Re: Regulation of compost teas

From: Frank Teuton <fteuton_at_SYMPATICO.CA>
Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2002 10:30:34 -0500

Dear Lawrence;

Is truly high quality compost tea 'cheap and easy to make in large
quantities'?

Everything is relative, I suppose. First of all you must make sure your
compost is of high quality, which means testing, on a regular basis. That
means taking samples, sending them to one or more labs, and paying the costs
of testing and shipping. Compost for foliar disease tea should be young, so
one batch of compost could not be used throughout the growing season, so you
need an ongoing compost production process for a continual supply of young
compost.

Second, you must have a brewing device which can supply the aeration and
circulation needed for extraction and growth of the microorganisms. Assuming
you need at least a 25 gallon model, we are talking hundreds to more than a
thousand US dollars for a commercial machine.

See for example:

http://www.groworganic.com/a/a1.html?pMode=View&pCatID=21307&sCategory=114

"The System25T is the ideal size for small and mid-sized operations such as
university research, specialty nursery, retail garden center and 2-5 acre
sites. The System25T is their most affordable and portable design for
producing compost tea. Compost tea is made by mixing and aerating compost
with water and can provide significant levels of beneficial microbes,
nitrogen, phosphorus, potassium, sulfur and trace minerals as well as humic
and fulvic acids. Many brewers have tested their finished teas and have
shown an increase in microbial counts from the parent compost of up to one
thousand-fold or more!"

Unit Price E151 $1295.00

[Note that this is the machine which Vicki Bess used to grow E.coli from
10-100 MPN/ml in a supposedly aerobic environment, to up to levels as high
as 4000 MPN/ml. Questions have been and will continue to be raised about
that study, which include both DO incongruities, and choice of original
materials; Dr Ingham claims that good compost will not contain E. coli and
good brewing conditions will reduce E. coli levels rather than increase
them....Dr Brinton doesn't agree with Dr Ingham, accusing her of spreading a
'myth of aerobic'....]

Now, you also need to add to this, a good Dissolved Oxygen meter, likely one
you can connect to a computer for continuous recording of the results.
Expect to spend some time properly calibrating this tool. It is critical to
maintain oxygen levels above 5 ppm to keep the beneficial fungi alive, and
to avoid the possibility of substantial regrowth of pathogens such as E.coli
as well as anaerobes generally, which could produce phytotoxic substances.

For spraying, you will need to filter the tea through mesh which is large
enough to allow the beneficial fungi and nematodes through, and yet small
enough to prevent particulate matter from clogging the sprayer. Quite a few
folks have found declogging sprayers to be an annoying accompaniment to
compost tea work.

Having made your tea you will again need to send in a sample for testing.
After spraying you will also need to send in leaf samples to see if your
coverage is adequate. You probably should test your first three batches of
tea, then every fifth batch thereafter, as a check.

Your brewer will need to be cleaned between each batch, to prevent harmful
biofilms from developing. The sprayer also needs to be flushed after each
use. No big deal, but it is part of the extra housekeeping you need to do.

You also have to consider what is adequate worker protection. Anecdotal
evidence put forward by Dr Brinton suggests that at least, eye protection
should be worn by anyone applying or in the area of application of compost
tea. The opthalmologist I checked with on this, who was preparing a
presentation on bacterial conjunctivitis at the time, was not concerned
about this risk.

Some folks wear full protective equipment, others don't. I didn't wear
anything all this spring and early summer applying compost tea, and the only
effect I noticed was a softness of my skin after spraying. Your situation
may vary.

We did not make tea using a commercial brewer, we did not do compost
testing, leaf sampling, and tea testing, precisely because it was not 'cheap
and easy'. Our brewer set up was made using free forklift vats, with an
aeration system that cost several hundred dollars US, a simple 25 gallon
sprayer with a custom tower setup we did ourselves, and some cobbled
together screening stuff we tested using trial and error.

