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Author Topic: LM G&C checklists anywhere?  (Read 896 times)
macieksoft
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« on: January 13, 2018, 02:46:38 PM »

I am looking for something like G&C checklist for LEM, i want to learn on how to set up things for lunar liftoff and so on.
Are there any materials that could help me understand on how to get the things working? I am also interested in rendezvous.

The G&C checklist for CSM was a very nice help for me to understand on how to do things in CSM, now i am looking for something similar for LEM.
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abr35
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2018, 03:59:47 PM »

Right here: https://history.nasa.gov/afj/ap12fj/pdf/a12_lm_g&n.pdf

It's LM G&N Dictionary for Apollo 12. Same format as the CM G&N Checklists. I've used it a lot and it's very consistent with the Luminary version in NASSP. The Apollo 15 DELCO manual on ALSJ is also helpful. Managed to rendezvous with the CM (and whiff plenty more times  ROTFL) using a combination of the two for help.
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macieksoft
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« Reply #2 on: January 14, 2018, 07:43:42 AM »

It seems to be missing lunar liftoff program description.
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indy91
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« Reply #3 on: January 14, 2018, 09:22:20 AM »

The AOH Volume II (https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/LM11HandbookVol2.pdf) also has all the procedures, but in more detail than the flown checklists would have.
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macieksoft
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« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2018, 09:25:06 AM »

How to setup P57 for luna liftoff? Which P57 options should i set?
Is star and gravity option a correct choice?
Should i do landing site, preferred or refsmatt option alignment?

After enteire guidance system powerdown and then powerup what should i do to get liftoff with P12 (at this moment i dont care about AGS)

I know i will need P57 to align IMU, uplink clock, uplink CSM sv, config DAP.
Will i need to uplink LM sv or maybe P57 will find out SV or the LM?
Are there any other requirements (i mean CMC related things)?
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indy91
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« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2018, 09:58:23 AM »

Most of your questions will probably be answered by following the Apollo 11 Lunar Surface Checklist (https://www.hq.nasa.gov/alsj/a11/a11sur.pdf).

You probably don't have to do much with the CMC if you want to try an LM active rendezvous. Also note that we currently still have issues with P57. It seems to not give very accurate results when using the AOT spirale. Maybe something is wrong with it, somehow. But otherwise you should be able to follow the real Apollo 11 procedures.
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macieksoft
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« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2018, 11:51:28 AM »

Why those checklist include doing P57 3 times with various options?
Is powered ascent possible with doing it once? Which option to select?

I am quite confused after reading this checklist.
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2018, 01:58:30 PM »

Why those checklist include doing P57 3 times with various options?
Is powered ascent possible with doing it once? Which option to select?

I am quite confused after reading this checklist.

I was in the same boat as you when i was running through 11.  Remember that this was the first actual use of a P57 on the surface of the moon, so they were checking their alignment and making sure it worked properly using different techniques.  They were also done before any liftoff, or possible liftoff, so it was performed before the simulated countdown as well.  And then of course you had the lunar surface align with was done for those liftoff times. 

If you want to do it once, you should use an option 4 with gravity and star I believe and that will get you close, but as indy91 pointed out, the spiral in the AOT doesnt give wonderful results and typically results in an incorrect alignment which is seen with a larger relative inclination after liftoff.  From my experience, the alignment is not bad enough to prevent rendezvous, it just creates a few larger than nominal out of plane components during the maneuvers.

If you want to "cheat" there is a way I found to get a good alignment that circumvents the lunar surface align problem and that is do a lunar surface align per the checklists and quicksave after your last alignment on the surface.  Then proceed with a launch and once in orbit, perform a P52.  Record the gyro torquing angles and revert to your previous quicksave.  There, perform a V42 with those angles and your alignment will be spot on (assuming you has a good P52 Wink )
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macieksoft
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« Reply #8 on: January 17, 2018, 05:02:47 PM »

What is the correct current draw from batts 5 and 6 during ascent? I think i got a little overcurrent there or maybe just batts are discharged a little too much.
Should the RR with both heaters be turned on during enteire ascent?
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2018, 06:17:13 PM »

What is the correct current draw from batts 5 and 6 during ascent? I think i got a little overcurrent there or maybe just batts are discharged a little too much.
Should the RR with both heaters be turned on during enteire ascent?

Its not just you, we have had low voltage on the ascent batteries for a long time, something is not right with the power draws or the configuration we don't know for sure yet. 

As far as the RR, both heaters should be running, but the radar breakers themselves were a subject of debate on some missions.  11, for example, made a change and had the crew open the RR breakers (not the heaters) before ascent and then close them after insertion.
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thewonderidiot
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« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2018, 08:03:34 PM »

That was due to a misunderstanding of the cause of the program alarms, right?
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2018, 08:52:54 PM »

That was due to a misunderstanding of the cause of the program alarms, right?

I need to review the transcript again but I think that is correct.
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eddievhfan1984
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« Reply #12 on: January 22, 2018, 07:46:50 PM »

Why's the spiral alignment so inaccurate? Are we using the right viewport size for the spiral?
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macieksoft
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« Reply #13 on: January 23, 2018, 12:14:17 PM »

We could try to experiment with different FOV settings.

And regarding spiral, do i have to put those readouts from AOT into AGC by hand (key them in trough DSKY) or it gonna do it automatically when pressing MARK buttons just like it does in CM?
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rcflyinghokie
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« Reply #14 on: January 23, 2018, 01:35:43 PM »

We could try to experiment with different FOV settings.

And regarding spiral, do i have to put those readouts from AOT into AGC by hand (key them in trough DSKY) or it gonna do it automatically when pressing MARK buttons just like it does in CM?

We have played with some FOV settings but no good luck yet for spiral angles.

And yes you will have to put them in by hand just follow the checklist.
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