Article 28681 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!hammer.uoregon.edu!feed.textport.net!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Lawrence Freeman Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Few bees question. Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 07:43:10 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3A9DFD8E.DA0128AC@2530.net> Reply-To: lawrence.freeman@2530.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <20010219230927.02938.00001829@ng-fy1.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 25 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28681 Blue Taz37 wrote: > > Why are the bees are Black in Winter than in the Summer? Does this mean Black > tail bees live longer during the Winter than light Three band? Was some of it > are the same one which staying in the hive long in the dark place with out Sun > which might cause the tail black? > Last Fall there were alot of nice looking one and this coming Feb. there was > alots of ugly Black Tails Bees. ( Are mean too ) > > One fellow said he check his hive this week and one of it empty. The bees are > gone and there were alot of it worker die inside the comb about 5" circle head > first. But, still have plenty of honey and pollen. ( cold spell ? ) > Tim Head in the comb normally indicates starvation! -- Kind regards Lawrence Freeman ----------------------------------------------------------------- Lawrence Freeman - Senior Manager, Hosting & Application Services e-Net Software - http://www.enetgroup.co.uk Tel:- +44-1225-484449 Fax:- +44-1225-484944 ----------------------------------------------------------------- Article 28682 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!EU.net!blackbush.xlink.net!uni-erlangen.de!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!63.100.169.102!not-for-mail From: "BeeFarmer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Hive Beatles Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 10:06:28 -0500 Lines: 26 Message-ID: <97lohm$pnahc$1@ID-66812.news.dfncis.de> Reply-To: "BeeFarmer" NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.100.169.102 X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983459191 26978860 63.100.169.102 (16 [66812]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28682 I have a delicate question that I would like to query all. I have recently placed an order for bees in the mid part of Alabama. Before I ordered them I asked if there were any problems with Hive Beatles and was told not yet. Well, I spoke with some folks who told me that if I ordered them that I might as well have the Bee inspector standing by as they didn't think I should do so. I guess at this point I was being made feel like if I bought them in I was going to be the ass end of a jackass. Well, to make a story longer, the person I purchased them from has already charged them to my VISA and I won't see the bees until April sometime. I particularly don't want to hear I told you so and be blamed for infesting the area with beetles. So the question is... what chances are there that I will get a package for of beetles?? If the they were shipped with Checkmite+ I would expect less chance of getting them however, what real effect will a strip have on a package during the short period they are packaged? -- BeeFarmer BeeFarmer@HomeStead.Com http://www.homestead.com/BeeKeepers/Opening.html Article 28683 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!not-for-mail From: jwg6@cornell.edu (JG in NY) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: 1 Mar 2001 21:59:10 GMT Organization: Cornell University Lines: 32 Sender: verified_for_usenet@cornell.edu (jwg6 on syr-24-95-169-25.twcny.rr.com) Message-ID: <97mgne$3d3$1@news01.cit.cornell.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: syr-24-95-169-25.twcny.rr.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Trace: news01.cit.cornell.edu 983483950 3491 24.95.169.25 (1 Mar 2001 21:59:10 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news01.cit.cornell.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 1 Mar 2001 21:59:10 GMT X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.9 (Released Version) (x86 32bit) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28683 You're correct, in that there is too much depth to the boxes, as compared to the frames. The actual dimensions do vary, however, from lot to lot, and from mfr. to mfr. You could rip just over an eighth of an inch off the _bottom_ of the boxes on a table saw, if you want. I've often done this, when there was considerably more than 1/8" space below the frames. (Technically, the bee space should be mainly above the frames when they are in place.) Not sure why this discrepancy is perpetuated, but perhaps it has something to do with the wood in the frames expanding. In article <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com>, you say... > >I am building some deep (9 5/8") supers. However, I note >that the frames, including the bar, are 9 1/8", thus leaving >1/2" (4/8") for vertical beespace. Now, my researches indicate >that if beespace is less than 1/4", the bees will propolize it, >and if more than 1/4", they will fill it with comb. Hanging the >frame at a midpoint in the box, so as to leave 1/4" beespace on >top of the frame and 1/4" below the frame seems to be a solution >which provides the required beespace at both top and bottom -- >and it is -- but only if the supers are not stacked. When they >are stacked the 1/4" space at the top of the bottom super combines >with the 1/4" space at the bottom of the top super to give an >unacceptable 1/2". > >So my stupid questions are: Why isn't 9 3/8" the proper height >for a super? Or, if we leave the super the same size, why not >enlarge the frame to 9 3/8"? Boxes could then be stacked without >violating beespace. Article 28684 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnitebee" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: new listing Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 15:57:06 -0500 Lines: 21 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.34 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.34 Message-ID: <3a9eb79f_1@news.cybertours.com> X-Trace: 1 Mar 2001 15:57:03 -0500, 64.208.65.34 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.98.63.6 Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!news.cybertours.com!64.208.65.34 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28684 Greetings! Market Intelligence for the World's Agriculture Industry http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/html/marketreport.htm Regards, Herb/Norma Herb/Norma Bee Holly-B Apiary PO Box 26 Wells,Maine 04090-0026 "an educated consumer is YOUR best customer" The Beekeeper's Home on the Internet http://www.mainebee.com Stony Critters http://www.stonycritters.com Betty's Driftwood Santa Site http://pages.ivillage.com/santasite/index.html Article 28685 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!lester.appstate.edu!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Hive Beatles Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 19:01:18 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 31 Message-ID: <3a9e9ba8.439295885@news1.radix.net> References: <97lohm$pnahc$1@ID-66812.news.dfncis.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: p8.a4.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28685 On Thu, 1 Mar 2001 10:06:28 -0500, "BeeFarmer" wrote: >I have a delicate question that I would like to query all. I have recently >placed an order for bees in the mid part of Alabama. Before I ordered them >I asked if there were any problems with Hive Beatles and was told not yet. >Well, I spoke with some folks who told me that if I ordered them that I >might as well have the Bee inspector standing by as they didn't think I >should do so. I guess at this point I was being made feel like if I bought >them in I was going to be the ass end of a jackass. Well, to make a story >longer, the person I purchased them from has already charged them to my VISA >and I won't see the bees until April sometime. > >I particularly don't want to hear I told you so and be blamed for infesting >the area with beetles. So the question is... what chances are there that I >will get a package for of beetles?? If the they were shipped with >Checkmite+ I would expect less chance of getting them however, what real >effect will a strip have on a package during the short period they are >packaged? > >-- >BeeFarmer >BeeFarmer@HomeStead.Com >http://www.homestead.com/BeeKeepers/Opening.html This is just a followup question. If hive beetles are shipped in a package will they be in the cluster of bees or will they be scurrying around in the package among the dead bees? beekeep Article 28686 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.mindspring.net.MISMATCH!news.mindspring.net!not-for-mail From: Beeginner Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Building Boxes Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 13:58:00 -0800 Organization: MindSpring Enterprises Lines: 17 Message-ID: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 3f.35.ec.de Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Server-Date: 1 Mar 2001 21:46:23 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.06 [en] (Win95; I) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28686 I am building some deep (9 5/8") supers. However, I note that the frames, including the bar, are 9 1/8", thus leaving 1/2" (4/8") for vertical beespace. Now, my researches indicate that if beespace is less than 1/4", the bees will propolize it, and if more than 1/4", they will fill it with comb. Hanging the frame at a midpoint in the box, so as to leave 1/4" beespace on top of the frame and 1/4" below the frame seems to be a solution which provides the required beespace at both top and bottom -- and it is -- but only if the supers are not stacked. When they are stacked the 1/4" space at the top of the bottom super combines with the 1/4" space at the bottom of the top super to give an unacceptable 1/2". So my stupid questions are: Why isn't 9 3/8" the proper height for a super? Or, if we leave the super the same size, why not enlarge the frame to 9 3/8"? Boxes could then be stacked without violating beespace. Article 28687 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: Thu, 01 Mar 2001 23:35:29 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 26 Message-ID: <3a9edc56.455853635@news1.radix.net> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p9.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28687 On Thu, 01 Mar 2001 13:58:00 -0800, Beeginner wrote: >I am building some deep (9 5/8") supers. However, I note >that the frames, including the bar, are 9 1/8", thus leaving >1/2" (4/8") for vertical beespace. Now, my researches indicate >that if beespace is less than 1/4", the bees will propolize it, >and if more than 1/4", they will fill it with comb. Hanging the >frame at a midpoint in the box, so as to leave 1/4" beespace on >top of the frame and 1/4" below the frame seems to be a solution >which provides the required beespace at both top and bottom -- >and it is -- but only if the supers are not stacked. When they >are stacked the 1/4" space at the top of the bottom super combines >with the 1/4" space at the bottom of the top super to give an >unacceptable 1/2". > >So my stupid questions are: Why isn't 9 3/8" the proper height >for a super? Or, if we leave the super the same size, why not >enlarge the frame to 9 3/8"? Boxes could then be stacked without >violating beespace. Because it is a lot easier to break burr comb than propolis. Shave an 1/8 inch off a super and leave it on a hive for awhile. beekeep Article 28688 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 23 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: morristh@aol.com (MORRISTH) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 02 Mar 2001 03:02:55 GMT References: <95ekgq$gqaub$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Acquired Allergies Message-ID: <20010301220255.04229.00000119@ng-mg1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28688 >Of course I believe the least expensive insurance against >> anaphylactic shock is to get plenty of bee stings I can not speak for Bee Stings--at least not yet--Ive had two so far both of what I would term "normal" in that I was sore for about 4 hrs, then really sore for another 4, then ichy for the next day. The swelling was moderate on the arm--the finger sting was a tad worse in that the swelling which lasted a day made it so that my hand was difficult to close fully. However let us digress for a min into the area of seafood. I am deathly allergic to shrimp--so much so that the smell of it cooking will send me into shock. Now as a child I ate shrimp several times with no reaction, then with a mild reaction and finally with a serious reaction that actually resulted in hospitalization. Now I am NOT saying beestings work the same way or dont work that way. But I am saying that it may be that for some people, the "many sting" theory may cause the problem. I for one prefer NOT to get stung and will wear the appropriate clothing etc to minimize this. I realize that gloves for some are clumsy-but then again I live in gloves, so Im used to working with them on. TIM MORRIS Article 28689 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 21 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: morristh@aol.com (MORRISTH) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 02 Mar 2001 01:54:11 GMT References: <3A945D85.3F16944C@bellsouth.