We didn't get control of apple scab, perhaps in part due to a late start,
some deficiency in tea quality, and a four day stretch of rain that left
everyone in 'scab city'. We stopped spraying when it appeared we not only
were not getting control, but were perhaps making the situation worse.

This doesn't mean 'compost tea doesn't work', of course. It means only that
when not properly made, tested and applied, it may not work. But it is
hardly 'cheap and easy'.

I would encourage anyone interested in compost tea to make sure they have
the costs of good equipment and adequate testing factored into their working
budget for the project. For anyone growing fresh produce outside the
'certified organic' zone, be especially careful and document your quality
control procedures.

Regulatory winds are blowing, and have now blown all compost teas from the
field of certified organic fresh fruit and vegetable production within 120
DOH. This includes not only aerobic nutrient added teas, but all other sorts
of compost teas.

Those interested in the broader scope of regulatory weather should consider
attending the following public meeting:

>FOOD SAFETY, FRUITS AND VEGETABLES, MEDICAL AND RISK ASSESSMENT
>* Foodborne Illnesses Associated with Produce - The USDA Agricultural
>Marketing Service Seta a Public Meeting for November 20 in Washington, DC
>for discussion of the Agency's Microbiological Data Program (MDP) - In
>announcing the meeting, AMS states: " ... In the past several years the
>number of foodborne illness associated with domestic and imported fresh
>fruits and vegetables has increased. Some microorganisms once thought
>under control may be adapting to their environments, may be developing
>resistance to conventional food processing operations, and may be
>re-emerging with increased pathogenicity. To respond to these concerns,
>Congress authorized an appropriation of $6.234 million for FY 2002 to fund
>a microbiological monitoring program for foodborne pathogens and indicator
>organisms on domestic and imported fruits and vegetables. The program is
>designed to collect reliable data and develop national estimates of
>bacterial contamination with regard to selected produce. The MDP is a
>voluntary data gathering program and not a regulatory or enforcement
>program. The Federal agencies; Food and Drug Administration, Centers of
>Disease Control and Prevention, USDA's National Agricultural Statistical
>Service, as well as 10 State Departments of Agriculture, industry and
>academia have provided assistance and information in formulating program
>policy and operating procedures. The program is being conducted under the
>authority of the Agricultural Marketing Act ... The proposed agenda for
>the meeting will include discussions of: (1) MDP overview and current
>status, (2) MDP sampling and testing methodology, (3) MDP Annual Summary
>Calendar Year 2002, and (4) recommendations and concerns ..." - AMS
>Contact: Martha Lamont, Monitoring Programs Office, Science and Technology
>Programs at 703 330 2300, Ext 17; fax: 703 369 0678 - USDA AMS October 28
>Federal Register:
>http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=2002_register&doc
id=02-27306-filed
>
>
>
>[Federal Register: October 28, 2002
>(Volume 67, Number 208)] [Notices]
>[Page 65777-65778]
>
>DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
>Agricultural Marketing Service
>[Docket No. ST-02-05]
>
>Microbiological Data Program; Public Meeting
>
>AGENCY: Agricultural Marketing Service, USDA.
>
>ACTION: Notice of public meeting.
>
>SUMMARY: The purpose of this notice is to notify all interested persons
>that the USDA Agricultural Marketing Service (AMS) will hold a public
>meeting to discuss the Microbiological Data Program (MDP). Specifically,
>AMS will discuss the current status of the program and invite comment and
>input regarding the MDP activities to date. This notice also sets forth
>the schedule and proposed agenda for the meeting.
>
>DATES: The public meeting will be held on Wednesday, November 20, 2002,
>from 1 to 4 p.m.
>
>ADDRESSES: The public meeting will be held at the Hilton Garden Inn,
>Georgetown meeting room, 815-14th Street, NW., Washington, DC 20005.
>
>FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Martha Lamont, Monitoring Programs
>Office, Science and Technology Programs, Agricultural Marketing
>Service, United States Department of Agriculture, 8609 Sudley Road,
>Manassas, Virginia, 20110-8411. Telephone number (703) 330-2300, Ext 17 or
