only in lyr., exc. A.Pers.731 (troch., c. gen.), as ib.852, Eu.145, S.OT168: with other exclam., ἰὼ π. A.Pr.575, Ag.1100; ὀτοτοτοτοῖ πόποι δᾶ ib.1072, 1076.—
> Later writers expld. πόποι as a Dryopian word = δαίμονες, Plu.2.22c, or, = ἀγάλματα ὑπόγαια τῶν θεῶν, EM823.32, and πόποι = θεοί Lyc.943; dat. πόποις Euph.136.
> 
> Since most of what has been said in pure speculation about the original explicit sense of the word, I might as well express an opinion of my own: it is no more, no less than a labial plosive sound that comes about when a stream of breath sputters through the lips, P-P-P-P. That's what happens when one is so suddenly filled with emotion that sound issues explosively from the lips without any distinct semantic force.
> 
> For what it's worth, I liken it to the not altogether archaic English "humph":
> 
> humph |həmf|
> exclamation
> used to express slightly scornful doubt or dissatisfaction.
> ORIGIN natural utterance: first recorded in English in the mid 16th cent.
> 
> Carl W. Conrad
> Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)
> 
> 
> 
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Carl W. Conrad
Department of Classics, Washington University (Retired)






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