From samba!sunSITE!london Thu May 27 00:29:42 EDT 1993
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From: london@sunSITE.unc.edu (Larry London)
Subject: sunSITE GOPHER has archives of faqs and articles for this newsgroup.
Message-ID: <1993May25.031327.27412@samba.oit.unc.edu>
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Date: Tue, 25 May 1993 03:13:27 GMT

FAQ's, news articles and miscellaneous information for rec.food.historic
and rec.food.sourdough are available via FTP, WAIS, GOPHER and FTPMAIL from:

sunsite.unc.edu

FTP:
/pub/academic/agriculture/sustainable_agriculture/newsgroups/
     rec.food.historic/ and /faqs
     rec.food.sourdough/ and /faqs

WAIS:
telnet sunsite.unc.edu
Login: swais
Enter terminal emulation (vt100)
enter /sustain when first page of sources comes up

GOPHER:
telnet sunsite.unc.edu
Login: gopher
Enter terminal emulation (vt100)
go to  "browse sunsite archives", "sustainable agriculture information",
       "browse sustainable agriculture archives", "sustainable agriculture",
       "newsgroups", "rec.food.historic" or "rec.food.sourdough"

For further information or assistance contact:

Lawrence London
:
:
london@sunSITE.unc.edu



From samba!concert!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!darwin.sura.net!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!destroyer!cs.ubc.ca!news.UVic.CA!spang.Camosun.BC.CA!news Thu May 27 00:29:44 EDT 1993
Article: 1266 of rec.food.historic
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From: COMPTEC91060@camins.Camosun.BC.CA ()
Subject: Want to know history of cheesecake
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I would like to find out about the history/origins, etc. of 
cheesecake.

Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

G. Wareham         COMPTEC91060@CAMINS.CAMOSUN.BC.CA


From samba!concert!gatech!howland.reston.ans.net!usc!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!eco.twg.com!twg.com!news Thu May 27 12:48:50 EDT 1993
Article: 1267 of rec.food.historic
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From: "David Herron" <david@twg.com>
Subject: Re: Want to know history of cheesecake
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I have read numerous recipes for cheesecake like dishes, but do not know
when it was preferred to use `cream cheese' and lemon and merangue.

In _The_Closet_of_Sir_Kenelm_Digby_... is a cheesecake recipe (labeled
as such).  It has you make your own cheese, starting from freshly gotten
milk.  But any `young' cheese should do.  This one was spiced with nutmeg
and mint.  This is an collection of English recipes published in
the late 1600's.

Off the top of my head I can't think of earlier recipes which were _called_
cheese cake.  However there are numerous recipes using cheese+eggs+flavoring
in some combination.  Many are more like what we calle Quiche nowadays.
There are trade offs in the ratio of cheese to egg, they produce different
effects.  And the kind of flavoring is another trade off which produces
different effects.

If you have access to old cookbooks then looking under cheese pie, or torta,
etc will give you a start.

	David


From samba.oit.unc.edu!concert!gatech!howland.reston.ans.net!usc!cs.utexas.edu!uunet!vtserf.cc.vt.edu!creatures!nutter!jtn Thu May 27 23:10:49 EDT 1993
Article: 1268 of rec.food.historic
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From: jtn@nutter.cs.vt.edu (Terry Nutter)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Want to know history of cheesecake
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Date: 26 May 93 19:35:41 GMT
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Hello, everyone.  Terry Nutter here.  

G. Wareham asks for information on the history and origins of cheesecake.
The following is only one data point, so hardly what you'd call history.  
However.  In Platina, _De honesta voluptate_ (On Honest Indulgence), Venice, 
1475, Book 8 (the books are short ;^), there's a recipe for White Torta that 
makes sense as sort of an early cheesecake.

Cheers,

Terry Nutter     Blacksburg, VA     jtn@vtopus.cs.vt.edu     (703)552-1598


From samba.oit.unc.edu!concert!gatech!howland.reston.ans.net!agate!doc.ic.ac.uk!pipex!uknet!edcastle!wex Thu May 27 23:10:50 EDT 1993
Article: 1269 of rec.food.historic
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From: wex@castle.ed.ac.uk (John Wexler)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Want to know history of cheesecake
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This interests me too. Until the mid sixties, cheesecake "as we know it"
was practically unknown in Britain, and cheesecake of any kind was not
common.  We bought cheesecake in delicatessens, which were themselves a
novelty.  The available cheesecake was baked, solid, highly flavoured and
pungent with strong cheese, often with sultanas in the mix and a lattice
of pastry over the filling.  I associate this with Jewish baking, and it
seems to me to have only a very loose connection with what I later met under the
name of "American cheesecake".  So I'd like to know: did one evolve from
the other, or are they simply an instance of convergent evolution?
    John Wexler
    Edinburgh
P.S. I've got recipes for approximations to the old-style cheesecake
which I used to enjoy.  They all come out delicious, but sweeter and
lighter than I remember.  Has anybody got a recipe for the stuff that
makes the sweat stand out on your brow and fills you up with a half-inch
slice?



