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Date:         Sun, 4 Aug 1996 07:03:24 -0400
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To: Joe McMahon <mcmahon@CLARK.NET>
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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 28 Jul 1996 01:46:51 -0500
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Tom Jordan <tjordan@IAC.NET>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Cage.

>
> > Actually, the only person who ever reported hearing such sounds weere
> > is John Cage. Never hesard anyone else say so. Have sopent many hours
> > in anechoic.  So, don't belive all you read especially by JC
>
> The actual story (and it wasn't in any book I read, it was on a
> fragment of a video with Cage in that famous anechoic chamber) is not
> an allegation by Cage.  He said he heard pitches, despite being in a
> so-called absolutely silent environment.  The engineers were the ones
> who came with such an explanation.

After reading many of these postings I went to my copy of Cage's book, SILENCE (
a Wesleyan paperback edition, 1973) and turned to his reference on this subject.
He refers to an address he made to a convention of the Music Teachers National
Association in 1957, and a printed brochure for a recording in 1958. Part of his
report follows:
"I entered one (the anechoic chamber) at Harvard University several years ago
and heard two sounds, one high and one low. When I described them to the
engineer in charge, he informed me that the high one was my nervouse system in
operation, the low one my blood in circulation. Until I die there will be sounds.
And they will continue following my death. One need not fear about the future of
music."

He was an incredible prophet. No matter what any of us think about his music, he
did fortell so many things about our art form.
--

Tom Jordan

      tjordan@iac.net         http://www.iac.net/~tjordan
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 28 Jul 1996 07:25:54 -0400
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         NEC_CEELY@FLO.ORG
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Cage.

Actually it is in SILENCE!
RPC
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 28 Jul 1996 09:29:19 -0400
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Jeff Adkins <jadkins@INFI.NET>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

G Berry <gberry@ACCESS.EVE.NET> wrote:
>At 02:23 PM 07-27-96 -0400, you wrote:
>>Actually, the only person who ever reported hearing such sounds weere
>>is John Cage.
>
>I've never heard about hearing the high-pitched sound of your own nervous
>system, but I *have* heard reports of people hearing their blood flowing
>through their veins. Too bad I don't have access to such a quiet location,
>I'd like to give it a try. One thing to remember, just because you can't
>hear it, doesn't mean that *no one* has ever heard it.

Isn't this a condition called tinnitus?  I've heard both ringing (high
pitched noise) and buzzing (low pitched) all my life as what to me is a
natural part of a quiet environment.  I've never heard nervous system noise
being the explanation, but I guess it makes sense; I always heard the
origin of the noise was unknown. From what I understand one's sense of how
loud the noise is can be relative to an amount of hearing loss. Pete
Townshend complains of the loud ringing noises.

--Jeff

Our walking is in time
And our dazzling bodies
Have paces ineffable
That leave their prints in fables . . . .                      --Paul Valery
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 28 Jul 1996 12:12:17 -0400
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Jacky Schreiber <jackysch@VEN.NET>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Cage.

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----------
De:             Paulo Mouat[SMTP:mouat@MAIL.TELEPAC.PT]
Enviado:        S=E1bado 27 de Julio de 1996 21:54 PM
Para:           Multiple recipients of list EMUSIC-L
Asunto:         Nervous systems and Cage.

> Actually, the only person who ever reported hearing such sounds weere
> is John Cage. Never hesard anyone else say so. Have sopent many hours
> in anechoic.  So, don't belive all you read especially by JC

The actual story (and it wasn't in any book I read, it was on a
fragment of a video with Cage in that famous anechoic chamber) is not
an allegation by Cage.  He said he heard pitches, despite being in a
so-called absolutely silent environment.  The engineers were the ones
who came with such an explanation.

And there are reports by astronauts about experiencing the same.

Almost everything Cage writes is to be taken with a grain of salt.  This
is one exception.

Best!
--
  __|__
___\_/___
   ___      Paulo Mouat,
  |___|  mouat@mail.telepac.pt
  |___|

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D0000000000000000000=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D

Nice name for a piece or a CD (Nervous systems!!)...

cheers

jacky

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=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 28 Jul 1996 21:14:22 +0200
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Paulo Mouat <mouat@MAIL.TELEPAC.PT>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Cage.

> Actually it is in SILENCE!
> RPC

So it is.  ALSO, I have a video on Cage, a fragment of which is filmed
inside the anechoic chamber, and he explains the episode.