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: What is the best Breed? Message-ID: <20010301205411.04332.00000086@ng-mg1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28689 >I would like to know what is the best breed of HoneyBee, for living in >central Florida. Dave, I too am new to beekeeping having gotten my first hive the day after Thanksgiving of 2000 and my second hive about 3 weeks later. What I can tell you so far about Breeds is this--ask 3 different beekeepers ANY question and you will get 5 different answers :O) Seriously though-get a good book and read about the differences in the various strains of bees, then choose the one that seems to best suit your own tastes. I have had the Italians suggested to me by many because they are "more gentle" and "less likely to swarm". We shall see. In any case--WELCOME to beekeeping. TIM MORRIS Article 28690 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 13 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: bobpursley@aol.com (Bob Pursley) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 02 Mar 2001 13:12:03 GMT References: <20010301220255.04229.00000119@ng-mg1.aol.com> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com X-Newsreader: Session Scheduler Subject: Re: Acquired Allergies Message-ID: <20010302081203.13562.00000045@nso-fm.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28690 In article <20010301220255.04229.00000119@ng-mg1.aol.com>, morristh@aol.com (MORRISTH) writes: > >>Of course I believe the least expensive insurance against >>> anaphylactic shock is to get plenty of bee stings > > This certainly is not backed by any medical research findings, and it most certainly didnt work for Karl von Frisch, one of the great bee scientists of this century. Bob Pursley Article 28691 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!news.Arizona.EDU!not-for-mail From: John Edwards Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 12:34:11 -0700 Organization: Hayden Bee Research Center, USDA-ARS,Tucson, Arizona Lines: 42 Message-ID: <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: feral-bee.tucson.ars.ag.gov Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28691 My view - from over 30 years of handling bee equipment around the bee lab - is that maintaining the bee space has almost become a lost art. Wet (green) lumber has something to do with it, but many hives are manufactured with strange dimensions inside. Differing rabbets, frames, etc. also may change the situation. Beeginner wrote: > I am building some deep (9 5/8") supers. However, I note > that the frames, including the bar, are 9 1/8", thus leaving > 1/2" (4/8") for vertical beespace. Now, my researches indicate > that if beespace is less than 1/4", the bees will propolize it, > and if more than 1/4", they will fill it with comb. Hanging the > frame at a midpoint in the box, so as to leave 1/4" beespace on > top of the frame and 1/4" below the frame seems to be a solution > which provides the required beespace at both top and bottom -- > and it is -- but only if the supers are not stacked. When they > are stacked the 1/4" space at the top of the bottom super combines > with the 1/4" space at the bottom of the top super to give an > unacceptable 1/2". > > So my stupid questions are: Why isn't 9 3/8" the proper height > for a super? Or, if we leave the super the same size, why not > enlarge the frame to 9 3/8"? Boxes could then be stacked without > violating beespace. -- ----------------------------------------------------------- John F. Edwards Biological Lab. Technician "Feral Bee Tracker and AHB Identifier" Carl Hayden Bee Research Center Agricultural Research Service - USDA 2000 E. Allen Road Tucson, Arizona 85719 32.27495 N 110.9402 W http://198.22.133.109/ http://gears.tucson.ars.ag.gov/home/edwards/edwards.html Article 28692 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!newsone.net!newsone.net!not-for-mail From: paulp@nospam_ims.com Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Nutrition Label Stickers Followup-To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 2 Mar 2001 21:14:06 GMT Organization: NewsOne.Net - Free Usenet News via the Web - http://newsone.net/ Lines: 17 Message-ID: <97p2eu$as4$1@news.netmar.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: news.netmar.com X-Trace: news.netmar.com 983567646 11140 205.139.138.14 (2 Mar 2001 21:14:06 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@newsone.net NNTP-Posting-Date: 2 Mar 2001 21:14:06 GMT X-PNG: sci.agriculture.beekeeping X-NewsOnePostHost: proxy.ims.com X-NewsOnePostAddr: 139.47.48.69 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28692 I'd like to avoid re-inventing the wheel. Can someone direct me to a supplier of stickers with the nutrition information for honey, made up according to the U.S. standards? I'd like it if I can purchase in quantities less than 1000. (100's would be great.) Thanks, Paul ----- Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web ----- http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groups NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam. If this or other posts made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net Article 28693 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer0!btnet!peer1.news.dircon.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: andrew.mcmanus@zbee.com (Andrew Mcmanus) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Thymol and Mites Message-ID: <983572624@zbee.com> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:46:14 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/197 b5b0f200 REPLY: 240:44/0 5cb4d165 PID: FDAPX/w 1.15 UnReg X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 57 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983575120 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28693 I first heard of thymol in an article on preserving sugar syrup from fermenting in the days when UK commercial beekeepers could buy bulk sugar on the world market. A small amount was added per 100 gallon bulk tank to prevent fermentation in the months before the syrup was used. Last year there was a new product on the market in the U.K. - a "non theraputic curative substance" whose name escapes me . It is a sort of wallpaper paste type jelly with thymol used as an 'alternative (soft chemical) therapy' for varroa and acarine. Does it work - I dont know ? They got round the medicines registration regulations through the "non-therapeutic curative substance" loop-hole. Some beekeepers are using a vegetable oil (margarine) thymol and icing sugar patty reicpe, also against varroa. I would love to see proper trial reports on both. Andrew T> Lines: 10 T> X-Admin: news@cs.com T> XRef: zbee.com sci.agriculture.beekeeping:5001 T> From: texasdrone@cs.combees (Robert Williamson) T> Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping T> Date: 23 Feb 2001 03:21:51 GMT T> References: T> <20010222195722.00597.00000125@nso-fy.aol.com> T> Organization: CompuServe T> (http://www.compuserve.com/) Subject: Re: Thymol T> and Mites T> Message-ID: T> <20010222222151.10184.00000256@ng-fg1.news.cs.com> T> Path: T> newsread3.dircon.co.uk!news.dircon.co.uk!peer2.news T> .dircon.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!diablo.netcom.net T> .uk!netcom.net.uk!news.tele.dk!144.212.100.101!news T> feed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.ne T> ws.cs.com!not-for-mail T> Wow... And they flavor foods with this stuff. So is T> a danger of honey contamintaion with thymol?. The T> packaging says that it can be used a a syrup feed T> for curing chalkbrood. T> Robert Williamson T> Southeast Texas Honey Co. T> P.O. Box 176 T> Vidor, Tx. 77670 T> " A simple and independent mind does not toil at T> the bidding of any prince" --- Platinum T> Xpress/Win/WINServer v3.0pr5 --- * Origin: Beenet Point (240:244/197) Article 28694 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!209.48.40.11!dca1-hub1.news.digex.net!intermedia!dca1-nnrp2.news.digex.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AA02A52.C03B23C0@mail.tqci.net> From: Christopher Drazba X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Nutrition Label Stickers References: <97p2eu$as4$1@news.netmar.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 31 Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 23:18:32 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.244.8.120 X-Complaints-To: abuse@digex.net X-Trace: dca1-nnrp2.news.digex.net 983575112 64.244.8.120 (Fri, 02 Mar 2001 18:18:32 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 18:18:32 EST Organization: Intermedia Business Internet - Beltsville, MD Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28694 Both Kelley and Dadant carry them in lots of 100 (others may carry them too, I just had their catalogs on hand). Walter T. Kelley Co., Inc. 1-800-233-2899 Dadant & Sons, Inc. 1-800-637-7468 Chris Drazba paulp@nospam_ims.com wrote: > I'd like to avoid re-inventing the wheel. Can someone > direct me to a supplier of stickers with the nutrition > information for honey, made up according to the U.S. > standards? I'd like it if I can purchase in quantities > less than 1000. (100's would be great.) > > Thanks, > Paul > > ----- Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web ----- > http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groups > NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam. If this or other posts > made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net Article 28695 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer0!btnet!peer1.news.dircon.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: andrew.mcmanus@zbee.com (Andrew Mcmanus) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Changing Brood Combs Message-ID: <983572621@zbee.com> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 17:02:18 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/197 b5aef9b5 REPLY: 240:44/0 6095c876 PID: FDAPX/w 1.15 UnReg A> From: "David Eyre" A> Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping A> Subject: Re: Changing Brood Combs A> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 18:09:50 -0500 A> Organization: Posted via Supernews, A> http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: A> A> References: A> A> X-Priority: 3 A> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal A> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express A> 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft A> MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Complaints-To: A> newsabuse@supernews.com A> XRef: zbee.com sci.agriculture.beekeeping:4988 A> Lines: 43 A> Path: A> newsread3.dircon.co.uk!news.dircon.co.uk!peer2.news A> .dircon.