[compost_tea] adware pest warning and Fungi questions

From: Ted Peterson <ted.peterson_at_tcsn.net>
Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2003 10:21:05 -0800

Elaine:

It was good to talk with you and I am pursuing the results of our conversat=
ion. Two things:

First:

You email is sending out attached adware. While this is not lethal like a =
virus, it does infect anyone's system who receives your email and it attach=
es a registry command that sends your keystrokes to the sourse of the adwar=
e. I suggest you look up Pest Patrol or some other adware blocker, install=
 it on your computer and clear out all the adware you have. If you have so=
ld ride-along rites to your email -- a perfectly legal thing to do, please =
inform the list or any recipient that you have done so.we will know that to=
 read them risks having an unwanted pest installed on our system.

I suspect it is inadvertent and you do not know it is happening.

Second:

Fungi that work in soil are not the same fungi that inhabit grains as far a=
s I can tell. What good does it do to grow fungi associated with oat or ba=
rley or any other type of grain in your tea (You suggested adding oat flour=
 to the compost. Is this only as a food source?)? What happens to these f=
ungi when applied in your soil or on your plant?

Ted Peterson
Earth-Wise/Spirit of the Earth
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: soilfoodweb_at_aol.com
  To: compost_tea_at_yahoogroups.com
  Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2003 10:52 AM
  Subject: [compost_tea] Re: Treatment for pests in Carpathian Walnuts


  I've gotten a couple e-mails like this one, so I think I'll send this to =
the group, in hopes that folks will give this to others that need help on w=
orking out the program.

> Elaine, thank you for your earlier response to several questions. I lo=
st some of the information that I really need. I have insect problems in m=
y walnut plantings: Butternut curculio, husk maggots, and maybe apple magg=
ots. I believe you mentioned the use of some bacteria, fungi, nemitode, et=
c. as a soil treatment to interrupt the life cycle. Can you help me with =
that information again, please. Any suggestions on organic sprays to help =
protect the crop from adult insects would be appreciated.
>
> Thanks! Keep up the good work!
>

> Hi Norman -
>
  Last fall, you needed to get the beneficial organisms that consume the ov=
er-wintering forms of the pests you asked about back into your litter mater=
ial and into your soil. You want to leave the litter on the soil in the fa=
ll, not rake it up, or burn it or something like that. Litter, or leaf de=
bris from your trees, is supposed to remain on the soil. The dead leaves a=
re food to feed the beneficial fungi and bacteria, which you need to form s=
tructure in the soil (so roots can grow down to the depth they are meant to=
 grow down to, not be arrested by anaerobic conditions that develop as a re=
sult of compaction at 12 to 18 inches).

  You also then need to inoculate the right aerobic biology to process nutr=
ients and return them to your plants at the rate, time and form the plant r=
equires.

  You need the beneficial organisms to combat disease-causing organisms in =
the soil, and on that leaf litter. If the good guys are not present, then =
the bad guys rule. And you have the pests and pathogens you asked about re=
igning supreme.

  So, you have to get the good guys back. The good guys DO NOT return fast=
 enough on their own. You CANNOT assay for the good guys by using plate co=
unts or microbial biomass as assessed by chloroform fumigation. Do not be =
mis-lead by "soils" people that try to use these methods of assessment to n=
egate a true understanding of what is going on in soil, and with soil life.=
   

  The papers presented at the Soils meetings this last fall were laughable.=
  They concluded that soil life doesn't change when you plow, or when you a=
dd an incoulum of organisms. But they used methods that couldn't possibly =
tell them about these things. I just shake my head when someone uses chlo=
roform fumigation to assess microbial biomass in soil. They are measuring =
soil organic matter, and really, not much else. I think plate methods are =
idiotic for trying to assess species diversity of bacteria or fungi, imagin=
e what I think about something that tries to make statements about biology =
based on the CO2 being produced from the microbial biomass killed by the ch=
loroform. Especially since the fungal hyphae are usually not even touched =
by the organism that survive fumigation - and thus the fungal biomass is al=
most completely ignored by this particular method.

  Anyway, back to the point.

  So you didn't get compost or compost tea, or an inoculum of bacterial be=
neficials on the litter last fall? Or maybe you have tried tea, but it "di=
dn't work". Well, you didn't get enough on, the tea wasn't good quality - =
didn't have the proper biology to displace the disease organisms or begin t=
he process of decomposition - or you have toxic chemicals in the soil that =
killed the added biology.

  In any case, the presence of the diseases tell you that you DON'T have th=
e proper biology present to protect the trees.

