[b-greek] Re: John 5:18b (revised)

From: Richard Ghilardi (qodeshlayhvh@juno.com)
Date: Tue Jul 03 2001 - 06:59:11 EDT


Dear Richard S. and b-greekers,

I fear that we are about to stray into the area of theology, so I will
give you my reply off-list. I cannot reply in full to your post at this
time anyway. Perhaps I can after a full day's work.

Here is what John could have written if he had wanted to disavow the
Jews' statements as his own true beliefs:

DIA TOUTO OUN MALLON EZHTOUN AUTON hOI IOUDAIOI APOKTEINAI,

<< hWS OU MONON LUONTA TO SABBATON, ALLA KAI PATERA IDION LEGONTA TON
QEON ISON hEAUTON POIWN TWi QEWi.>>

according to Smyth 2086

OR

... <<hOTI OU MONON LUOI TO SABBATON, ALLA KAI PATERA IDION LEGOI TON
QEON ISON hEAUTON POIWN TWi QEWi.>>

according to Smyth 2242 and 2622

If my grammar is wrong, please correct me!

[Stauch]

The sections you cite are precisely the sections that my other poster
sent
me to review, and I found them (believe it or not) less than convincing
on
this point. Could it not be that Smyth section 2614 (and following)
applies?
 I copy the example Smyth gives from 2615...

[snip]

[Ghilardi]

Section 2615 is irrelevant precisely because you have confused causal
hOTI with the conjunction hOTI that introduces oratio obliqua. The hOTI
of Jn 5:18 is CAUSAL hOTI. The second rewriting of Jn 5:18 above contains
IMPLIED indirect discourse. But the hOTI is still causal. Apparently the
optative is always used in implied O. O. when the tense of the verb in
the main clause is secondary, as it is here.

Yours in His grace,

Richard Ghilardi -- qodeshlayhvh@juno.com
New Haven, CT USA
Nibai kaurno hwaiteis gadriusando in airtha gaswiltith,
silbo ainata aflifnith: ith jabai gaswiltith, manag akran bairith.

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