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!diablo.netcom.net A> .uk!netcom.net.uk!newsfeed.icl.net!news.maxwell.syr A> .edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!feed.textport.net!sn-xit A> -04!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not A> -for-mail X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 62 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983575099 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28695 A> It's always a problem to change over to new frames, A> which one first? To place a new box of foundation A> on top without a care means it will become another A> honey super, not what you need! You'll need to put A> the new box on top, but get the bees up there A> really quickly and working the foundation. A> I would recommend you bring up old frames preferably sealed brood and A> interleave them with the new foundation, avoid two A> foundations together. Does this no split the brood nest and also risk chilled brood ? A> As the frames become drawn A> out and filled, then you can start shuffling them A> back into the formation you need. Always feed when A> adding foundation. A> A couple of points. You are likely to find an increase in your hive A> size, then you'll ultimately compress them as you A> pull the old box out, beware of swarming! You'll A> also have to keep the queen out of the old box, A> otherwise you'll never get all the brood emerged, A> as it is you'll find lots of stores down there. A> A better idea. Why not add a second deep box this year, when full A> extract, then you'll have a complete box of drawn A> frames for next year, and life will be a great deal A> easier. This bit is a great idea - the bees move up into a box of clean drawn comb much easier than into a box of foundation. A> Regards Dave....-- A> ******************************************** A> The Bee Works, A> 5 Edith Drive, R R # 2, A> Orillia, ON. Canada. L3V 6H2 A> 705 326 7171 A> http://www.beeworks.com A> *************************************** >> With three of my hives this year I want to replace >> all the brood combs and boxes. I believe I know how >> to do this but could do with any comments/guidance >> people could offer. >> >> I understand that I should put the new box with >> frames and new foundation, on top of the old box, >> without foundation and then feed rapidly to provide >> enough food for wax building. From what I have been >> told the bees should build up the foundation and the >> queen will then migrate into the top box. Once this >> happens I can remove the lower box, shake out all >> the bees into the new box and discrad the old >> frames. >> >> Does this sound correct? >> Is there any guidance as to WHEN to remove the old >> box? My concern is that I would expect them to start >> storing honey in the new brood box, not start laying >> in it. --- * Origin: Beenet Point (240:244/197) Article 28696 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!bloom-beacon.mit.edu!howland.erols.net!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer0!btnet!peer1.news.dircon.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: andrew.mcmanus@zbee.com (Andrew Mcmanus) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Changing Brood Combs Message-ID: <983572620@zbee.com> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 16:48:10 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/197 b5aec4b4 REPLY: 240:44/0 d05d77b6 PID: FDAPX/w 1.15 UnReg X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 127 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983575092 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28696 Regular transfer to clean comb (TTCC) is a great idea for hobbiest beekeepers. John Powell of Twickenham and Thames Valley Beekeepers and of Reigate Division - Surrey Beekeepers Association , , and now on the Education Board of the BBKA is a great advocate of this tecnique. At Kingston Division we used to have lots of Chalk brood and sac brood diseases until I started regular transfer to clean comb every spring. Now chalk brood is unheard of and sac brood is very rare. Nosema can be kept in check with Fumadil B antibiotic, but will re-infect as the brood nest expands into contamitated combs, so soiled combs are replaced or disinfected by fumigating with 80% acetic acid. I like to over-winter my colonies on a single deep box with 40lb of stores. this makes TTCC much easier in the following spring. - Adding a third box (of foundation) to a double brood colony in the spring is a lost cause as the bees stay where they are or use the new box for honey storage. A single brood box colony is desperate to expand (into the foundation box) in the spring and a good feed of sugar syrup gives them the 'honey flow' they need to draw out the foundation. When a colony has overwintered on two boxes I will reduce them to one box on a warm day in late Feb or early March before the brood has begun to expand again. Usually the cluster is all in the top box and I can simply remove the bottom box and move any stores combs upstairs beside the cluster without disturbing them. Timing is crucial. Then the rest is simple: Add a whole box of foundation on top as soon as the weather warms up in spring - usually March/early April; and feed with a contact (bucket) feeder. As soon as eggs and the queen is seen upstairs a queen excluder is used to keep her out of the old comb for three weeks when the whole bottom box of old comb is removed. Three weeks allows all the worker brood to emerge. The danger here is the colony could starve if there is not enough stores in the upper chamber - feed or add combs of stores if needed. Remember the QX will trap drones so don't leave it on longer then you have to. As I run my bees on two deep brood boxes for the early summer, I usually add a second box of foundation soon after there is brood in 7-8 frames of the first new box. Also, I try to have the first first or second super as a deep box of foundation. This gives me a whole box of clean drawn comb which I use instead of foundation the following spring. The only problem is the massive weight when full of honey. All the old comb is cut out and melted down in a solar was extractor. I intended to build my own but gave up and bought one from Stamfordham after eight years of unrealised good intentions. I hate cleaning old frames by hand so now boil them up with autometic washing powder or washing soda in an old "Burko boiler" - about 10 minutes per 11 frames! The clean wax from the solar extractor is traded in for new wired foundation and the surplus used for polish and candle making. This keeps the time involved and cost of all that new foundation to a minamum. Any yellow combs removed can be fumigated with 80% acetic acid, aired well and replaced as clean comb. I use Transfer to clean comb as a treatment for Nosema together with Fumidil-B in the feed. Fumidil on its own only gives temporary relief - a cure requires TTCC as well. All the best, Andrew McManus S> From: Steven Newport S> Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping S> Subject: Changing Brood Combs S> Date: Tue, 20 Feb 2001 20:44:57 +0000 S> Organization: Posted via Supernews, S> http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: S> S> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 S> MIME-Version: 1.0 S> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii S> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit S> X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk S> XRef: zbee.com sci.agriculture.beekeeping:4986 S> Lines: 22 S> Path: S> newsread3.dircon.co.uk!news.dircon.co.uk!peer2.news S> .dircon.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!diablo.netcom.net S> .uk!netcom.net.uk!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-u S> k-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for- S> mail S> With three of my hives this year I want to replace S> all the brood combs and boxes. I believe I know how S> to do this but could do with any comments/guidance S> people could offer. S> I understand that I should put the new box with S> frames and new foundation, on top of the old box, S> without foundation and then feed rapidly to provide S> enough food for wax building. From what I have been S> told the bees should build up the foundation and S> the queen will then migrate into the top box. Once S> this happens I can remove the lower box, shake out S> all the bees into the new box and discrad the old S> frames. S> Does this sound correct? S> Is there any guidance as to WHEN to remove the old S> box? My concern is that I would expect them to S> start storing honey in the new brood box, not start S> laying in it. S> Thanks for any help you can give. S> Steve Newport S> Sussex, England --- * Origin: Beenet Point (240:244/197) Article 28697 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!btnet-peer0!btnet!peer1.news.dircon.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: andrew.mcmanus@zbee.com (Andrew Mcmanus) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Terramycin Questions? Message-ID: <983572623@zbee.com> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:06:32 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/197 b5b0cb85 REPLY: 240:44/0 584e4628 PID: FDAPX/w 1.15 UnReg X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 67 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983575112 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28697 Does anyone remember how bad AFB was in the U.K. before statutory destruction and restricted use of antibiotics was introduced ? AFB is now quite rare, though recent destruction of our 'County Beekeeping Instructor' program and restricted numbers of government 'Bees Officers' is not helping. All the best Andrew McManus C> From: Charlie Kroeger C> Newsgroups: C> sci.agriculture.beekeeping C> Subject: Re: Terramycin Questions? C> Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 23:26:24 -0600 C> Lines: 22 C> Message-ID: C> <2s799t0rsbfmutajtidfo36e1e5074ofrc@4ax.com> C> References: <982618178@zbee.com> C> Reply-To: C> ckrogrr@frankensteinface.com C> NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.167.138.170 C> Mime-Version: 1.0 C> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii C> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit C> X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 982819584 24689084 C> 216.167.138.170 (16 [35320]) XRef: zbee.com C> sci.agriculture.beekeeping:4994 C> Path: C> newsread3.dircon.co.uk!news.dircon.co.uk!peer2.news C> .dircon.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!newsfeed.icl.net! C> colt.net!news.tele.dk!130.133.1.3!fu-berlin.de!uni- C> berlin.de!216.167.138.170!not-for-mail C> Peter Edwards said: >>... and EFB is out of control! Proves the point. C> So..let's see you're saying that 'because' of C> restricted use of Terramycin that EFB is out of C> control? . Based on what you said, does 'it' mean C> you think that by NOT using Terramycin 'freely' as C> Americans are want to do, (even as a 'growth' C> promoter) EFB would not then be a problem? C> I'm under the impression that EFB although messy, C> is about the same as AFB without the spores. AFB C> has shown 'resistance' to Terramycin in America C> because of it's casual and unprofessional use. C> I would then suppose if that's what you meant, C> you're one of those dumbbells that think that C> 'government' should 'stay out of our lives' so that C> corporations can have a less 'regulated' approach C> to inviting everyone to use as much Terramycin as C> they want? I'm sure you didn't mean that; but, if C> you did, you've been misled. If I'm wrong about C> your cryptic post, then accept my regrets in C> advance. C> C.K. --- * Origin: Beenet Point (240:244/197) Article 28698 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!colt.