Date: Mon Nov 09 1998 - 20:36:38 EST wrote:

> To think
> that the use of PRWTOTOKOS in any literal sense would have to transfer the
> human familial setting to the heavenly realm is quite a stretch, in my view.

Mine too!

> Bound up in the term are thoughts of temporal priority, preeminence, certain
> family rights and responsibilities, etc.

Well, Greg, here we diverge. The CULTURE[s] of that time had a
primogeniture ethos, hence temporal priority DETERMINED issues of
inheritance, pre-eminence, family rights and responsibilities. Time
antecedence is a very FLESHY term, and should, imho, be relegated to
the pile containing mother, father, etc. Temporal priority is, as in
your words below, merely a circumstance, my friend.

> The human surroundings that are part
> of a firstborn's life are not bound up in the term. They are merely the
> circumstances surrounding the firstborn when applied to a human. Those who
> knew of Christ as the Firstborn of God certainly would have known better than
> to transfer such things as a human family etc. along with the aforementioned
> notions of temporal priority and preeminence.

And here, pre-eminence is the key. Temporal antecedence steps out of
the context of the passage, again imho, which is the STATUS, the
pre-eminent status, of Christ vis-a-vis TA PANTA etc. Trying to wrap
heavenly time up in fleshy temporality, and especially the
relationship between hO QEOS and hO LOGOS is in my view just a tad on
the silly side. That dog don't hunt!!

Speaking for myself, I have no idea of the nature of heavenly time,
how it works, and how it is experienced. Can we presume its nature
from 'firstborn' as it describes Christ in this passage? I sure

Grace to you...


Lisa Messmer..................ICQ# 5666415
George Blaisdell

Have you seen Dulcie? Look for her Heart!

Last Chance for Animals...Fight Pet Theft!

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