--
  __|__
___\_/___
   ___      Paulo Mouat,
  |___|  mouat@mail.telepac.pt
  |___|
=========================================================================
Date:         Sun, 28 Jul 1996 22:37:31 -0400
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Marge Rosen <SBoomStdio@AOL.COM>
Subject:      how to unsubscribe?

I put that info somewhere . . . :(

How do I unsubscribe???
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 09:26:52 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Charles Biern <cbiern@MAIL.EROLS.COM>
Subject:      Re: how to unsubscribe?

Marge Rosen wrote:
>
> I put that info somewhere . . . :(
>
> How do I unsubscribe???
Marge,

I'm cutting the cord too.
SIGNOFF EMUSIC-L sent to listserv@american.edu should do it but then you
have to confirm your message within 48 hrs. or they won't let you go! I'm
not sure what I have to do to confirm other than to send the signoff
message again.

Good luck,
Charlie
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 06:28:15 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Nathanael W Berry <nwberry@IX.NETCOM.COM>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

>Now, out of any jokes, it's rather easy to try it.  Just make sure your
>surroundings are quiet.  You should hear low-pitched sounds caused by
>you blood being pumped *and* a very high continuous pitch from your
>nervous system.  It is a common experience reported by visitors of
>anechoic chambers.
>

        I'm not sure everyone exhibits this "feature"; I know I do, as do
some others to whom I have spoken. I have seen this effect explained on NOVA
or something, but dont remember if it is the ear itself, or the brain bunch
of nerves that create the "noise" in the absence of stimulation. The chamber
I had access to was very large and very well designed. I either worked with
a bunch of fruitcakes (a distinct possibility), or they all just wanted to
make me feel normal. The sound I hear is similar to the sound emitted by a
TV transformer warming up (am I crazy), or some florescent lights
particularly in industrial or commercial applications (or just a loon (no
disrespect for our feathered friend intended)).

I am going to crawl back in my hole now

Nate
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 10:37:50 -0400
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         "Robert M. Sanders" <RMSanders@SMTPGATE.READ.TASC.COM>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors. -Reply

>Actually, the only person who ever reported hearing such sounds
weere
>is John Cage.

I occasionally have trouble relaxing because of this phenomenon. It
seems to be intensified by stress and caffiene.

-rob
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 11:17:53 EDT
Reply-To:     tom@mvision.com
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Tom Ritchford <tom@MVISION.COM>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Cage.
In-Reply-To:  <199607290500.BAA45911@atlanta.american.edu> (message from
              Automatic digest processor on Mon, 29 Jul 1996 01:00:09 -0400)

    I'm sure you're all already sick of this but you can
hear Cage telling the anechoic room story (and a lot of others!)
in the landmark piece "Indeterminacy."  This work is "just" a
series of anecdotes, each told so that it's exactly one minute
long, "accompanied" by random sounds generated by David Tudor.

    Cage talked more about silence than anyone ought, but he
changed the way I listen to music forever -- and apparently,
the way a lot of people listen to music...

    /t

Tom Ritchford     tom@mvision.com, tom@weirdos.com

    Verge's "Little Idiot" -- Music for the mentally peculiar.
1-800-WEIRDOS  http://www.weirdos.com/verge  http://www.fly.net/~verge
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 08:36:00 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Peter Mueller <Peter_Mueller@UCSDLIBRARY.UCSD.EDU>
Subject:      Re[2]: Electronic <-> Electroacoustic / Cage + Harvey
Comments: To: atomic@NETCOM.COM

Alan M. Bookmiller writes--


>Oh yea! I drive my dog crazy when I'm emitting those high tones on
>especially frantic days. If it gets really hectic my garage door opens and
>closes continuously.
>
We all have had that weird sensation called ringing in the ears, right?
Most of us also probably know that sensation is caused by some of those little
hairs in our inner ears going wacko and just oscilating on their own.
Well, I've read of somewhere (I can't remember where) cases where this is so
powerful that the Dr. treating the case could faintly hear the high tone being
emmitted from the patient's head!
Ow!
-Peter
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 13:06:08 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Nathanael W Berry <nwberry@IX.NETCOM.COM>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

>Isn't this a condition called tinnitus?  I've heard both ringing (high
>pitched noise) and buzzing (low pitched) all my life as what to me is a
>natural part of a quiet environment.  I've never heard nervous system noise
>being the explanation, but I guess it makes sense;

        I am not a doctor, nor do I play one on TV, but my understanding of
tinnitus is that damaged nerves are "stuck on". The tinnitus condition masks
external sounds. Most of us have probably experienced this temporarily after
loud mixing, playing, concerts, etc - when you get to a quiter location,
your overstimulated nerves will not know what to do with themselves so they
keep on partying. Hopefully the effect will fade within an hour or two.