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: andrew.mcmanus@zbee.com (Andrew Mcmanus) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Any comments on Apistan? Message-ID: <983572625@zbee.com> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:21:32 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/197 b5b103c0 REPLY: 240:44/0 0cdb06ab PID: FDAPX/w 1.15 UnReg X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 58 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983575128 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28698 I use the mesh bottom boards with a white drawer beneath purely to monitor the natural mortality of varroa mites to give an indication of the numbers infesting the colony and so when to treat - with apistan or bayvarrol etc. I don't think the mesh actually controls varroa itself - but I would love to hear otherwise. Andrew D> From: "David" D> Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping D> Subject: Re: Any comments on Apistan? D> Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 23:56:49 -0500 D> Organization: MindSpring Enterprises D> Lines: 18 D> Message-ID: <974pi2$p15$1@slb3.atl.mindspring.net> D> References: <3a9331f8.19205642@news.infoave.net> D> <970h8h$n0ckg$1@ID-66812.news.dfncis.de> D> <3A94FFD3.AE71F895@together.net> Reply-To: "David" D> D> NNTP-Posting-Host: d1.56.1a.16 D> X-Server-Date: 23 Feb 2001 04:39:30 GMT D> X-Priority: 3 D> X-MSMail-Priority: Normal D> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express D> 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft D> MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 XRef: zbee.com D> sci.agriculture.beekeeping:5002 D> Path: D> newsread3.dircon.co.uk!news.dircon.co.uk!peer2.news D> .dircon.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!news-out.nuthinbu D> tnews.com!news-in-austin.nuthinbutnews.com!feed.tex D> tport.net!hammer.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!loo D> k.ca!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!newsfeed2.earthlink.ne D> t!newsfeed.earthlink.net!news.mindspring.net!not-fo D> r-mail D> Do the mesh bottom boards really help to control D> Varroa mites? David A. D> michael palmer wrote in D> message news:3A94FFD3.AE71F895@together.net... >> And I bet in South Carolina they are! >> >> BeeFarmer wrote: >> >> > Apistan does work... for Varroa! Unless of course >> > your mites are D> resistant >> > to it! >> > >> >> >> --- * Origin: Beenet Point (240:244/197) Article 28699 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!EU.net!blackbush.xlink.net!newsfeed01.sul.t-online.de!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!newsfeeds.belnet.be!news.belnet.be!btnet-peer1!btnet-peer0!btnet!peer1.news.dircon.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: andrew.mcmanus@zbee.com (Andrew Mcmanus) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Terramycin Questions? Message-ID: <983572622@zbee.com> Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 18:56:58 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers CHRS: IBMPC 2 CODEPAGE: 437 MSGID: 240:244/197 b5b0a7a1 REPLY: 240:44/0 584e4628 PID: FDAPX/w 1.15 UnReg X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 118 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983575106 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28699 There was a great article about the control of E.F.B. written by P.A.M. a few years ago in Beecraft magazine - does anyone have a copy of it on line, or know which month it was published so I can dig it out again ? As I understand it EFB is difficult to diagnose with certainty in the field and all visable signs can dissapear within an infected colony as the bees clear away the dead larvae quickly for most of the year. Sometimes it is only visable in late April when the brood-nest is large and the nurse bees numbers are small and they are overstretched. - Less food per larva mean more die and are not cleared away so quickly. This is a hide-and-seek disease. EFB bacteria (Melissococcus pluton) live in the larval gut, eating the food meant for the larva. So the larva is malnourished or starves to death. When larvae are well fed they rarely die, but pass on the infection by defacating in the cell just before pupating. Malnourished larvae make poor nurse bees and short lived foragers, so EFB has a slow cumulative effect upon the whole colony. Symptoms are: larvae: contorted (gut ache) unusual positions and off colour - not pearly white is it true the gut may become visable as a white thread (if B.alvei is present)? dead brood in the larval stage no 'roping' with the matchstick test (AFB) colony: poor spring build up - failure to thrive but this could be nosema or many other reasons If anyone can add to this list please do. EFB has no resting spore like AFB so must survive only as active infection in the guts of living larvae (who defacate in the cell) and nurse bees (who transmit bacteria to more larvae). If EFB kills a larva before it defacates the infective cycle is broken when the larva is cleaned out of the colony. Thus if most infected larvae die (in April) then most of the infection may be removed from the hive and the disease may appear to dissapear from the colony until the infection level builds up again. EFB is a stress related disease - more prevalent and more visable when the colony is under stress. EFB is further complicated because of secondary infection by Bacillus alvei (which is sometimes considered to be part of the disease) and now with the stress of varroa on the colony EFB like symptoms and EFB has become more visable. Diagnosis is not easy Sucessful treatment is difficult re-infection is a major problem. The changing dynamics of the disease within the colony population is fascinating. I think that sucessful treatment must include all colonies in the apiary (and nighbours). The MAFF statutory treatment regime has weaknesses. The P.A.M article in Beecraft was a good starting point. I might detail our experiences and treatment of the disease in our club apiary in another posting but this one is getting a bit long already. I would love to hear other peoples thoughts and experiences with this major problem disease Please do fill in the gaps and correct me where you think I am wrong. All the best Andrew McManus C> From: Charlie Kroeger C> Newsgroups: C> sci.agriculture.beekeeping C> Subject: Re: Terramycin Questions? C> Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2001 23:26:24 -0600 C> Lines: 22 C> Message-ID: C> <2s799t0rsbfmutajtidfo36e1e5074ofrc@4ax.com> C> References: <982618178@zbee.com> C> Reply-To: C> ckrogrr@frankensteinface.com C> NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.167.138.170 C> Mime-Version: 1.0 C> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii C> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit C> X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 982819584 24689084 C> 216.167.138.170 (16 [35320]) XRef: zbee.com C> sci.agriculture.beekeeping:4994 C> Path: C> newsread3.dircon.co.uk!news.dircon.co.uk!peer2.news C> .dircon.net!peer1.news.dircon.net!newsfeed.icl.net! C> colt.net!news.tele.dk!130.133.1.3!fu-berlin.de!uni- C> berlin.de!216.167.138.170!not-for-mail C> Peter Edwards said: >>... and EFB is out of control! Proves the point. C> So..let's see you're saying that 'because' of C> restricted use of Terramycin that EFB is out of C> control? . Based on what you said, does 'it' mean C> you think that by NOT using Terramycin 'freely' as C> Americans are want to do, (even as a 'growth' C> promoter) EFB would not then be a problem? C> I'm under the impression that EFB although messy, C> is about the same as AFB without the spores. AFB C> has shown 'resistance' to Terramycin in America C> because of it's casual and unprofessional use. C> I would then suppose if that's what you meant, C> you're one of those dumbbells that think that C> 'government' should 'stay out of our lives' so that C> corporations can have a less 'regulated' approach C> to inviting everyone to use as much Terramycin as C> they want? I'm sure you didn't mean that; but, if C> you did, you've been misled. If I'm wrong about C> your cryptic post, then accept my regrets in C> advance. C> C.K. --- * Origin: Beenet Point (240:244/197) Article 28700 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: James Fischer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: 2 Mar 2001 14:53:50 -0800 Organization: Newsguy News Service [http://newsguy.com] Lines: 48 Message-ID: <97p89u02qpu@drn.newsguy.com> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-696.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News v2.65 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28700 In article <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov>, John says... > >My view - from over 30 years of handling bee equipment around the bee >lab - is that maintaining the bee space has almost become a lost art. >Wet (green) lumber has something to do with it, but many hives are >manufactured with strange dimensions inside. Differing rabbets, frames, >etc. also may change the situation. No kidding... check out the March 2001 issue of Bee Culture for their massive chart of what results from mixing different vendors' frames with different vendors' supers, and then stacking the various permutations on top of each other. They even address inner covers and queen excluders. The bad news is that I see much, much more "Red" (meaning that the space will be too large, and will result in burr comb) and "Brown" (meaning not enough space) than I do "Green" (good), "Gold" (smallish, but ok), "Yellow" (largish but ok) The really sad part is that some woodenware is not even "compatible" when stacked upon more of the same brand, same size woodenware! Sounds like there is a need for an actual written standard for "bee space", but perhaps I am expecting too much from the woodenware vendors, who may have significant investments in fixed tooling. We have a few table saws, and crank out our own supers, so it would certainly not be my place to complain about products I have never bought. jim Article 28701 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 8 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 03 Mar 2001 00:11:59 GMT References: <97p2eu$as4$1@news.netmar.com> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Nutrition Label Stickers Message-ID: <20010302191159.10842.00000225@ng-cj1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28701 >Can someone >direct me to a supplier of stickers with the nutrition >information for honey, made up according to the U.S. >standards brushy mtn used to carry them, 1-800- beeswax Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC Article 28702 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!wn3feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.71!wnfilter1!worldnet-localpost!bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "George Styer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <97p2eu$as4$1@news.netmar.com> Subject: Re: Nutrition Label Stickers Lines: 38 Organization: Productive Solutions X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 00:41:03 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.73.40.145 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc06-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 983580063 12.73.40.145 (Sat, 03 Mar 2001 00:41:03 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 00:41:03 GMT Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28702 Unfortunately, you'll end up buying a different label for each different size container. Seems the Fed thinks we need to know how many servings are in a container so that kind of buggers up the idea of a "one-size-fits-all" label. Just another example of the dumbing down of America if you ask me. -- Geo Sacramento, in California's great Central Valley "Honey is sweet but the bee stings" gstyLer@att.net To respond via email, get the "L" out of there wrote in message news:97p2eu$as4$1@news.netmar.com... > > I'd like to avoid re-inventing the wheel. Can someone > direct me to a supplier of stickers with the nutrition > information for honey, made up according to the U.S. > standards? I'd like it if I can purchase in quantities > less than 1000. (100's would be great.) > > Thanks, > Paul > > > > > ----- Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the eb ----- > http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groups > NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam. If this or other posts > made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net Article 28703 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!news.stealth.net!