EMUSIC-L Digest Volume 59, Issue 07 This issue's topics: Can you help me please?? (3 messages) Inexpensive Mixers (6 messages) Thanks to all of you... Your EMUSIC-L Digest moderator is Joe McMahon . You may subscribe to EMUSIC-L by sending mail to listserv@american.edu with the line "SUB EMUSIC-L your name" as the text. The EMUSIC-L archive is a service of SunSite (sunsite.unc.edu) at the University of North Carolina. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1993 04:52:04 GMT From: Paul Trunfio Subject: Can you help me please?? posted also to comp.music. Dear friends... This computer music business is SO confusing... I have a fun little setup here at home and I want to upgrade. I went to our BIG music store in Boston (EU Wurlitzer) and they seem confused too... Now, don't get angry with me and tell me to look in the FAQ... I couldn't find one... AND I tried to look in Keyboard magazine and Electronic Musician for some help but NO DICE there either. My setup is... Yamaha PSR-47 controller Yamaha TG33 (16 part, 32 polyphony) Yamaha RY10 rhythm programmer They are hooked in through a standard 1-in 3-out MIDI interface and into my MAC with Opcode's VISION and GALAXY PLUS. I have a basic TECHNICS tape dec with a line in coming from the TG33 stereo outputs for recording to tape. Here's what I'd like to do BUT I don't know how to do it... I know I am quite the beginner when it comes to electronic music BUT I am new to electronics as I have usually stayed with my Baldwin baby grand piano: 1) I want better orchestral sounds (what should I look at for about 1000??? E-mu Proteus 2/orchestral??? Korg Wavestation SR??? Roland JV-880 with the orchestral expansion board???) I need some advice here... I'd like to have 16 parts though... Should I think of a keyboard (like the E-mu Proteus MPS Plus Orchestral keyboard which has weighted keys that I don't have on my Yamaha) or should I stick with plain synths without the keyboard??? 2) Can anyone tell me what the advantage is of getting a better MIDI interface??? I was thinking of Opcode's STUDIO 3 or 4??? I want to have the capability for my MAC to play MIDI to multiple machines... 3) On that note, each synth has stereo outputs... how do I send them all simultaneously to both my power speakers and my tape dec?? Is this what a mixer is for??? or is this what the STUDIO 3 or 4 is supposed to do??? I notice that mixers are both with and without tape cassettes. Should I just keep my TECHNICS recorder and get a plain mixer or get a combination mixer/tape and get rid of my TECHNICS??? 4) Can everything in #3 be accomplished by getting a PATCH BAY??? What is a patch bay? Anyway... I am rambling... If you are so pissed off at me for my stupidity then can you just tell me WHERE I should go to talk to a real live person to ask these questions??? As you can tell I NEED HELP... Whatever help you can provide me with I would truly appreciate!!! Best wishes to all... Paul _______________________________________________________________________________ Boston University Paul A. Trunfio Department of Physics & Center for Polymer Studies Telephone: 617/353-9041 590 Commonwealth Avenue Facsimile: 617/353-3783 Boston, Massachusetts 02215 _______________________________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 15 Dec 1993 09:16:00 EST From: "DRCV06::GRAHAM" Subject: A little help for Paul. It has not been so long since I had all of those questions, and more, too. There are no stupid questions. First, the MIDI, you should go for multi-port if you want to control more than 16 c hannels at a time. If you are into orchestral composition or playing, you need two ports, or maybe four. The Emu Proteus 2 is really a fine orchastral synth in my opinion, you might even want two of them. The audio side is just as complex, and as interesting, as the MIDI side. To mix two or more audio source, you do need a mixer, and a quiet one at that. You should be able to get a nice one for $300. You can use the mixer outputs to drive both your speakers and your master tape deck. A mixer with a built in tape deck will allow you to do multi-track recording and mix to your own specifications. If you mix only to your two track deck, you won't have the opportunity to edit, delete or add a track, However, I add that the best and quietest mixers don't come with built in decks, so you have to decide what you are willing to settle for. It sounds like you have a good start, a mixer and orchestral module and multi-port MIDI adapter for your Mac should really get you in business. Geez, listen to me already, I don't know what the hell I'm talking about, but I muddle through, so take all this with a mine of salt, but at least, my setup works ... sometimes? Dan Graham, Gee, look at all those buttons, what happens if I push ... BANG! ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Dec 1993 00:59:59 EST From: Paul Pizzi Subject: Can you help me please?? > 1) I want better orchestral sounds (what should I look at for about > 1000??? E-mu Proteus 2/orchestral??? Korg Wavestation SR??? Roland > JV-880 with the orchestral expansion board???) I need some advice > here... Yes, you might go for the Proteus 2 but if you want the ultimate orchestral sounds you'd better try to get a sampler. I know, your budget is limited but if you can afford to spend a little more than $1500 I give you a very good solution: - Get a used 16-bit sampler like the Akai S950 (around $5-600) - Get a used Audiomedia (though Audiomedia 2 would be far better) board for the mac (around $900) - Get "Deck" 2.0 for the mac ($200) Of course I'm assuming you have a nu-bus capable mac. You can load sounds into your Akai and then lay a digital audio track onto "Deck". Your sampler is now ready for another full load to go on another track. You can record up to 4 tracks and play a fifth load of samples live into your tape deck. It's like having 5 Akais... > 2) Can anyone tell me what the advantage is of getting a better MIDI interface??? With my idea you wouldn't need a sophisticated midi interface, a 1-in-1-out 50-buck tiny box would do just fine. > 3) On that note, each synth has stereo outputs... how do I send them all > simultaneously to both my power speakers and my tape dec?? Is this what a mixer > is for??? Exactly. Plan to spend at least $6-700 for a decent one (Alesis 1622 or Mackies are the best in that range) > I notice that mixers are both with and without tape cassettes. Should I just keep > my TECHNICS recorder and get a plain mixer or get a combination mixer/tape and > get rid of my TECHNICS??? Any stereo line output would be fine for your deck, even if the mixer doesn't boast a specific "tape output" (but most do...) Forget mixer/multitracker combinations, usually they're a bad compromise. > 4) Can everything in #3 be accomplished by getting a PATCH BAY??? What is a patch > bay? Nope! A patch bay is just a switcher, a router. Say for example you have 16 inputs in your mixer and 24 outputs from your instruments but you never use them all at the same time. A patch bay allows you to connect 16 of them into your mixer without disconnecting any jack and fumbling with cables. Good luck! PAUL ========================================= * * * * * * PAOLO PIZZI * * * * Time Elapsed Art Music * * * * Los Angeles - U.S.A. * * * * * * * *-----------------------------* * * * * * * * email: * * * * pizzip@aol.com * * * * pizzi@delphi.com * * * * 72772.234@compuserve.com * * * * * * ========================================= - Patria est ubicumque est bene (Pacuvius) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1993 08:28:00 EST From: Robert C Graham Jr Subject: Inexpensive Mixers I am in the middle of a decision on the purchase of a mixer I need to make shortly. I appreciate any help any of you can give me. I am trying to decide between the Mackie 1202 7 channel mixer and the MIDI Mixer 7 by MOTU. The MIDI Mixer 7 seems to do all the Mackie can and more, with the plus of being MIDI controlled. However, I heard that the sound quality is not there compared to the Mackie. If there is a significant difference between the two in sound quality, I would rather go with the mixer that has the better fidelity. I can puchase a used MIDI Mixer 7 for $300, and a used Macke 1202 for $240. Any suggestions? Thanks! RCG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1993 08:12:36 -0600 From: Arne Claassen ISE Subject: Re: Inexpensive Mixers > I am in the middle of a decision on the purchase of a mixer I need to make > shortly. I appreciate any help any of you can give me. I am trying to > decide between the Mackie 1202 7 channel mixer and the MIDI Mixer 7 by > MOTU. The MIDI Mixer 7 seems to do all the Mackie can and more, with the > plus of being MIDI controlled. However, I heard that the sound quality > is not there compared to the Mackie. If there is a significant difference > between the two in sound quality, I would rather go with the mixer that has > the better fidelity. I can puchase a used MIDI Mixer 7 for $300, and a used > Macke 1202 for $240. Any suggestions? As the owner of a 1202 i can only recommend it for its superb sonic qualities. I'm not familiar with the MOTU device though. Another thing, the 1202 is a 12 channel not 7 channel mixer. 4 mono ins and 4 stereo ins. I love it, especially for the $300 i paid for it new. -- Arne F. Claassen |"In cows we trust | EPS Classic * D4 | E pluribus Moo" | Mac Centris 650 | | ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1993 16:10:01 GMT From: Philip Jones Subject: Re: Inxepensive MIxers Hi Robert You wrote > I am in the middle of a decision on the purchase of a mixer I need to make shortly. I appreciate any help any of you can give me. I am trying to decide between the Mackie 1202 7 channel mixer and the MIDI Mixer 7 by MOTU. The MIDI Mixer 7 seems to do all the Mackie can and more, with the plus of being MIDI controlled. However, I heard that the sound quality is not there compared to the Mackie. If there is a significant difference between the two in sound quality, I would rather go with the mixer that has the better fidelity. I can puchase a used MIDI Mixer 7 for $300, and a used Macke 1202 for $240. Any suggestions? > Well, I suggest you check out the Spirit Folio 10 to 2. The sound quality is absolutely excellent. I have been using this mixer for around four months now, to mix all my synth modules. I have the 10 to 2 version which has 6 balanced inputs with mic/line gain control. Each channel has two effects sends, one of which can be pre or post, three band equaliser