Nate
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 17:42:35 -0400
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         NEC_CEELY@FLO.ORG
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

You could go out to SANTA FE and hear   OMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMr
RPC
=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 30 Jul 1996 08:28:56 +1000
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         David Rodger <MUSDR@LURE.LATROBE.EDU.AU>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

> I am going to crawl back in my hole now

Is that an anechoic hole, or a live-end-dead-end? ;-)

David
musdr@lure.latrobe.edu.au
http://I'm_not_that_hip_yet!
=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 30 Jul 1996 12:52:42 +0100
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Martin Russ <mruss@MIDI.DUNGEON.COM>
Subject:      How to...
Comments: To: SYNTH-L@LISTSERV.AMERICAN.EDU

This is an edited extract from the Administration FAQ.

"How do I unsubscribe?"****************************************************

You send an E-mail to

     listserv@american.edu

with the text

     UNSUB EMUSIC-L    or     UNSUB SYNTH-L

as the body of the message.

(No special subject text is required.)

If this does not work, then please contact Joe McMahon (mcmahon@CLARK.NET).

****************************************************************************

Regards

Martin Russ (FAQ Maintainer)

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Martin Russ            Reviewer & Columnist for Sound On Sound Magazine (UK)
 mruss@midi.dungeon.com      Hi-Tech Music Technical Author & MIDI Consultant
 http://www.dungeon.com/~midi              Macintosh & Synthesizer Programmer
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 21:14:39 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Paul LaVigne <plavigne@SIRIUS.COM>
Subject:      Nervous systems and Televisions

I used to have this very weird ability as a child. I could tell if a
television was on,
say in the next room, for example, without seeing or hearing anything that was
playing on the set. I could, however, hear a very steady noise-like a cross
between
a high pitch and ringing. I don't know if it was the fact that those old
TV's pumped
out goo-gobs of who-knows-what- kind of radiation, or just something my
ears/brain
could pick up on...

Anybody else have that (I've always wondered)?.....?......?


Paul
plavigne@sirius.com

P.S. If it has anything to do with Alien abduction, contact me on a secure
channel.
=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 30 Jul 1996 05:33:11 +0200
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Paulo Mouat <mouat@MAIL.TELEPAC.PT>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

> I'm not sure everyone exhibits this "feature"; I know I do, as do
> some others to whom I have spoken.
> (...)
> I either worked with a bunch of fruitcakes (a distinct possibility),
> or they all just wanted to make me feel normal. The sound I hear is
> similar to the sound emitted by a TV transformer warming up (am I
> crazy), or some florescent lights particularly in industrial or
> commercial applications (or just a loon) (...).

I hear it too.  And I don't need to be in an anechoic chamber.  Just
should the surroundings be very quiet.

> I'm sure you're all already sick of this but you can hear Cage telling
> the anechoic room story (and a lot of others!) in the landmark piece
> "Indeterminacy."  This work is "just" a series of anecdotes (...)

Sorry, not true.  They're stories with various origins, some are
anecdotes, some aren't.  For example, there is one that is an Indian
saying, with words spaced with long pauses to account for the exact
duration (that does not make it an anecdote).

Perhaps we should end this topic by now, it has proven very subjective.
It seems natural that an unperceptible phenomenon may be a source of
much confusion and discredit to some.

Cheers!
--
  __|__
___\_/___
   ___      Paulo Mouat,
  |___|  mouat@mail.telepac.pt
  |___|
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 21:34:16 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Tony Cappellini <newshirt@BEST.COM>
Subject:      Cakewalk Pro and Windows 95/ Matrix 1000
Comments: To: cakewalk@lists.colorado.edu

I tried loading in an instrument file (.INS) for the Matrix 1000
that I downloaded from Compuserve and Cakewalk hung as I selected the
instrument filename. I treid this several times, and had the same problem.