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!news-feed.fnsi.net!news.infoave.net!not-for-mail From: n4zo@amsat.org Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Controlling tracheal mites Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 01:21:05 GMT Organization: Info Avenue Internet Services Lines: 10 Message-ID: <3aa0462f.11292287@news.infoave.net> References: <3A9B280D.231DCE1E@mail.tqci.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: dial-39.r8.scccrk.infoave.net X-Trace: news3.infoave.net 983582448 29873 204.116.58.169 (3 Mar 2001 01:20:48 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@infoave.net NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2001 01:20:48 +0000 (UTC) X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.1/32.230 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28703 Is a suitable receipe for a grese patty something like half Criso and half sugar? Where is the best place to place it for feeding? After reading about drugs like Apistan, this seems the most prudent approach for tracheal mites. DMMcNeal n4zo@amsat.org Article 28704 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "K Adney" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <95ekgq$gqaub$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <20010301220255.04229.00000119@ng-mg1.aol.com> Subject: Re: Acquired Allergies Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 17:55:34 -0800 Lines: 9 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 NNTP-Posting-Host: tc1-116.reachone.com Message-ID: <3aa04e40@news.turbotek.net> X-Trace: 2 Mar 2001 17:52:00 -0800, tc1-116.reachone.com Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.gtei.net!hermes.visi.com!news-out.visi.com!news-out.uswest.net!news.turbotek.net!tc1-116.reachone.com Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28704 For what it's worth, here's my experience. I'm a 3rd year novice with 2 hives. 1st year, I was stung once on my hand. The stung area swelled to the size of a quarter and was gone in about 2-3 days. Next year, stung twice on the same hand. It swelled to about twice the size of the other hand & stayed that way for a week. I wear gloves now. Article 28705 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!ptdnetP!newsgate.ptd.net!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!saltmine.radix.net!not-for-mail From: adamf@saltmine.radix.net (Adam Finkelstein) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Standards for Organic Honey Date: 3 Mar 2001 06:24:29 -0500 Organization: Self-Organized. Dig that. Lines: 20 Message-ID: <97qk9d$j5i$1@saltmine.radix.net> References: Reply-To: adamf@radix.net NNTP-Posting-Host: saltmine.radix.net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28705 Thanks for this update. A producer going for certification would most certainly have to use foundation that was "certified" as chemical free. I'd really be curious to see residue test results from random foundation samples taken throughout the USA. Organic certification is not only a marketing tool, but a plunge into a commitment with the ecology framing one's production system. Beekeeping and aspects of honey bee husbandry, without a partnership with one's ecological system, is a difficult agricultural enterprise. Where are the beekeepers lobbying for Organic standards located in the USA? Their location would be interesting to know. Thanks again, Adam -- Adam Finkelstein adamf@radix.net http://www.ibiblio.org/bees/adamf Article 28706 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!hammer.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!headwall.stanford.edu!unlnews.unl.edu!newsfeed.ksu.edu!nntp.ksu.edu!news.okstate.edu!not-for-mail From: Gary Johns Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Nutrition Label Stickers Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 16:36:21 -0600 Organization: Oklahoma State University Lines: 23 Message-ID: <3AA02065.E55AC49C@okstate.edu> References: <97p2eu$as4$1@news.netmar.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: x8b4e76ed.dhcp.okstate.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28706 paulp@nospam_ims.com wrote: > I'd like to avoid re-inventing the wheel. Can someone > direct me to a supplier of stickers with the nutrition > information for honey, made up according to the U.S. > standards? I'd like it if I can purchase in quantities > less than 1000. (100's would be great.) > > Thanks, > Paul Try BetterBee. Their just one of many that offer this. 800-632-3379. Cost is $3.00 for a roll of 100. > > > ----- Posted via NewsOne.Net: Free (anonymous) Usenet News via the Web ----- > http://newsone.net/ -- Free reading and anonymous posting to 60,000+ groups > NewsOne.Net prohibits users from posting spam. If this or other posts > made through NewsOne.Net violate posting guidelines, email abuse@newsone.net Article 28707 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-10.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Changing Brood Combs Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2001 06:07:20 -0700 Lines: 26 Message-ID: <97qqac$qje5s$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <983572620@zbee.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-10.internode.net (198.161.229.186) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983624845 27900092 198.161.229.186 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28707 > At Kingston Division we used to have lots of Chalk brood and sac brood diseases > until I started regular transfer to clean comb every spring. Now chalk brood is > unheard of and sac brood is very rare. Nosema can be kept in check with > Fumadil B antibiotic, but will re-infect as the brood nest expands into > contaminated combs, so soiled combs are replaced or disinfected by fumigating > with 80% acetic acid. Many of these diseases are a sign of poor stock and can be bred out quite quickly or eliminated by changing queen suppliers. Comb replacement studies we did here last spring and summer (unpublished as of yet) using forty hives and several methods showed that the improvement made by total comb replacement was lost as the season went on. Also, significantly, the honey yield in foundation colonies was 1/3 of the crop in those on old comb, even though the comb replacement was limited to the brood chamber and drawn supers were given. -- allen http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ Article 28708 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!sunqbc.risq.qc.ca!news.imp.ch!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-10.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2001 06:24:19 -0700 Lines: 72 Message-ID: <97qra6$qa51g$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov> <97p89u02qpu@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-10.internode.net (198.161.229.186) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983625863 27595824 198.161.229.186 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28708 I'm thinking that we need a standard endorsed by a national, continental, or world body. This applies not only to woodenware, but also things like 'hygienic' queens. Seems to me that a large organisation already in place like Sue Bee, ABF or AHPA could pick up the ball on this and establish a standard, then licence the use of marks for the nominal cost of administering and policing the standards. If there were a standard, I am assuming that consumer pressure would encourage producer conformance. -- allen http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ --- Yesterday I parked my car in a tow-away zone...when I came back the entire area was missing. -- Steven Wright "James Fischer" wrote in message news:97p89u02qpu@drn.newsguy.com... > In article <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov>, John says... > > > >My view - from over 30 years of handling bee equipment around the bee > >lab - is that maintaining the bee space has almost become a lost art. > >Wet (green) lumber has something to do with it, but many hives are > >manufactured with strange dimensions inside. Differing rabbets, frames, > >etc. also may change the situation. > > No kidding... check out the March 2001 issue > of Bee Culture for their massive chart of what > results from mixing different vendors' frames > with different vendors' supers, and then > stacking the various permutations on top of > each other. > > They even address inner covers and queen > excluders. > > The bad news is that I see much, much more > > "Red" (meaning that the space > will be too large, and > will result in burr comb) > and > > "Brown" (meaning not enough space) > > than I do > > "Green" (good), > "Gold" (smallish, but ok), > "Yellow" (largish but ok) > > The really sad part is that some woodenware is > not even "compatible" when stacked upon more > of the same brand, same size woodenware! > > Sounds like there is a need for an actual written > standard for "bee space", but perhaps I am expecting > too much from the woodenware vendors, who may have > significant investments in fixed tooling. > > We have a few table saws, and crank out our own > supers, so it would certainly not be my place > to complain about products I have never bought. > > jim > Article 28709 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news-xfer.newsread.com!netaxs.com!newsread.com!POSTED.monger.newsread.com!not-for-mail From: "Jennifer Pierce" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: A question on building my own bodies... Lines: 16 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 13:30:38 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 205.232.94.52 X-Complaints-To: Abuse Role , We Care X-Trace: monger.newsread.com 983626238 205.232.94.52 (Sat, 03 Mar 2001 08:30:38 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 08:30:38 EST Organization: Northnet Internet Services (northnet.org) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28709 Greetings all - We've got a mill back in the woods, and my husband will be milling wood again this spring for his garage. If I can get him to agree, what kind of wood would be best suited for building my own hive bodies and supers? We've got hemlock, beech, maple (although that's used for the sugaring), pine, and probably a lot more. The wood he'll mill the most is probably the hemlock, and he says that's a very hard wood. How suitable would that bee for building hives? The pine would probably be best, from what he says. Any thoughts on the woods I mentioned, and any others that might work? Jennifer Article 28710 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: James Fischer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: 3 Mar 2001 11:18:45 -0800 Organization: Newsguy News Service [http://newsguy.com] Lines: 32 Message-ID: <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-318.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News v2.65 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28710 Jennifer said: >...what kind of wood would be best suited for building >my own hive bodies and supers? We've got hemlock, beech, >maple (although that's used for the sugaring), pine, and >probably a lot more. The wood he'll mill the most is >probably the hemlock, and he says that's a very hard wood. > >How suitable would that bee for building hives? The pine would >probably be best, from what he says. Any thoughts on the woods >I mentioned, and any others that might work? The bees won't mind, no matter which wood you use. Your table saw (unless equipped with carbide blades) certainly WILL mind harder woods. (I love the carbide- tipped adjustable dado blade sold by Sears that "wobbles", as it cuts through oak like it was butter.) Most of the woodenware one can buy is pine, and I have yet to hear anyone criticize pine as a "poor choice". A good paint job seems to be more important than the type of wood used. Rossman makes their woodenware from Cypress see http://www.gabees.com/cypress.htm Here's one option that starts to seem silly - MAHOGANY!!! see http://www.bee-commerce.com/gifts/estatehive.htm of course, at $1,500 each, one should expect a solid gold entrance reducer! Article 28711 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!gatech!newsfeed.mathworks.com!wn3feed!worldnet.att.net!209.155.233.17!