EMUSIC-L Digest Volume 28, Number 1 This issue's topics: "Industrial" music (4 messages) One box vs. many OBX MATRIX-1000 EPS Questions Your EMUSIC-D moderator is Joe McMahon. Please send articles to emusic-L@auvm.american.edu (or EMUSIC-L@AUVM.BITNET). Administrative mail should be directed to xrjdm@scfvm.nasa.gov. Digests will be distributed semi-monthly to monthly. For faster response to questions, subscribe to EMUSIC-L@AUVM.BITNET (or emusic-l@auvm.american.edu). The EMUSIC-L discussion group can alo be accessed via bit.listserv.emusic-l on Usenet. Subscribers to this list may send articles to EMUSIC-D@AUVM.BITNET (or emusic-d@auvm.american.edu); they will be reviewed and forwarded to EMUSIC-L. Back issues are available from xrjdm@scfvm.gsfc.nasa.gov. This is a manual operation, so requests for things like "all back issues" will take a long time. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 91 10:08:11 EST Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List From: car-el Subject: Re: Industrial In-Reply-To: Message of Fri, 26 Apr 91 12:52:21 EDT from MIke: The term 'Industrial music' was invented by Monte Cazazza in the late seventies. 'Industrial music for industrial people' was the phrase he used and was picked up by friends Genesis P. Orridge and company. They formed the the label Industrial Records. Throbbing Gistle, Cabaret Voltaire, Monte C., W. S. Burroughs, and many others released through the label. Most of it bears little resemblance to the current WAx TraX type of electronic hardcore . Most of all, there seemed to be a definite philosphy about industrial culture that was present at the time which, unfortunately, is hardly ever seen in current bands which call themselves 'industrial'. Nevertheless, it is just a term, and i suppose sho.not dwelled on for too long. If you want some more info on this or any of the related bands feel free to write me. car-el ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Apr 91 22:10:25 GMT Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was NETNEWS@AUVM.AUVM.EDU From: Cecilia M Tan Subject: Re: Industrial In-Reply-To: M3A@CORNELLC.BITNET's message of 26 Apr 91 16: 52:21 GMT In article M3A@CORNELLC.BITNET (Mike Allinger) writes: Re: Industrial What's the real term for this stuff annyway? I've heard it called new rock, alternative rock and now industrial rock (which I think is probably the best name anyway). I'll try to sort this out as carefully as I can without offending anyone's sense of history: If what you are referring to is the "Wax Trax" sound bands, i.e. Revolting Cocks, KMFDM, (even those not on the Wax Trax record label) Skinny Puppy, Nine Inch Nails, the term most often used is "industrial dance music." I've never heard "industrial rock." ALternative Rock is the label reserved for that 120 Minutes kind of "college radio" stuff, that can range from jangly-guitar rock (a la R.E.M.) to Euro-disco stuff (a la Depeche Mode, Erasure) to goth and mope rock (A la The Cure, Siouxsie and the Bansees, Peter Murphy). "New rock" sounds ridiculous, especially when applied to "industrial" since industrial has been around since the mid-1970s! OK, now the part about "Industrial" and what it "really" means. There's a school of industrial music that is not the same as "industrial dance." Much of it predates the dance-floor adoption of industrial sounds. For examples, take a look at ealry Throbbing Gristle, Controlled Bleeding, and such. For many people, it's unlistenable noise and doesn't even have that throbbing dance beat that 90's "industrail dance" has to make it palatable. Of course, the line gets blurred when people who were making "true" industrial grunge in the seventies, with actual machine parts and such, are now cranking up a sampler and a drum machine and making dance music. Is that enough? I don't mean to start a debate on this. -ctan (the cyberpunk hath spoken... oh yeah, another synonym for that modern industrial dance music is cyberpunk. Which opens a whole 'nother can of worms...) -- o Cecilia Tan, B.A., K.S.C., Techno-dyke Extraordinaire + "Lay my hands on heaven and the sun and the moon and the stars, v and the devil wants to fuck me in the back of his car." -NIN **----------------------> ctan@world.std.com <---------------------** ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Apr 91 13:07:52 EDT Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List From: ronin Subject: industrial origins keep in mind that Russolo, in his manifesto 'The Art of Noises' explicitly declared that 'industrial' sound should be a source of the new music. --------------------------< Eschew Obfuscation >------------------------- Eric Harnden (Ronin) The American University Physics Dept. Washington, D.C ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Apr 91 12:51:00 CDT Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List From: SRSKAL@MACALSTR.EDU Subject: Re: Industrial Actually, all of those terms are somewhat self-defined. The term "industrial" began with bands in the late 70s/early 80s with groups such as Throbbing Gristle(actually on a label called "Industrial Records") and SPK and many others The problem with such terminology (sp?) is of course that once any term becoms widely used or recognized, it also becomes somewhat obsolete and misused. Thinking that "industrial rock" is the best term is about as acurate as saying that "Electronic Music" is the most precise term for everything from Tangerine Dream to Kraftwerk to Merzbow to Boulez to Floating Concrete Octopus Precision & acurate description is surely preferable to all-encompasing, broad terms. Just a quick thought.. R.S. