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Author Topic: Apollo 8 Beta Testing Bugs  (Read 18703 times)
jalexb88
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« Reply #180 on: February 12, 2017, 05:29:06 PM »

@jalexb88 Did you make some already for launch/TLI?  If so how did the checklists workout after I changed them using the actual ones?

Yes they are committed up to LOI-1. The checklists are fine except very minor things like the double C&W checklist witch you already corrected. The only other thing I can think of is that there is no direction to put FDAI#1 from orb rate back to inertial after TLI is complete.
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #181 on: February 12, 2017, 07:44:05 PM »

The only other thing I can think of is that there is no direction to put FDAI#1 from orb rate back to inertial after TLI is complete.

I was curious about this too since the TLI checklist does not have this part.  I remember adding that "secure ordeal" after TLI originally and I removed it to match the actual checklist because I do not know when they actually did switch it back to inertial or secure for TLC.  I will do a little more research and see if I can get an answer, if not, I will throw in switching it back to inertial for TLC in preparation for the next MCC.
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jalexb88
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« Reply #182 on: February 14, 2017, 10:54:34 AM »

I was curious about this too since the TLI checklist does not have this part.  I remember adding that "secure ordeal" after TLI originally and I removed it to match the actual checklist because I do not know when they actually did switch it back to inertial or secure for TLC.  I will do a little more research and see if I can get an answer, if not, I will throw in switching it back to inertial for TLC in preparation for the next MCC.

I just made a pull request with a modification to the Apollo 8 checklists. It does not affect your latest changes, I just modified a few things between MCC-4 and TEI.
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #183 on: February 14, 2017, 11:48:19 AM »

I just made a pull request with a modification to the Apollo 8 checklists. It does not affect your latest changes, I just modified a few things between MCC-4 and TEI.

I have a few edits to TLI as well, nothing major just smoothing out timing of hidden delays and the like.  I will fold them into your modifications and make my own pull request after
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #184 on: February 14, 2017, 12:09:00 PM »

I found an interesting discrepancy, we used the apollo 15 launch checklist to configure for launch I am assuming.  Based on that, the pyro arm switches are turned on as part of the pre launch checklist.  However, lacking a pre launch checklist for apollo 8, I am wondering if this was done.  I noticed that the pyro arm switches are up for the entire portion of launch, TLI, and SEP.  Nowhere in the 8 TLI checklist does it say to either arm or safe these switches.  Were they possibly left locked in the up position throughout these events and power controlled through the breakers (the arm breakers are positioned via the checklist)?
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indy91
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« Reply #185 on: February 14, 2017, 12:57:00 PM »

Pretty sure all other lunar missions got a "Go for Pyro Arm" before TLI, during the TLI Prep checklist. Apollo 8 didn't seem to have gotten this call. So maybe they controlled it with the breakers.

The Translunar Procedures document (see http://www.ibiblio.org/mscorbit/mscforum/index.php?topic=983.msg23769#msg23769) has the switches in safe and that checklist begins after TLI.
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jalexb88
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« Reply #186 on: February 15, 2017, 02:11:24 PM »

I have a few edits to TLI as well, nothing major just smoothing out timing of hidden delays and the like.  I will fold them into your modifications and make my own pull request after

Just flying re-entry right now. The "Final Entry Pad, CSM and LM state vectors, entry target" should be before the EMS Initialization and RSI test & setup (right after Update DET up, to EI). Or else we are using the preliminary PAD to setup the EMS, we want to use the final PAD for that.
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #187 on: February 15, 2017, 05:26:39 PM »

flying re-entry right now. The "Final Entry Pad, CSM and LM state vectors, entry target" should be before the EMS Initialization and RSI test & setup (right after Update DET up, to EI). Or else we are using the preliminary PAD to setup the EMS, we want to use the final PAD for that.

You are correct, consider it fixed!  Just need to make sure the timing still flows right.  Give it a whirl since you have an active entry scn?

* Apollo 8 Checklists.xls (821.5 KB - downloaded 52 times.)
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jalexb88
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« Reply #188 on: February 15, 2017, 08:27:06 PM »

You are correct, consider it fixed!  Just need to make sure the timing still flows right.  Give it a whirl since you have an active entry scn?