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: James Fischer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: 3 Mar 2001 10:53:01 -0800 Organization: Newsguy News Service [http://newsguy.com] Lines: 54 Message-ID: <97reid01ndg@drn.newsguy.com> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov> <97p89u02qpu@drn.newsguy.com> <97qra6$qa51g$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-809.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News v2.65 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28711 Allen Dick said: >I'm thinking that we need a standard endorsed by a national, >continental, or world body. This applies not only to woodenware, >but also things like 'hygienic' queens. Yeah, I know a "hygenic queen"... he will come and clean your house every week at reasonable prices! :) The concept of a "standard" implies that some number of people come to agreement on a consensus view, and that compromises are made to achive the consensus. I have yet to see a consensus develop among any number of beekeepers on any issue. In fact, discussion most often results in additional divergent views being added to the mix! :) >Seems to me that a large organisation already in place like >Sue Bee, ABF or AHPA could pick up the ball on this and establish >a standard, then licence the use of marks for the nominal cost of >>administering and policing the standards. The same issue has existed for years in technology markets. In this case, the key word is "interoperability". Of course, there is some debate over the optimal minimum and maximum gap that can be called "bee space", so there must first be a consensus on the core issue of "standard bee space". >If there were a standard, I am assuming that consumer pressure >would encourage producer conformance. At least the first step has been taken - names have been named, and brands of woodenware that are not even "interoperable" with more of the same brand have been exposed to light and air. This was a brave thing for Bee Culture to do, given that some number of advertisers have been found to be lacking. I wish I could agree on that "consumer pressure" is a powerful force, but "consumer pressure" has not forced Microsoft to comply with well-known standards, and computer products are both sold to more people, and are much more expensive than woodenware. It is easy to write up a document that says "respect bee space", but it is hard (and expensive) to re-tool one's entire set of jigs and implement strict quality-control over tolerances when working with wood. I'd hope that the woodenware vendors would negotiate among themselves and come to their own consensus, but I'm not going to hold my breath. What beekeepers owe the vendors is a clear consensus on what "bee space" should be, with minmum and maximum tolerances. Article 28712 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!nntp2.aus1.giganews.com!nntp3.aus1.giganews.com!news6.giganews.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Me" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Preserving Hive Bodies Lines: 21 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2001 19:13:00 CST Organization: Giganews.Com - Premium News Outsourcing X-Trace: sv2-c1fpsEclokwK7qd9NVpSSILH5vNuAVXd6uIw0I60l2siPfSy//Qax0wlX9TPj1CFbJygeeJaEVBEd3x!Imj6hiJAg1ZvEQLJmHDzKoe/dw== X-Complaints-To: abuse@GigaNews.Com X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2001 19:12:55 -0800 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28712 Hello, I've heard there are a couple of good wood preservatives to use on hive bodies and possibly other parts; Copper Napthenate and Copper Quinolate. I have some 9% Copper Napthenate. My questions are: 1. Can I use Copper Napthenate on the inside as well as outside? 2. What percent Copper Napthenate should I use? 3. What is the best way(s) to apply it? 4. Can I paint over it? Thanks Mark -- Diplomacy is the art of letting someone else have your way. Article 28713 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!hammer.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-2.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Queen Bee Standards Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2001 06:35:21 -0700 Lines: 80 Message-ID: <97tg9v$mgboo$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov> <97p89u02qpu@drn.newsguy.com> <97qra6$qa51g$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <97reid01ndg@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-2.internode.net (198.161.229.178) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983712897 23605016 198.161.229.178 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28713 > >Seems to me that a large organisation already in place like > >Sue Bee, ABF or AHPA could pick up the ball on this and establish > >a standard, then licence the use of marks for the nominal cost of > >>administering and policing the standards. > > >I'm thinking that we need a standard endorsed by a national, > >continental, or world body. This applies not only to woodenware, > >but also things like 'hygienic' queens. > > Yeah, I know a "hygenic queen"... he will come and clean > your house every week at reasonable prices! :) Hygienic behaviour will become much more important in the next few years as fewer and fewer chemicals and drugs will be available and effective against our multitude of bee health problems. Bee breeding has the potential to reduce these major threats to minor status. If bee breeding is to replace drugs, then it must be quality controlled and certified, just as drugs and chemicals are now. The problem is that bee breeeding costs money and effort and the product of that that money and effort must be able to be verified and rewarded. It happens that 'hygienic' is much cheaper and easier to achieve in advertising than in the beehive. Although many, if not most bee breeders, are honest, educated, and try to give good value, queen raisers have no strong incentive to conform hygienic or SMR standards in bees they label 'hygienic' or 'SMR' unless they are tested peridically by an independant organisation -- and potentially subject to sanctions or public embarrassment. As I have pointed out publicly, we spend well over $10 per year per hive treating and inspecting to suppress AFB, EFB, mites, etc. Some things like chalkbrood and sacbrood and viruses, we cannot treat, yet they have a hand in our pocket. That means that I could very happily spend =at least= $10 more per queen for bees that are immune to these scourges. BUT I wouldn't do that, and neither would any astute commercial beekeeper -- pay double the price -- unless I had strong evidence that the queens were produced under strict quality control and testing. We need assurance of consistency if we are to depend entirely on these characteristics. Any variation and subsequent failure could be very costly. Without a high level of conformance to standards failure rates could be high resulting in loss of bees, loss of crop, extra work, remedial chemical or radiation treatment, and even destruction of hive parts. Without independant testing, I could not reasonably count on these traits being there consisently enough to rely on them and would not pay the premium. We see regulation and certification in many analagous areas. Only certain varieties of wheat may be grown in Western Canada. Commercial seed growers must meet standards and submit to testing and certification. We are no different. If we want to ensure that all areas are filled with bees that are relatively unaffected by the mentioned diseases and pests, we must have a way of proving conformance on the queen market. For those beekeepers who oppose any form of regulation, need I mention that the drugs we use are produced to strict standards under inspection and quality control testing? Why not their potential replacements? Independent testing and certification marks keep everyone honest. Independent testing ensures that those who do a good job of breeding consistent queens with the advertised traits get rewarded. Independent testing discourages phonies. In short, without independant testing and an official 'seal of approval' to certify and reward high performance queens, we will never get off the chemical treadmill. That is because without convincing independant testing 1.) no one will have faith in the product and 3.) no one will make the strong effort necessary to meet the high level of consistency and performance necessary to wean the industry from cheap, effective, and, yes, standardised chemicals. -- allen http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ --- I went to the hardware store and bought some used paint. It was in the shape of a house. I also bought some batteries, but they weren't included. So I had to buy them again. -- Steven Wright Article 28714 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Teri Bachus" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Standards for Organic Honey Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2001 14:10:54 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <97qk9d$j5i$1@saltmine.radix.net> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 24 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28714 Adam Finkelstein <> wrote in message news:97qk9d$j5i$1@saltmine.radix.net... > A producer going for certification would most certainly have to use > foundation that was "certified" as chemical free. I'd really be curious to > see residue test results from random foundation samples taken throughout > the USA. a swiss study of acaricide residues in honey, wax and propolis can be found at http://www.apis.admin.ch/english/pdf/BeeProducts/Acaricides_e.pdf and is quite revealing, although not exactly what you might predict in usa probably due to "api/cultural" differences... > Organic certification is not only a marketing tool, but a plunge into a > commitment with the ecology framing one's production system. Beekeeping > and aspects of honey bee husbandry, without a partnership with one's ecological > system, is a difficult agricultural enterprise. m.winston's recent (late2000?) column in "bee culture" on organic production (online but not archived at) http://www.airoot.com/beeculture basically agrees with your viewpoint and discusses it in a global/local context... btw, how did your queen trials go last year and do you plan to repeat them this year? Article 28715 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!unc-cs!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!news.ysu.edu!news.tele.dk!128.230.129.106!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.wirehub.nl!newsfeed.twtelecom.net!news.twtelecom.net!news.twtelecom.net!not-for-mail From: lrpotts@stic.net (Metalaya) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 05:44:05 GMT Message-ID: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Lines: 14 NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.198.60.163 X-Trace: 983770517 news1.twtelecom.net 65279 216.198.60.163 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28715 Hello Honey Bee Mavens! My friends father kept bees and related the story that when the arthritis in his hand would act up he would stick his hand into a hive and agitate it around to get a few stings. He claimed that the stings would ease the pain of his arthritis. I guess this is much the same technique as the counter stimulation method of moxibustion, or the burning of moxa. Ancient Buddhist medicine utilizes an herb, moxa, which is burned then placed against the skin while hot to counter certain pain conditions. Question...Has anyone heard of any bee sting remedies similar to this? Metalaya Article 28716 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!hammer.uoregon.edu!news-feed.fnsi.net!