From owner-incits-v1@incits-v1.org Fri Sep 14 11:23:29 2007 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2007 14:18:31 -0400 From: Patrick Durusau Subject: INCITS-V1: Comments on the comments? Sender: owner-incits-v1@incits-v1.org To: Incits-V1 Reply-to: incits-v1@incits-v1.org X-PMX-Version: 5.2.0.264296 X-ASG-Debug-ID: 1189793925-482d00300000-E618Iy X-Barracuda-URL: http://10.10.100.8:8000/cgi-bin/mark.cgi X-ASG-Whitelist: Client X-ASG-Orig-Subj: Comments on the comments? X-Barracuda-Connect: UNKNOWN[97.89.23.154] X-Barracuda-Start-Time: 1189793926 X-Barracuda-Virus-Scanned: by Barracuda Spam Firewall at insimail.com Greetings! I assume by the long silence on the list that everyone has been enjoying themselves by reviewing the rather large set of comments on DIS 29500! It is quite a set of comments and rather wide ranging so I am sure that everyone can find some comments that are of particular interest to them. I am hopeful that we can use this list and other mechanisms to effectively and efficiently discuss those comments in order to arrive at a mutually agreeable position for the US to take to a ballot resolution meeting. I know that there is some concern about "public" discussion of the comments and a US position so let me tell you a story that may help shape your opinions about such "public" discussions. Set the way back machine to cica the early 20th century. It was a time when the "professional" biblical studies community had not yet abandoned public forums for the discussion of the Bible and biblical topics. Literally thousands of people learned Hebrew and Greek in postal correspondence courses from the leading biblical scholars of the day. As recently as the 1930's, the University of Chicago offered hieroglyphic courses by postal correspondence. It was a time when new means of communication were embraced by both the public and biblical scholars to engage in real discussions. Although they did not use the term "biblical literacy" it was at a very high peak. Around the time of WW II, that communication between the "academy" as it like to call itself now and the general public began to wane and finally to grind to a halt. It is not entirely clear why but personally I suspect it was the rise of science and a perceived need to be more "professional" on the part of biblical scholars. So the "academy" developed ever more specialized vocabularies and began to engage in incestuous discussions that largely excluded the general public. Excluded the general public to the extend that despite a common interest in the same materials, that is the Bible, that the biblical studies community and the general public have almost no discussions forums in common at this point in time. Biblical scholars decry the state of materials and discussions of biblical matters in the public forums but have little room to complain since they abandoned those forums years ago for the safety of talking only among themselves. To a large extent, the only people who are left in the public forums are those who lack the training and resources of biblical scholars. Now I see that as being more than a boring or amusing anecdote depending upon your point of view. ;-) The very worst thing that we can do in the hyper-poisoned atmosphere surrounding DIS 29500 (both pro and con) is to abandon the public forums to those who are more concerned with advancing whatever warped view they have of DIS 29500 or the JTC 1 process. What do I mean by a "warped view?" Well, any statement that includes pointing that X did Y first, in addition to being more typical of a grade school playground argument than adult discussion, is probably a warped view. Views that say "yes" or "no" without offering any meaningful analysis of the question at hand count in my book as "warped views." I really do think we are faced with a real choice, in addition to whatever happens ultimately to DIS 29500. We can simply abandon the public forums to the sort of flaying about that makes me loathe to tell anyone in the markup world that I have even heard of DIS 29500, lest they assume that I am a member of one group of fanatics or the other. As you can guess by this point, I don't think that abandoning public forums is the proper response. I truly think that the US committee (that means you and me) can set an example of calm, rational, productive and *public* discussion of the comments on DIS 29500 on this very list. Yes, other people will probably see the traffic. And that means they will see you correctly me on some incomplete or mistaken reading that I have of DIS 29500, or some tentative proposal that I have floated. So what? If you have never made a mistake in a discussion or offered some position that you did not later think was wrong in a discussion, please let me know at the next face to face so I can announce it to the group. ;-) Yes, we will make mistakes, back track on proposals, and even simply disagree with each other. We are not finite automata with deterministic results. (Apologies if that surprises anyone.) However, we can to be considerate of each other and do our duty as members of this committee to provide the best review of the comments on DIS 29500, develop US positions on the same and suggest possible answers to the comments. I am going to take a look at the comments that we did not reach for the US and try to post one or two for comment over the weekend. I am working on possible mechanisms that will allow us to process the comments we did not reach in the US as well as comments by others. I hope to have news as soon as the next meeting on the 28th of September. I hope everyone is looking forward to a great weekend! Patrick -- Patrick Durusau patrick@durusau.net Chair, V1 - US TAG to JTC 1/SC 34 Acting Convener, JTC 1/SC 34/WG 3 (Topic Maps) Co-Editor, ISO/IEC 13250-1, 13250-5 (Topic Maps) Co-Editor, OpenDocument Format (OASIS, ISO/IEC 26300)