From samba.oit.unc.edu!concert!news-feed-1.peachnet.edu!darwin.sura.net!sgiblab!daver!dlb!megatest!mithril!sfisher Sat May 29 18:29:32 EDT 1993
Article: 1271 of rec.food.historic
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From: sfisher@megatest.com (Scott Fisher)
Subject: Re: Want to know history of cheesecake
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In article <1993May25.025103.19999@spang.Camosun.BC.CA> COMPTEC91060@camins.Camosun.BC.CA () writes:
>
>I would like to find out about the history/origins, etc. of 
>cheesecake.

Well, since the Chinese don't make cheese, it fell to the Romans to
invent something like what we now call cheesecake.  (Though I'd bet
that a thorough perusal of Indian cooking would bring up something
like gulab jamn; hmm, did Alexander's troops bring this back to
the Mediterranean?)

The Romans used to mix a cheese like ricotta with honey, eggs, 
raisins, almonds, and the like and bake it.  Apicius would be a good
place to start looking, but I seem to recall a record (if not a recipe)
in Waverly Root's The Cuisine of Italy (one of those Time-Life cookbooks,
and a worthwhile addition to the kitchen).

--Scott



From samba.oit.unc.edu!concert!gatech!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!howland.reston.ans.net!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sdd.hp.com!col.hp.com!csn!ub!acsu.buffalo.edu!ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu!v122guez Sat May 29 18:29:33 EDT 1993
Article: 1272 of rec.food.historic
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From: v122guez@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (Dara M Fell)
Subject: Food from the 1600's
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Can anyone tell me anything about food from the 1600's (that time period) 
oh, I'm looking at European food. Certain kinds of devices used, upper 
class/lower class, types of foods eaten, foods thought to be bad... 
Anything even slightly related would be great. Thanks.

Dara


From samba.oit.unc.edu!hermes.oit.unc.edu!shava Sat May 29 18:29:34 EDT 1993
Article: 1273 of rec.food.historic
Path: samba.oit.unc.edu!hermes.oit.unc.edu!shava
From: shava@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Shava Nerad Averett)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Fava Beans
Date: 29 May 1993 18:19:35 GMT
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References: <1t5je5INNkv6@SUNED.ZOO.CS.YALE.EDU> <1993May16.151834.26529@alf.uib.no> <1993May19.153956.11326@infodev.cam.ac.uk>
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Fava beans are not legumes, i.e. not in the leguminosae.  They are closer
relatives of the russell lupins that one sees in the gardens of more 
temperate climates.  Favas are very short seasoned, and are the only
bean-like crop native to northern europe.  They are so well adapted to 
cool weather, that in subtropical places, (like North Carolina and 
Egypt...;) the only way to grow a good crop of them is to grow them over
the winter.

-- 
Shava Nerad Averett				shava@unc.edu
/*  all original materials (c)1993, Shava Nerad Averett, and have nothing 
    significant to do with the University of North Carolina, a mostly owned 
    subsidiary of the NC Legislature, a mostly owned subsidiary of NC DOT. */


From samba.oit.unc.edu!hermes.oit.unc.edu!shava Sat May 29 18:29:35 EDT 1993
Article: 1274 of rec.food.historic
Path: samba.oit.unc.edu!hermes.oit.unc.edu!shava
From: shava@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Shava Nerad Averett)
Newsgroups: rec.food.historic
Subject: Re: Coffee
Date: 29 May 1993 18:21:38 GMT
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In article <auerbach.737825085@news.ncsu.edu> auerbach@sparc03.cc.ncsu.edu (David D Auerbach) writes:
>I thought that the religious reasons in Islamic countries were an excuse
>for the deeper religious reasons of preferring the congregation to spend
>their time in worship and not hanging out in coffeeshops socializing, and
>perhaps plotting. 

I am surprised that there wasn't a froufrou about coffee being an intoxi-
cant.  Intoxicants are forbidden by the quran.



-- 
Shava Nerad Averett				shava@unc.edu
/*  all original materials (c)1993, Shava Nerad Averett, and have nothing 
    significant to do with the University of North Carolina, a mostly owned 
    subsidiary of the NC Legislature, a mostly owned subsidiary of NC DOT. */


From samba.oit.unc.edu!concert!gatech!howland.reston.ans.net!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!uchinews!law-mac-23.uchicago.edu!user Mon May 31 23:51:10 EDT 1993
Article: 1275 of rec.food.historic
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From: DDFr@Midway.UChicago.Edu (David Friedman)
Subject: Re: Coffee
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Date: Mon, 31 May 1993 19:21:07 GMT
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In article <1u89ji$aqq@samba.oit.unc.edu>, shava@hermes.oit.unc.edu (Shava
Nerad Averett) wrote:
> I am surprised that there wasn't a froufrou about coffee being an intoxi-
> cant.  Intoxicants are forbidden by the quran.

There was. See Ralph Hattox, _Coffee and Coffeehouse, The Origin of a
Social Beverage in the Medieval Near East_ for a detailed discussion.

David Friedman