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 12:34:33 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 22 Message-ID: <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: p13.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28716 On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 05:44:05 GMT, lrpotts@stic.net (Metalaya) wrote: >Hello Honey Bee Mavens! > >My friends father kept bees and related the story that when the >arthritis in his hand would act up he would stick his hand into a hive >and agitate it around to get a few stings. He claimed that the stings >would ease the pain of his arthritis. I guess this is much the same >technique as the counter stimulation method of moxibustion, or the >burning of moxa. Ancient Buddhist medicine utilizes an herb, moxa, >which is burned then placed against the skin while hot to counter >certain pain conditions. > >Question...Has anyone heard of any bee sting remedies similar to this? > >Metalaya Bee stings cause you body to produce cortizones. Yes they work great for arthritus, and many other autoamune diseases. beekeep Article 28717 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!209.48.40.11!dca1-hub1.news.digex.net!intermedia!dca1-nnrp2.news.digex.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AA2889D.116C69@mail.tqci.net> From: Christopher Drazba X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.72 [en] (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: frames Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 4 Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2001 18:25:18 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.244.8.120 X-Complaints-To: abuse@digex.net X-Trace: dca1-nnrp2.news.digex.net 983730318 64.244.8.120 (Sun, 04 Mar 2001 13:25:18 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2001 13:25:18 EST Organization: Intermedia Business Internet - Beltsville, MD Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28717 Do brood frames need horizontal wires? I am using wired brood foundation. If so, should I use 2 or 4 wires? Chris D. Article 28718 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!hearst.acc.Virginia.EDU!hammer.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news-sjo.usenetserver.com!news-out.usenetserver.com!e420r-sjo3.usenetserver.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: hamilton@pbssite.com (Dave Hamilton) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Changing Brood Combs Message-ID: <3aa3ad26.279824359@west.usenetserver.com> References: <983572620@zbee.com> <97qqac$qje5s$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Lines: 40 X-Complaints-To: abuse@usenetserver.com X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly. NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 10:14:16 EST Organization: WebUseNet Corp http://www.usenetserver.com - Home of the fastest NNTP servers on the Net. Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 15:15:35 GMT Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28718 I think this may be "too much of a good thing". My method of disease control is replacing 2 frames per box each year and this is sufficient. Totally replacing the entire comb with foundation is expensive especially when you remember how much honey is lost pulling out wax IMHO Dave On Sat, 3 Mar 2001 06:07:20 -0700, "Allen Dick" wrote: >> At Kingston Division we used to have lots of Chalk brood and sac brood >diseases >> until I started regular transfer to clean comb every spring. Now chalk >brood is >> unheard of and sac brood is very rare. Nosema can be kept in check with >> Fumadil B antibiotic, but will re-infect as the brood nest expands into >> contaminated combs, so soiled combs are replaced or disinfected by >fumigating >> with 80% acetic acid. > >Many of these diseases are a sign of poor stock and can be bred out quite >quickly or eliminated by changing queen suppliers. > >Comb replacement studies we did here last spring and summer (unpublished as >of yet) using forty hives and several methods showed that the improvement >made by total comb replacement was lost as the season went on. > >Also, significantly, the honey yield in foundation colonies was 1/3 of the >crop in those on old comb, even though the comb replacement was limited to >the brood chamber and drawn supers were given. >-- >allen > >http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ > > Article 28719 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnitebee" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 16:19:30 -0500 Lines: 21 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.64.126 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.64.126 Message-ID: <3aa402d3_1@news.cybertours.com> X-Trace: 5 Mar 2001 16:19:15 -0500, 64.208.64.126 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.98.63.6 Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!news.cybertours.com!64.208.64.126 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28719 National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/html/organstan.htm -- Herb/Norma Bee Holly-B Apiary PO Box 26 Wells,Maine 04090-0026 "an educated consumer is YOUR best customer" The Beekeeper's Home on the Internet http://www.mainebee.com Stony Critters http://www.stonycritters.com Betty's Driftwood Santa Site http://pages.ivillage.com/santasite/index.html Article 28720 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Lines: 35 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 23:14:11 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.137.192.147 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 983834155 212.137.192.147 (Mon, 05 Mar 2001 23:15:55 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 23:15:55 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28720 My understanding is that the latest research suggests that it is a little more complex! It suggests that stings may alleviate arthritis away from the site of the sting, but cause it where the person is stung. I regret that my attempt, a little while ago, to poll contributors to this newsgroup on their experience of arthritis met with little success. "beekeep" wrote in message news:3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net... > On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 05:44:05 GMT, lrpotts@stic.net (Metalaya) wrote: > > >Hello Honey Bee Mavens! > > > >My friends father kept bees and related the story that when the > >arthritis in his hand would act up he would stick his hand into a hive > >and agitate it around to get a few stings. He claimed that the stings > >would ease the pain of his arthritis. I guess this is much the same > >technique as the counter stimulation method of moxibustion, or the > >burning of moxa. Ancient Buddhist medicine utilizes an herb, moxa, > >which is burned then placed against the skin while hot to counter > >certain pain conditions. > > > >Question...Has anyone heard of any bee sting remedies similar to this? > > > >Metalaya > > Bee stings cause you body to produce cortizones. Yes they work great > for arthritus, and many other autoamune diseases. > > beekeep > Article 28721 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsswitch.lcs.mit.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Teri Bachus" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 18:16:29 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <3aa402d3_1@news.cybertours.com> X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 11 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28721 could you please cite the source for your article, unless it's your own release? Midnitebee <> wrote in message news:3aa402d3_1@news.cybertours.com... > National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA > > http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/html/organstan.htm > Article 28722 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!192.148.253.68!netnews.com!xfer02.netnews.com!newspeer1.nac.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 23:32:27 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 48 Message-ID: <3aa42120.801103311@news1.radix.net> References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: p5.a4.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28722 Most of my customers sting for MS. But we do get a lot of other feedback as well. Many have reported back that the arthritus was completely gone. The MS takes a lot longer. Another side effect is that women quite often become pregnant! They have reported that they had always been unable to conceive, so they didn't bother using any preventitives, started the bvt and then became pregnant. beekeep On Mon, 5 Mar 2001 23:14:11 -0000, "Peter Edwards" wrote: >My understanding is that the latest research suggests that it is a little >more complex! > >It suggests that stings may alleviate arthritis away from the site of the >sting, but cause it where the person is stung. > >I regret that my attempt, a little while ago, to poll contributors to this >newsgroup on their experience of arthritis met with little success. > >"beekeep" wrote in message >news:3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net... >> On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 05:44:05 GMT, lrpotts@stic.net (Metalaya) wrote: >> >> >Hello Honey Bee Mavens! >> > >> >My friends father kept bees and related the story that when the >> >arthritis in his hand would act up he would stick his hand into a hive >> >and agitate it around to get a few stings. He claimed that the stings >> >would ease the pain of his arthritis. I guess this is much the same >> >technique as the counter stimulation method of moxibustion, or the >> >burning of moxa. Ancient Buddhist medicine utilizes an herb, moxa, >> >which is burned then placed against the skin while hot to counter >> >certain pain conditions. >> > >> >Question...Has anyone heard of any bee sting remedies similar to this? >> > >> >Metalaya >> >> Bee stings cause you body to produce cortizones. Yes they work great >> for arthritus, and many other autoamune diseases. >> >> beekeep >> > > Article 28723 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!207.172.3.44!feed2.news.rcn.net!feed1.news.rcn.net!rcn!not-for-mail From: Barry Birkey Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2001 19:13:31 -0600 Lines: 30 Message-ID: References: <3aa402d3_1@news.cybertours.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVaOVkzVLW8Iukna+7iVl9kADewPJnEzgGg7CduoFceIUSRDztxk8VvW X-Complaints-To: abuse@rcn.com NNTP-Posting-Date: 6 Mar 2001 01:14:41 GMT User-Agent: Microsoft Outlook Express Macintosh Edition - 5.0 (1513) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28723 > From: "Teri Bachus" > Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com > Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping > Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2001 18:16:29 -0500 > Subject: Re: National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA > > could you please cite the source for your article, unless it's your own > release? > > Midnitebee <> wrote in message news:3aa402d3_1@news.cybertours.com... >> National Organic Standards finally announced by USDA >> >> http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/html/organstan.htm Teri - Note from the above web page: "It details the methods, practices and substances that can be used in producing and handling organic crops and livestock, as well as processed products." I don't know his source but this ruling does not pertain to beekeeping or honey. This will be a separate ruling later this year at the earliest. Not sure why it was announced here in a beekeeping forum. Regards, Barry Article 28724 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.cs.com!not-for-mail Lines: 7 X-Admin: news@cs.com From: dhaist77@cs.com (Dhaist77) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 05 Mar 2001 23:53:54 GMT References: <07d19tc8eh5c8m3m8iei9hdmf7u4qrb2qb@4ax.com> Organization: CompuServe (http://www.compuserve.com/) Subject: Re: bee extraction fees and other questions Message-ID: <20010305185354.22312.00000582@ng-bk1.news.cs.