>At 02:40 AM 7/15/99 -0400, you wrote: > >> >>Sorry, this IS a Greek phrase and Greek alone; no Latin here to be found >>whatsoever! >>The Church in Rome uses this Greek phrase even now because for the first 200 >>years, >>Roman Christians celebrated their liturgy mostly in Greek and NOT in Latin. >>Dimitri > >All those latin speakers who performed the litutgy for 1000 years in that >language will be amazed that they were not using a latin phrase. I am >sorry, but you are wrong as can be. This phrase is indeed latin, and it was >indeed used by the latin speaking church for over a millenium. > >It might very well be a greek phrase- but the question originally posed had >to do with a song. the song's writer was interviewed about it and per his >own testimony he admitted adopting the phrase from the church liturgy. Jim is both right and wrong. KURIE ELEHSON ME is, as noted earlier by others, Greek. Just as AMHN and HALLELOUIA are Hebrew. Both are also loan words into Latin, German, English, and God a;lone knows how many other languages. One must distinguish origins and usage! Jim is correct that many speakers of Latin, after the phrase came into regular use, probably thought it was Latin. Just as ANAPHORA and EPICLESIS, though certainly Greek in origin, are now regular liturgical terms. Ask any older priest what the TE IGITUR is and he will talk about the Canon (another Greek work) of the Mass. Older Lutherans still speak of the Te Deum, the Gloria in Excelsis, and Introits--without knowing any Latin. Jim got overly enthusiastic in his words above. An historical linguist would point out what I did above. A descriptive lexicographer would agree with Jim. This is one of those non-productive arguments. ;-) Peace, Ed Krentz Helvetica+ + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + Edgar Krentz Professor Emeritus of New Testament Lutheran School of Theology at Chicago 1100 East 55th Street Chicago, IL 60615 Telephone: (773) 256-0752; Dean's Office: 773-256-0722FFFF,0000,0000 Office: ekrentz@lstc.edu [preferred for anything professional] Home: emkrentz@mcs.com [Tel: 773-947-8105] GHRASKW AEI POLLA DIDASKOMENOSHelveticaFFFF,0000,0000. "I grow older, learning all the time." + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + + ++FFFF,0000,0000 --- B-Greek home page: http://sunsite.unc.edu/bgreek You are currently subscribed to b-greek as: [cwconrad@artsci.wustl.edu] To unsubscribe, forward this message to leave-b-greek-329W@franklin.oit.unc.edu To subscribe, send a message to subscribe-b-greek@franklin.oit.unc.edu