>fax (703) 369-0678.
>
>SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION: In the past several years the number of
>foodborne illness associated with domestic and imported fresh fruits and
>vegetables has increased. Some microorganisms once thought under control
>may be adapting to their environments, may be developing resistance to
>conventional food processing operations, and may be re-emerging with
>increased pathogenicity. To respond to these concerns, Congress authorized
>an appropriation of $6.234 million for FY 2002 to fund a microbiological
>monitoring program for foodborne pathogens and indicator organisms on
>domestic and imported fruits and vegetables. The program is designed to
>collect reliable data and develop national estimates of bacterial
>contamination with regard to selected produce. The MDP is a voluntary data
>gathering program and not a regulatory or enforcement program. The Federal
>agencies; Food and Drug Administration, Centers of Disease Control and
>Prevention, USDA's National Agricultural Statistical Service, as well as
>10 State Departments of Agriculture, industry and academia have provided
>assistance and information in formulating program policy and operating
>procedures. The program is being conducted under the authority of the
>Agricultural Marketing Act of 1946 (7 U.S.C. 1621 et seq.).
>
> AMS is hereby giving notice of a public meeting, scheduled for
> Wednesday, November 20, 2002, in order to keep all interested persons
> advised of the current status of the program and invite comment and input
> regarding the MDP activities to date. The public meeting will begin at 1
> p.m. and is scheduled to end at 4 p.m. It will be held at the Hilton
> Garden Inn, Georgetown meeting room, 815-14th Street, NW., Washington, DC
> 20005.
>
> Those parties who wish to speak at the meeting should register on or
> before November 13, 2002 to speak, please e-mail Martha.Lamont_at_USDA.gov,
> or send a fax to Martha Lamont at (703) 330-2300, Ext 17. Registrants
> should include their name, address, and daytime telephone number.
> Depending on the number of registered speakers, time limits may be
> imposed on speakers, and speakers who have registered in advance will be
> given priority if time is limited.
>
> The proposed agenda for the meeting will include discussions of: (1)
> MDP overview and current status, (2) MDP sampling and testing
> methodology, (3) MDP Annual Summary Calendar Year 2002, and (4)
> recommendations and concerns.
>
> Registration upon arrival is necessary for all participants,
> including those who have registered to speak in advance. Speakers should
> provide one original and two copies of their presentation at
> registration. A registration desk will be located outside the meeting
> room. If you require special accommodations, such as a sign language
> interpreter, please contact the person listed under FOR FURTHER
> INFORMATION CONTACT. The meeting will be recorded, and information about
> obtaining a transcript will be provided at the meeting.
>
> Dated: October 22, 2002.
>
>A.J. Yates,
>Administrator, Agricultural Marketing Service.
>
>[FR Doc. 02-27306 Filed 10-25-02; 8:45 am]
>BILLING CODE 3410-02-P

At the same time, consider also the following remarkable research, along
with the possibility that it is not increased contamination per se, but lack
of a healthy set of competing organisms, that is resulting in "foodborne"
illnesses...

http://ibd.patientcommunity.com/features/weinstock.cfm?link_id=1786

Frank Teuton---not a believer in compost tea as 'cheap and easy', but still
a believer in the promise of it all...



----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <lfl_at_INTREX.NET>
To: <SANET-MG_at_LISTS.IFAS.UFL.EDU>
Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 4:39 PM
Subject: Re: [SANET-MG] Regulation of compost teas


> Is 24 hour compost tea efective in controlling fruit tree diseases (i.e.
> fireblight, cedar apple rust, etc.)? Since it is cheap and easy to make
> in large quantities one could cover an orchard easily with the appropriate
spray
> equipment or just set up an overhead sprinkler system and introduce the
24HCT
> into the irrigation water.
>
> --
> L.F.London
> lfl_at_intrex.net
> http://market-farming.com
> http://www.ibiblio.org/ecolandtech/pcwiki/index.php/london
>

.

Received on Tue Oct 29 2002 - 14:01:12 EST

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