Just flew with the changes, looks good! Ill be pushing my scenarios in the next few hours. I just added one thing to the Apollo 8 checklists and I posted it here to run it by you. All I did was added a "EI - XXhXXmin" in heading 2 for things that are mission time dependent so that if we do the entry preparation checklists on our own, say after an abort, it will be easier to know when to do the various mission time dependent items since in those cases the mission time is no longer valid.  For example the IMU align at entry minus 1h35:

                                                                                              Heading 2
P52 IMU Realign (REFSMMAT)   522600   MISSION_TIME         EI - 1h35min            -1   1   P52 IMU Realign (REFSMMAT)

* Apollo 8 Checklists.xls (821.5 KB - downloaded 127 times.)
« Last Edit: February 15, 2017, 08:31:07 PM by jalexb88 » Logged
rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #189 on: February 15, 2017, 11:24:51 PM »


Just flew with the changes, looks good! Ill be pushing my scenarios in the next few hours. I just added one thing to the Apollo 8 checklists and I posted it here to run it by you. All I did was added a "EI - XXhXXmin" in heading 2 for things that are mission time dependent so that if we do the entry preparation checklists on our own, say after an abort, it will be easier to know when to do the various mission time dependent items since in those cases the mission time is no longer valid.  For example the IMU align at entry minus 1h35:

                                                                                              Heading 2
P52 IMU Realign (REFSMMAT)   522600   MISSION_TIME         EI - 1h35min            -1   1   P52 IMU Realign (REFSMMAT)


Good idea!  Also do you have an entry scn handy I could play with?  I cleared my quicksaves Sad
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jalexb88
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« Reply #190 on: February 15, 2017, 11:47:30 PM »

Good idea!  Also do you have an entry scn handy I could play with?  I cleared my quicksaves Sad

Here you go


* Apollo 8 - 13 - Entry Interface T+146h40min.scn (107.93 KB - downloaded 52 times.)
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indy91
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« Reply #191 on: February 16, 2017, 07:09:46 AM »

Scenarios are merged. I think the updated Checklist MFD file is still missing though, right?
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #192 on: February 16, 2017, 08:58:45 AM »

Scenarios are merged. I think the updated Checklist MFD file is still missing though, right?

Yes, doing my last run through TLI now.

EDIT:  So in regards to the pyro safing, I used the TLI checklist primarily and then added in the safing of the pyros at the end of the SEP checklist instead of A) not at all as per the actual TLI checklist and B) right after SEP as per the Translunar LOI TEI Procedures.  I think this preserves the timeline for the user and still safes the systems after TLI.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2017, 09:37:05 AM by rcflyinghokie » Logged
indy91
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« Reply #193 on: February 16, 2017, 09:52:17 AM »

EDIT:  So in regards to the pyro safing, I used the TLI checklist primarily and then added in the safing of the pyros at the end of the SEP checklist instead of A) not at all as per the actual TLI checklist and B) right after SEP as per the Translunar LOI TEI Procedures.  I think this preserves the timeline for the user and still safes the systems after TLI.

That works. We can do it "properly" for later missions and base the Apollo 10+ TLI checklist on the Apollo 12 Launch Checklist, which is the next one we have. And with that, we are really feature complete now.
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #194 on: February 16, 2017, 10:30:35 AM »

The only issue I see with the scn files so far (and it is very trivial) is that the RCS Logic breakers are in during most of the mission.  They should be opened after CM/SIVB sep and I believe not closed again until CM RCS checks before CM/SM sep.  I can fix this if you all want.

On another note, the 8 CMP checklist has the NONESS BUS being switched to MN B before P40 SPS burns.  However I cannot find mention of the NONESS breaker being closed.  Would it be safe to assume this breaker was closed before launch since no other documentation (that I have seen) mentions the NONESS breaker?

EDIT:  I have fixed the scn files to reflect the RCS LOGIC breakers but will hold off on making a pull request until I have more info about this NONESS breaker, in which I might as well close it in the files for completion.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2017, 11:04:12 AM by rcflyinghokie » Logged
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