Meadville Space Center

Orbiter Mars Direct => Planning => Topic started by: Zachstar on November 21, 2005, 05:35:13 PM



Title: Hab to the moon
Post by: Zachstar on November 21, 2005, 05:35:13 PM
(http://kimages.be/share/89582233.jpg)

Just like the ISS one I'd like to know how the moon hab will differ from the mars hab.


Title: Greenhouse inflatable specs
Post by: Iceversaka on December 06, 2005, 06:38:52 PM
Well for one the inflatable greenhouse will have new specs.

I think it was designed for one ATM on Mars.

Seth


Title: Hab to the moon
Post by: smoothvirus on December 09, 2005, 11:53:13 AM
From the Mars Direct plan:

Quote
The same equipment could be used to establish a lunar base - in fact it could be tested comprehensively on the moon before committing to the Mars expedition. In the lunar scenario the Ares booster could launch a 59 tonne payload consisting of the standard Habitation Module with a Lunar orbital capture and lunar descent (LOC/LD) stage. The LOC/LD stage would land the Habitation Module on the Moon. A crew could then be flown to the Moon using an ERV with an LOC/LD stage. This ERV used only the second stage of the Mars ERV for Earth return direct from the lunar surface.


So you'd need a LOC/LD stage for the Hab module, and remove the folding heatshield. As for the ERV - well, in our version of Mars Direct we don't launch the Ares booster manned. So I'm not sure how that would work. The only reason to send an Mars Direct ERV to the Moon would be for test for a Mars mission - otherwise it would be overkill.


Title: Hab to the moon
Post by: Warm Icepack on December 09, 2005, 06:32:44 PM
Quote from: smoothvirus
From the Mars Direct plan:

Quote
The same equipment could be used to establish a lunar base - in fact it could be tested comprehensively on the moon before committing to the Mars expedition. In the lunar scenario the Ares booster could launch a 59 tonne payload consisting of the standard Habitation Module with a Lunar orbital capture and lunar descent (LOC/LD) stage. The LOC/LD stage would land the Habitation Module on the Moon. A crew could then be flown to the Moon using an ERV with an LOC/LD stage. This ERV used only the second stage of the Mars ERV for Earth return direct from the lunar surface.


So you'd need a LOC/LD stage for the Hab module, and remove the folding heatshield. As for the ERV - well, in our version of Mars Direct we don't launch the Ares booster manned. So I'm not sure how that would work. The only reason to send an Mars Direct ERV to the Moon would be for test for a Mars mission - otherwise it would be overkill.

I think NASA would be more likely to launch a CEV/LSAM combo to return from the lunar hab over building an ERV that would never see mars.


Title: Hab to the moon
Post by: Zachstar on March 19, 2006, 03:09:59 AM
Indeed an ERV for the moon is WAY overkill.

Interesting info there.


Title: Hab to the moon
Post by: aftercolumbia on April 07, 2006, 01:31:11 PM
A Mars ERV on the moon would actually be dead on the surface.  it counts on the carbon dioxide atmosphere to make the return propellants.  Zubrin's idea was to have a lunar landing stage topped by a fully fuelled ERV booster second stage and ERV.  An interesting one I just thought of is a Greenstar 3rd stage with a landing stage and a Sprint with high energy heatshield and a Crew Ferry Service Module.  This package, fully fuelled, woud come in at about 40 tonnes.

Obviously, as the whole point of the MD ERV is to manufacture its propellants on Mars, testing on the Moon would be pointless.  The Hab wouldn't be so pointless, however, Mars landing relies upon the biggest ringsail parachute yet considered, along with an aeroshield, niether of which are of any use on the Moon.  The other aspects of testing the Hab on the Moon, most of which have been tested at Flashline and MDRS already.  The most useful thing I can think of would be to perfect the automated/semi-automated deployment of the ERV reactor (I'm assuming a hi-fi dummy simulator for cost and environmental reasons) and Hab landing VOR/ILS transmitters.  This can be done without landing a full blown ERV on the Moon.  You could if you wanted to, but it wouldn't be able to return because it has no fuel.  Also, there's no reason why the ERV can't be boosted to Devon island on the C-5A Galaxy fully reusable launch vehicle, where it could practice deploying the dummy reactor.