Mike -
This is the same argument used on milk, but even pasteurized milk has a dy=
namic,ever-changing biological community. So, when do you test milk?
At least with compost extract, or tea, when max growth is finsihed, there =
is a three to four day period where the organisms do not change much. ther=
re is a stable period, much like milk. Test the tea at that time, and thin=
gs are pretty stable. Put the tea into one of Nature Technology's breatha=
ble bags, and the tea stays stable for months.
Learn to use a microscope and you will see what I mean. Orr get a person o=
n staff that can fly a microscope.
Part of the problem is commercial ag, where any E. coli, pathogenic or not,=
sends the regulators through the roof. If the competitors are there, and =
conditions are aerobic, then pathogen growth will not occur. Storage condi=
tions are critical here.
Elaine R. Ingham
President, Soil Foodweb Inc.
-----Original Message-----
From: mikethewormguy <mikethewormguy_at_aol.com>
To: compost_tea <compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Mon, May 30, 2011 10:26 am
Subject: [compost_tea] Re: Anaerobic Activity
Evan,
In the leafy green world I work in, the potential Ecoli issue is a major dr=
iver. We have every acre of crop tested for generic Ecoli prior to harvest.=
The processor will not accept harvested greens without seeing the test da=
ta.
Given that AACT is a dynamic, ever changing, fermentation liquid, the reali=
ty is that this dynamic nature makes the liquid untestable. For example, yo=
u take a sample and send it to the lab on Monday. When you get the result b=
ack, the AACT will not be the same liquid you orgiginally tested. Thus the =
data you get back will not be representative of what the AACT is now.
Using AACT on leafy greens in commercial ag is taking on a big risk.
How many folks who make AACT for commercial ag have a validated and verifie=
d HACCP Plan and SSOPs ? (hint... If you do not know what I am talking abo=
ut here then than this lack of knowledge is part of the challenge).
So at the end of the day, does the grower want to accept the risk or not ?
Mike Flynn
Green Quest LLC
BioSpecific LLC
--- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, "evanfolds" <evan_at_...> wrote:
>
> Let's nail this down. I understand the logic on being wary of molasses du=
e to E. coli, but have only seen this listed on USDA websites that I person=
ally believe do nothing more than scare people.
>
> Has anyone had a specific issue with E. coli in AACT that they can share?
>
> More specifically, has anyone ever had an issue with molasses they can sh=
are?
>
> I think E. coli is a manifestation of bad compost and conditions more tha=
n anything. The same way we legislate to make it possible to put 1000 cows =
on an acre instead of 100 then blame E. coli. That
> s like blaiming the murderer on the gun..
>
> evan
> www.VortexBrewer.com
>
> --- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, "mikethewormguy" <mikethewormguy_at_> wr=
ote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Jeff,
> >
> > If memory serves, Ecoli is a facultative anaerobe that can adapt and gr=
ow in an aerobic and anaerobic environments.
> >
> > This is one of the reasons why adding simple sugars to an ACT brew proc=
ess, where the feedstock and/or equipment is contaminated with Ecoli, can r=
esult in an Ecoli bloom into the brew liquid.
> >
> > To make things more complicated, not all species of Ecoli are outlaws.
> >
> > 1 more cent.....
> >
> > Mike Flynn
> > Green Quest LLC
> > BioSpecific LLC
> >
> > --- In compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com, Jeff Lowenfels <jeff.lowenfels_at_> wr=
ote:
> > >
> > > I don't think it is so much that anaerobic microbes are all bad ( see=
. E.M.), it is just that in compost tea we don't want E. coli ,in particula=
r, and some of the other potential bad anaerobic microbes so we keep the sy=
stem aerobic.
> > >
> > > Teaming
> > >
> > > jeff
> > >
> > > Plant one row in your garden to feed the hungry. It is so easy and so=
needed:
http://www.gardenwriters.org/gwa.php?p=par/index.html (And don'=
t forget to read "Teaming WIth Microbes: The Organic Gardener's Guide to th=
e Soil Food web").
> > >
> >
>
Received on Wed Jun 01 2011 - 09:03:48 EDT