[b-greek] Re: John 17:25

From: Harry W. Jones (hjbluebird@aol.com)
Date: Fri Jun 01 2001 - 18:57:58 EDT

> > The KAI pair is always used in either an additive or paralleling sense
> > when they are ment to pair up. The KAI pair is just not used for
> > contrast. That's why I have to disagree with what BAGD says on page
> > 393 under I.6 about KAI pairs contrasting with "although...yet".
> > If you look at the examples given, Jo. 15:24 and Acts 23:3,
> > according to the context the KAI pairs are being used in an additive
> > sense even though there is contrast in Acts 23:3.
> Well, I believe you are basically right, and yet (or should I say but?) also a bit wrong
> at the same time.
> It is true that KAI is used in an additive or paralleling sense. Here the clause KAI hO
> KOSMOS SE OUK EGNW is paralleled by hOUTOI EGNWSAN as well as EGW SE EGNWN. They all talk
> about knowing God, and especially knowing that Jesus was sent by God.
> The two clauses contrast, not because of the KAI before hOUTOI, but because of the content
> of the clauses apart from the conjunctions used, especially shown by the fronted hO KOSMOS
> which is emphasized by the preceding KAI and the fronted hOUTOI.
> It is therefore not correct to say that KAI in itself can indicate contrast, but is not
> correct either to say that two clauses which are conjoined and compared/paralleled by the
> use of KAI cannot contrast with each other. It is possible to be both additive and
> contrastive at the same time. In Hebrew poetry that is normally called antithetical
> parallelism.
> IMO, Richard Ghilardi did an excellent job of explaining the meaning of the Greek text
> using English, including capital letters to show emphasis, and indicating the parallel
> contrast by "and yet".
> Iver Larsen

Dear Iver,

I appreciate you post and I found it very interesting. But if KAI was
paired in Jo.17:25 and if paired KAI's could show contrast I just
don't believe that we have a contrast between,
"KAI hO KOSMOS SE OUK EGNW " and "KAI hOUTOI". I believe that the
contrast is between, "ho KOSMOS SE OUK EGNW" and "EGW DE SE EYNWN".
Which is covered by "DE". Now I've seen no evidence that would suggest
that KAI could be paired with DE to show contrast. So I have to
continue go with my original post of the first KAI being emphatic
and not paired.

Harry W. Jones

B-Greek home page: http://metalab.unc.edu/bgreek
You are currently subscribed to b-greek as: [jwrobie@mindspring.com]
To unsubscribe, forward this message to leave-b-greek-327Q@franklin.oit.unc.edu
To subscribe, send a message to subscribe-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu

This archive was generated by hypermail 2.1.4 : Sat Apr 20 2002 - 15:36:58 EDT