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 91 14:05:24 BST Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List From: Nick Rothwell Subject: One box vs. many >Next, can anyone tell me if buying a Korg T3, or Wavestation, or >Yamaha SY77, or Roland D-70 would be a better alternative to buying lots >of little stuff? (Please don't recommend the Ensoniq VFXsd...i've already >heard TOO many horror stories!) >From whom, I wonder? :-) I don't know if I can make many comments that would be relevant to you, but: I'm trying to revolve my rig/setup around two keyboards and the rest of the stuff in racks. Both the keyboards I use right now happen to be synthesisers as well (D-50, VFX), partly because I like having the programming interface for these two units right where I can see it, and partly because all the dedicated controller keyboards I've seen so far aren't as clever at controlling racks as the VFX is (or Wavestation, for that matter). The downside of this approach is that you're stuck with the keyboard and synth in one box, so you can't sell/upgrade one without the other. I'm currently stuck with a wonderful D-50 synth in an underpowered keyboard. Expensive synths do give you more flexibility, power and sound quality than cheaper ones, by and large - the D-50 eclipses the D-110 in terms of what it can do. But there are exceptions to this rule, especially when it comes to discontinued lines and so on. Regarding the D-110 - nice little unit, quite versatile in terms of setting up multitimbral patches and percussion tracks, and it's cheap. The voice architecture isn't too hot (it has lots of sample data but not much modulation) and the sound is a little thin and lacks presence. I use mine for percussion and background sequencing, and leave important pads and leads to the big iron (MKS-70, Waldorf, VFX). >I'm not looking for an elaborate set-up with lots of rack-mounted effects, >multiple keyboards, or a workstation AND a computer. Just a basic set-up >(with a sequencer - a must!) If you must go for a dedicated sequencer, then make sure it has the versatility you require. I insist on the versatility, power and flexibility of a computer-based system, myself. Nick. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 29 Apr 91 20:56:24 EDT Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List From: James Tittle Subject: OBX MATRIX-1000 Hello, I have been on this list just a little while and would like to say from the top that this is great! I live in a small town and do not have a lot of exposure to other E-Music buffs. Also, I find the diversity of the discussion topics pleasing. Well, I have a problem I would like to throw out and see if anyone might be able to help me. I have an OBX Matrix-1000 and IBM software to program it with. I enjoy the sounds on the unit but , of course, I want to program my own. The software I use is complete. It appears I can address any module parameter I desire, and these parameters make sense with the more early Moog-ish thinking I have. However, the MATRIX 1000 manual has no information about how this device is basically set up. I feel I could guess at a lot, maybe, but at least I need to know the internal layout ( conceptually, I dont care if it is hard-wired or digitally simulated). Could someone help spell this out for me a bit? I realise its a little difficult without a block diagram. Thanks. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 30 Apr 91 08:26:01 ADT Reply-To: Electronic Music Discussion List Sender: Electronic Music Discussion List Comments: <30APR91.09114435.0033.MUSIC@UNB.CA> From: Alan Edwards Subject: EPS Questions I realize that this belongs on synth-l, but I posted there and got no reply. Did anyone see it ? I have some questions about my EPS that nobody has been able to answer, and wanted to post them here before writing Transoniq Hacker. 1)Does the EPS have release velocity as indicated in its MIDI Impl'n chart. My monitor indicates that it gives release velocity 64 no matter what I do. 2)Can the release velocity be used as a modulation source for internal sounds, and if so what is it called. 3)Is there an easy way to copy/back up sounds from a hard disk. Loading and resaving each sound to floppy is tedious, and you lose the directory 4)Why does it not come up with A440. I have to put master tune to +8 each time. 5)When playing with tunings, I can go through and set each key, but when I scroll back to check, some settings have changed, and will not stay where I set them. Why is this ? Thanks, Alan Edwards ------------------------------ End of the EMUSIC-L Digest ******************************