I'm using Cakewalk Pro 3.0, is this fairly compatible with Windows 95 ?
Does anybody else have the instrument file for The Matrix 1000 ?
It's possible that mine is corrupted, but it wasn't even loaded. Cake hung
as I selected the filename, before I clicked on OK


Thanks

Tony
=========================================================================
Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 22:05:51 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Craig Marks <cmarks@UCLA.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Televisions

>I used to have this very weird ability as a child. I could tell if a
>television was on,
>say in the next room, for example, without seeing or hearing anything that was
>playing on the set. I could, however, hear a very steady noise-like a cross
>between
>a high pitch and ringing. I don't know if it was the fact that those old
>TV's pumped
>out goo-gobs of who-knows-what- kind of radiation, or just something my
>ears/brain
>could pick up on...
>
>Anybody else have that (I've always wondered)?.....?......?

Still have it!!!  Even with all my new TVs and my Computer monitor.  What
really annoyed me as a kid (not so much anymore, but occasionally) was some
sort of sonic screech related to jewelry store alarm systems!!!

                        -Craig
=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 30 Jul 1996 03:46:16 -0500
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Fred Becker <mach25@INDY.NET>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and garage doors.

One more note on this strange sounds thread.  There is a documented
phenomenon called the "meteor sound" where people report hearing a swishing
sound while witnessing meteors.  It has been called electrophonic sound by
scientists.

I heard the sound while viewing the reentry pass of a Space Shuttle flight
over Houston on its way to a Florida landing.  This was in 1984 or 1985.  In
the very early morning hours that day, there was no traffic noise, so all
was very quiet outdoors.  The Shuttle became clearly visible by its plasma
trail far off in the western sky.  As it neared the zenith, the plasma trail
could be seen flashing off and on, perhaps as the attitude control thrusters
were firing.  The plasma trail looked just like a jet contrail, only about
twice as wide, glowing, and moving at about five times the apparent rate.
The Shuttle could be seen as a bright, orange dot in the front of the trail.
I then (or perhaps earlier) could distinctly hear a steady sound, seeming to
come from the Shuttle, most comparable to the sound of snow skis.  Later as
the Shuttle augered into the sunrise, I heard two sonic booms.  I
immediately was perplexed as to how I could have heard any sound from the
Shuttle, arriving before the sonic booms!  Seeing the Shuttle reentry was an
unforgetable experience, and hearing this strange sound added some mystery
to the event.

I later learned that the sound is caused by plasma turbulence inducing very
low frequencey (VLF) radio waves that are transduced to sounds heard by
observers.  The actual mechanism may even involve vibrating plant material,
like grass, oscillating to the waves and being heard by people.

Later Shuttle flights haven't produced this sound because they haven't gone
through the banking maneuvers like the early test flights.  Scientists have
gone out with gear to try and record waves and sounds.

I've also heard the sound a few brief times while seeing meteors.  It is
very beautiful, actually.

If anyone has any experience along these lines, please email them to Colin
Key, a scientist studying the phenomenon, at PHCSLK@cc.Newcastle.edu.au.  He
calls it "geophysical electrophonics."

I'm suppose Stockhausen would call it "cosmic" sound.

Sincerely,

Fred
=========================================================================
Date:         Tue, 30 Jul 1996 12:05:16 -0700
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         David John Rosborough <drosboro@SFU.CA>
Subject:      Re: Nervous systems and Televisions
In-Reply-To:  <199607300414.VAA04334@pop1.sirius.com> from "Paul LaVigne" at
              Jul 29, 96 09:14:39 pm

> I used to have this very weird ability as a child. I could tell if a
> television was on,
> say in the next room, for example, without seeing or hearing anything that was
> playing on the set. I could, however, hear a very steady noise-like a cross
> between
> a high pitch and ringing. I don't know if it was the fact that those old

Not really all that wierd... I can hear our tv.. your dog can probably
hear it too.  All TV's and Monitors emit some high-pitched noise, but the
good quality ones are beyond human hearing limits..

TTYL
DaveR
=========================================================================
Date:         Wed, 31 Jul 1996 17:20:22 +1000
Reply-To:     Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
Sender:       Electronic Music Discussion List <EMUSIC-L@AMERICAN.EDU>
From:         Terrance McDermott <terry@KLANG.LATROBE.EDU.AU>
Subject:      Re: musicworks mag

Thanks for the tip, Peter.

Terry