  So, start this spring ASAP. As soon as the ground temperature is about 4=
5 F, apply about 20 gal/ac of good tea to the litter and the soil. If it's=
 really good tea, you can put 15 gal/ac. There is some benefit in testing =
the tea then, to know what amount you need to put on....

  And it would be good to know where you are starting from, in the soil, to=
 know if addition of the tea or compost improved anything, and whether you =
have a toxic chemical present in your soil that has to get dealt with befor=
e you can get the biology to do their improvements for the soil and your pl=
ants.

  So, apply 15 to 20 gal/ac to the soil. Then, check the VAM colonization =
of the roots of your plants. If you need to improve the mycorrhizal coloni=
zation of hte roots, do some under-cutting of weeds, but also inject tea wi=
th VAM spores in it. You get the weeds and help the trees at the same tim=
e.

  Plant a fungal-dominated over-story crop plant - like strawberry, or thym=
e, or lavender (a SHORT cultivar, from seed, not bunches, please), or marjo=
ram, or some other native perennial herb (get Kirk to help you choose a goo=
d native).

  About the time bud swell occurs, you want to do a foliar tea spray, at ab=
out 5 gallons per ac for each 6 foot height of tree. If the trees are real=
ly bushy and wide, then adjust appropriately.

  When budbreak occurs, you want to get out with a second application of te=
a. If there is no disease early in the psring, you can wait another month =
to spray. When disease "season" comes upon you (listen to the Extension fo=
lks, they'll tell you when the diseases start blooming, or the pests start =
to take off), then you need to spray every week if diseases or pests are ba=
d. Every two weeks through a disease season, if the disease is present bu=
t not too bad. If you have perfect conditions for disease, then you may ne=
ed to double up sprays, and do twice a week for a week or so.

  We have a paper coming out on the work we did with JUST foliar sprays in =
vineyards. We didn't do anything about the disease inoculum in the soil in=
 that study, and so we didn't get full protection. The study proved that y=
ou need to do something about the disease in the orchard soil. Don't list=
en to the people who want to claim that the study shows that compost tea do=
esn't work. Sigh. Foliar applications of tea can only do so much. That's=
 what the study was about. Could just foliar sprays deal with the problems=
? The answer is no, you have to do the soil drenches as well.

  Anyway, in succeeding years, if you stop chemical spraying (and that incl=
udes herbicides - no more Round-Up!), then you maintain and improve soil li=
fe. Weeds exit the system, because you get rid of the excess nitrate that =
helps so many of the weed species germinate and out-compete the crop you ar=
e trying to grow.

  But remember, nature abhors bare soil, and Mother Nature will send weeds =
into a place that you are disturbing. Tillage and use of toxic chemicals k=
ills the organisms that help trees grow, so the less tillage and toxic chem=
cials you use, the less weed you have. But you have to avoid bare soil. =
Plant that perennial cover-crop under the trees. Grass in the driving row.

  For more infomration on the details of these intereactions, more how and =
why and mechanism for why these things work, please come take a SFI course.

  We have a course in San Mateo the end of January. Please see our web sit=
e (www.soilfoodweb.com) for details. Or come to ACRES next year. Arden An=
derson and I will be doing a 3 day course on intergrating soil chemistry an=
d soil biology into one smooth program that will solve both soil chemistry =
and soil biology problems without harming the biology.

  Or at least, we'll get you thinking about how to do it. We might not hav=
e the perfect system for you, in Michigan, figured out yet. But it will be=
 the cutting edge course on this new approach in agriculture.

  The best part is, this Biological Agriculture works. It is less expensiv=
e, getting you back to using your own resources to make your orchard produc=
tive. Doesn't mean you throw out the pesticides (copper sulfate is a pesti=
cide, but it is allowed on organic farms). Sometimes plagues happen, and =
then you need the toxics. But if you use a toxic chemcial you have to then=
 use compost or compost tea to put back the beneficial biology you just kil=
led. And you have to then give them time to recover and get back to work. =
  

  Sort of like recovering from Christmas, and now trying to get back to wor=
k. I don't wanna!

  Feel free to ask more questions if this isn't clear. Or find an SFI advi=
sor near you to help you with the details. The advisors are listed on the =
SFI website - www.soilfoodweb.com

  Elaine Ingham
  President, Soil Foodweb Inc.
  SFI Corvallis, OR
  SFI Port Jefferson, NY
  SFI Lismore, NSW, Australia
  SFI Hilversum, The Netherlands
  SFI Cambridge, New Zealand
  www.soilfoodweb.com

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Received on Wed Dec 31 2003 - 15:01:22 EST

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