From: Peter Phillips (firstname.lastname@example.org)
Date: Wed Mar 04 1998 - 08:13:24 EST
In this conversation, isn't it so pleasant to know that women are exempt
from sin and death and all that since it only spread to men!!!
From: Trevor M Peterson <email@example.com>
To: WesWilliams@usa.net <WesWilliams@usa.net>
Cc: firstname.lastname@example.org <email@example.com>
Date: 04 March 1998 12:35
Subject: Re: Rom 5:12 Death spread... because all sinned - How?
>On Tue, 03 Mar 1998 21:52:15 -0700 Wes Williams <WesWilliams@usa.net>
>>First, The verse speaks of death as having DIHLQEN 'spread' 'pass on'
>>to all men, which implies a progressive rather than a simultaneous
>>effect on Adam's descendants.
>But this is refering to QANATOS, not hAMARTIA. If Paul is emphasizing
>physical death (since he is trying to explain why people still died
>between Adam and Moses), this would only make sense. Everyone didn't die
>immediately but each in his own time--a gradual spreading indeed.
>>Secondly, verse 14 goes on to speak of death as ruling as king "from
>>Adam down to Moses, even over those who had not sinned after the
>>likeness of the PARABASEWS "transgression" by Adam." Thus, the type of
>>"sins" from Adam to Moses was not quite the same as the type of sin
>>committed by Adam. This fact seems out of harmony with the view that
>>'when Adam sinned, all of his as yet unborn descendants sinned with
>Unless the stress is on Adam's sin. I take Paul's use of PARABASIS here
>as significant. He seems pretty consistent in tying it to the idea of a
>law to be broken, and in this context, the very issue at hand is how
>people could die without a law. So, Paul explains that before the law
>men couldn't transgress a particular command; thus, sin could not be
>imputed to them. This does not mean that sin did not exist at that time,
>but they died for Adam's transgression, which was the last one to fall
>under a specific command with a specific penalty.
>>Thirdly, verse 19 points to this conclusion when he says that "just as
>>through the disobedience of the one man [Adam] many were constituted
>>sinners, likewise also through the obedience of the one person [Christ
>>Jesus] many will be constituted righteous." Those to be "constituted
>>righteous" by Christ's obedience were not all immediately so
>>at the moment of his presenting his ransom sacrifice to God, but they
>>progressively come under the benefits of that sacrifice as they come
>>PISTEUW in that provision and become reconciled to God. (Joh 3:36; Ac
>Good point, but this may put too much weight on the comparison. Paul's
>emphasis is on the idea of "one" affecting "all." Another significant
>difference is that Christ had to be totally righteous, while Adam had
>only to transgress once.
>>Sin, along with its
>>consequences, "entered" EISELQEN and "spread" DIHLQEN to all the human
>But again, I would say that DIHLQEN refers only to death, at least the
>way Paul describes it.
>Also, this seems to conflict with vv. 13-14, since now you have not
>Adam's sin but a sinful tendency passing to all men. Thus, they would be
>the ones sinning themselves, which actually destroys Paul's analogy, not
>to mention his statement that their sins could never be imputed to them
>anyway, before the law.
>Capital Bible Seminary
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