with swept mid band and 50Hz cut off switch if the input is suffering from rumble (ie mics on stage). The last four channels are combined into two stereo faders with the same controls except for no swept mid and only unbalanced line inputs. Each channel can be prefaded which for me is a major plus when working live. Also each effects send/return can be PFl'd. All in all the mixer is worth a look its only major omission is the lack of insert points on each channel. There is only a pair of insert points for the stereo mix out. Hope this has helped, Phil Jones (pj02@ee.ic.ac.uk) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1993 13:05:43 -800 From: Mark Hartshorn Subject: Re: Inexpensive Mixers Hi Rob, I bought a Mackie 1202 new for $320 with rack plates. I've been happier with it than any other mixer I've worked with. I would highly recomend it. Mark On Tue, 7 Dec 1993, Robert C Graham Jr wrote: > I am in the middle of a decision on the purchase of a mixer I need to make > shortly. I appreciate any help any of you can give me. I am trying to > decide between the Mackie 1202 7 channel mixer and the MIDI Mixer 7 by > MOTU. The MIDI Mixer 7 seems to do all the Mackie can and more, with the > plus of being MIDI controlled. However, I heard that the sound quality > is not there compared to the Mackie. If there is a significant difference > between the two in sound quality, I would rather go with the mixer that has > the better fidelity. I can puchase a used MIDI Mixer 7 for $300, and a used > Macke 1202 for $240. Any suggestions? > > Thanks! > > RCG ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 7 Dec 1993 18:35:07 -0500 From: not Robert Subject: Re: Inexpensive Mixers there is no doubt anywhere in the universe: you cannot get a better sounding mixer for twice the price than that Mackie 1202 and 1604... more features (i.e., alesis 1622, tascam boards) but nothing is as clean... if you're just a hobbyist, it doesn't really matter -- it's not like the mixer 7s sounds bad -- very cool actually, but if you are imminently making digital recordings (i.e., DAT) then you should get the Mackie -- if it's analog recordings, it doesn't really matter... ps soundcraft has a similarly priced mixer to the 1202 that sounds almost as good and has a mid eq i believe; something sorely lacking in the 1202.. pps i have a 1202 and used a 1604 all summer... previously used a cool tascam 16 channel with lots of routing and sweepable mid-eq -- 2 things i missed a great deal on the 1604... oh well... i guess the conclusion is: get whichever one you like, but realize the differences first 'cuz none of the ones you're considering suck -- hell, the cheap alesis 1622 is really neat if you find it used/cheap... (oh, differences, like, you can drop the mackie.. irrelevant if you keep the setup at home, ya know?) -- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 8 Dec 1993 12:55:35 +0800 From: Chia Poh Hwa Andy Subject: Re: Inxepensive MIxers Why not check out the Boss ??? . Can't remember the model. It's a 6-channel mono mixer. I thought it was good for homw use. Got it for just $200 (new). Andy ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1993 20:17:24 GMT From: Paul Trunfio Subject: Thanks to all of you... Dear friends... I wanted to thank all of you for your advice to me regarding orchestral synths and mixing. Here's what I decided after trying out several synths at our big music store in Boston... I decided to stay simple. Not because of money BUT because I don't want to get overwhelmed with stuff. Not many bells or whistles because I feel that it distracts the good composer from actually making music. Having all sorts of fancy synths and other toys aren't as important to me as the art of making music. So, here's what I am getting: E-mu PROTEUS 2 XR / Orchestral (750 + 350 for the XR) Mackie 1202 mixer (350) the above is in addition to my Yamaha PSR510M controller, Yamaha TG33 which I like a lot because it's nice and large and has good sounds, and my RY10 for rhythms. Thanks for all your help folks... ..Paul :) PS: Once I feel comfortable with all that, I have an upgrade plan (which I will share with you all): 1) I do a lot of REAL piano work. So I will get a controller/synth with weighted keys and excellent piano sounds... I liked the KORG C-56-M. 2) Something similar to the K2000 or ASR10. 3) A good audio recorder to replace my TECHNICS. 4) Eventually, I will need more than 16 ch. so I will get a STUDIO 5. This last item deals with something we are doing for work and I will do around the summer probably... 5) I will be needed to do hard disk recording for something I am working on for a Boston Museum of Science exhibit but I don't need it now. We are doing digital video (with all the fixin's) but I need digital audio also. So this will come a little later. _______________________________________________________________________________ Boston University Dr. Paul A. Trunfio Center for Polymer Studies & Science & Mathematics Education Center Telephone: 617/353-9041 590 Commonwealth Avenue Facsimile: 617/353-3783 Boston, Massachusetts 02215 _______________________________________________________________________________ ------------------------------ End of the EMUSIC-L Digest ******************************