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28724 I have a unique problem. The bees are a the top of my 60 foot chimmney, between the inner chimmeny and outer "false" chimmney. It is not accessible without 1) building 60 feet of scofloding(sp) and 2)spending several hundred dollars to remove the chimmney crown and cap. About a dozen a day make their way down the chimmney into the living room where they sting my children and eventually die(the bees). Any suggestions? Dennis Haisten Article 28725 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: bee extraction fees and other questions Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 00:50:49 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 16 Message-ID: <3aa4340d.805948391@news1.radix.net> References: <07d19tc8eh5c8m3m8iei9hdmf7u4qrb2qb@4ax.com> <20010305185354.22312.00000582@ng-bk1.news.cs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p5.a4.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28725 On 05 Mar 2001 23:53:54 GMT, dhaist77@cs.com (Dhaist77) wrote: >I have a unique problem. The bees are a the top of my 60 foot chimmney, between >the inner chimmeny and outer "false" chimmney. It is not accessible without 1) >building 60 feet of scofloding(sp) and 2)spending several hundred dollars to >remove the chimmney crown and cap. About a dozen a day make their way down the >chimmney into the living room where they sting my children and eventually >die(the bees). Any suggestions? >Dennis Haisten A good fire in the fire place might just do the trick. Of coarse if they have been there awhile and filled the chimney with wax and honey you are going to have a real problem on your hands. beekeep Article 28726 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!nntp.twtelecom.net!newsfeed.twtelecom.net!news.twtelecom.net!news.twtelecom.net!not-for-mail From: lrpotts@stic.net (Metalaya) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 03:29:21 GMT Message-ID: <3aa458fa.77940036@news.stic.net> References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3aa42120.801103311@news1.radix.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Lines: 59 NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.198.62.209 X-Trace: 983849019 news1.twtelecom.net 65278 216.198.62.209 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28726 Dear Beekeep, It appears that you encounter people using bee sting "therapy" sort of often...Can you list a few more ailments or disfunctions for which people get stung? Metalaya On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 23:32:27 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: >Most of my customers sting for MS. But we do get a lot of other >feedback as well. Many have reported back that the arthritus was >completely gone. The MS takes a lot longer. Another side effect is >that women quite often become pregnant! They have reported that they >had always been unable to conceive, so they didn't bother using any >preventitives, started the bvt and then became pregnant. > >beekeep > >On Mon, 5 Mar 2001 23:14:11 -0000, "Peter Edwards" > wrote: > >>My understanding is that the latest research suggests that it is a little >>more complex! >> >>It suggests that stings may alleviate arthritis away from the site of the >>sting, but cause it where the person is stung. >> >>I regret that my attempt, a little while ago, to poll contributors to this >>newsgroup on their experience of arthritis met with little success. >> >>"beekeep" wrote in message >>news:3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net... >>> On Mon, 05 Mar 2001 05:44:05 GMT, lrpotts@stic.net (Metalaya) wrote: >>> >>> >Hello Honey Bee Mavens! >>> > >>> >My friends father kept bees and related the story that when the >>> >arthritis in his hand would act up he would stick his hand into a hive >>> >and agitate it around to get a few stings. He claimed that the stings >>> >would ease the pain of his arthritis. I guess this is much the same >>> >technique as the counter stimulation method of moxibustion, or the >>> >burning of moxa. Ancient Buddhist medicine utilizes an herb, moxa, >>> >which is burned then placed against the skin while hot to counter >>> >certain pain conditions. >>> > >>> >Question...Has anyone heard of any bee sting remedies similar to this? >>> > >>> >Metalaya >>> >>> Bee stings cause you body to produce cortizones. Yes they work great >>> for arthritus, and many other autoamune diseases. >>> >>> beekeep >>> >> >> > Article 28727 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!news.redhat.com!news-reader.ntrnet.net!uunet!sac.uu.net!news.compaq.com!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: bee extraction fees and other questions Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:56:45 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 34 Message-ID: <3aa4d049.845928440@news1.radix.net> References: <07d19tc8eh5c8m3m8iei9hdmf7u4qrb2qb@4ax.com> <20010305185354.22312.00000582@ng-bk1.news.cs.com> <3aa4340d.805948391@news1.radix.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: p19.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28727 On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:37:32 +0000, Kidney John wrote: >On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 00:50:49 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: > >>On 05 Mar 2001 23:53:54 GMT, dhaist77@cs.com (Dhaist77) wrote: >> >>>I have a unique problem. The bees are a the top of my 60 foot chimmney, between >>>the inner chimmeny and outer "false" chimmney. It is not accessible without 1) >>>building 60 feet of scofloding(sp) and 2)spending several hundred dollars to >>>remove the chimmney crown and cap. About a dozen a day make their way down the >>>chimmney into the living room where they sting my children and eventually >>>die(the bees). Any suggestions? >>>Dennis Haisten >> >>A good fire in the fire place might just do the trick. Of coarse if >>they have been there awhile and filled the chimney with wax and honey >>you are going to have a real problem on your hands. >> >>beekeep > >If you can see where the bees are entering and exiting, you could fit a >bee escape (one-way) so that, over a relatively short period, all the >foragers will be excluded, and the colony (what's left of it) will >perish. >-- >kj @ jaffullstopcoanotherfullstopuk >TERMINUS - www.jaf.co.uk/terminus.htm If the chimney is that bad chances are they will find a way around the the cone. beekeep Article 28728 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!sn-uk-xit-01!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Kidney John Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: bee extraction fees and other questions Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 13:24:17 +0000 Organization: Or Chaos? You Choose! Message-ID: <65o9ats0h97sdk4gvr95bbfv9p3gq6bu3b@4ax.com> References: <07d19tc8eh5c8m3m8iei9hdmf7u4qrb2qb@4ax.com> <20010305185354.22312.00000582@ng-bk1.news.cs.com> <3aa4340d.805948391@news1.radix.net> <3aa4d049.845928440@news1.radix.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 44 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28728 On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:56:45 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: >On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:37:32 +0000, Kidney John > wrote: > >>On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 00:50:49 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: >> >>>On 05 Mar 2001 23:53:54 GMT, dhaist77@cs.com (Dhaist77) wrote: >>> >>>>I have a unique problem. The bees are a the top of my 60 foot chimmney, between >>>>the inner chimmeny and outer "false" chimmney. It is not accessible without 1) >>>>building 60 feet of scofloding(sp) and 2)spending several hundred dollars to >>>>remove the chimmney crown and cap. About a dozen a day make their way down the >>>>chimmney into the living room where they sting my children and eventually >>>>die(the bees). Any suggestions? >>>>Dennis Haisten >>> >>>A good fire in the fire place might just do the trick. Of coarse if >>>they have been there awhile and filled the chimney with wax and honey >>>you are going to have a real problem on your hands. >>> >>>beekeep >> >>If you can see where the bees are entering and exiting, you could fit a >>bee escape (one-way) so that, over a relatively short period, all the >>foragers will be excluded, and the colony (what's left of it) will >>perish. >>-- >>kj @ jaffullstopcoanotherfullstopuk >>TERMINUS - www.jaf.co.uk/terminus.htm > >If the chimney is that bad chances are they will find a way around the >the cone. > >beekeep True. Extra entrances can be closed, though (assuming you can find them all, or reach them). I'm probably clutching at straws here, but that's because I hate the idea of killing the bees, but sometimes it's the only answer. -- kj @ jaffullstopcoanotherfullstopuk TERMINUS - www.jaf.co.uk/terminus.htm Article 28729 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!195.224.25.10!sn-uk-xit-01!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Kidney John Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: bee extraction fees and other questions Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:37:32 +0000 Organization: Or Chaos? You Choose! Message-ID: References: <07d19tc8eh5c8m3m8iei9hdmf7u4qrb2qb@4ax.com> <20010305185354.22312.00000582@ng-bk1.news.cs.com> <3aa4340d.805948391@news1.radix.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 X-No-Archive: yes MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 25 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28729 On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 00:50:49 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: >On 05 Mar 2001 23:53:54 GMT, dhaist77@cs.com (Dhaist77) wrote: > >>I have a unique problem. The bees are a the top of my 60 foot chimmney, between >>the inner chimmeny and outer "false" chimmney. It is not accessible without 1) >>building 60 feet of scofloding(sp) and 2)spending several hundred dollars to >>remove the chimmney crown and cap. About a dozen a day make their way down the >>chimmney into the living room where they sting my children and eventually >>die(the bees). Any suggestions? >>Dennis Haisten > >A good fire in the fire place might just do the trick. Of coarse if >they have been there awhile and filled the chimney with wax and honey >you are going to have a real problem on your hands. > >beekeep If you can see where the bees are entering and exiting, you could fit a bee escape (one-way) so that, over a relatively short period, all the foragers will be excluded, and the colony (what's left of it) will perish. -- kj @ jaffullstopcoanotherfullstopuk TERMINUS - www.jaf.co.uk/terminus.htm Article 28730 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!news.redhat.com!news-reader.ntrnet.net!uunet!ash.uu.net!sac.uu.net!newshub1.wanet.net!newshub.sdsu.edu!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 16 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: outman2@aol.com (Mike) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 06 Mar 2001 14:29:01 GMT Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Frame spacers Message-ID: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28730 I am VERY new to beekeeping, and have done some reading about bees, hives ect. In all the books they talk about "bee space" and I understand all that. Hive bodies, & supers are built to hold 10 frames for....."bee space"!! Now in some catalogs I see FRAME SPACERS for 9 or 8 frames. I don't understand ??? Why would you want less frames ??? Thank You for Your Time, -= Mike =- Article 28731 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!63.100.169.102!not-for-mail From: "BeeFarmer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Frame spacers Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 09:46:01 -0500 Lines: 35 Message-ID: <982t7h$255q$1@ID-66812.news.dfncis.de> References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> Reply-To: "BeeFarmer" NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.100.169.102 X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983889970 70842 63.100.169.102 (16 [66812]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28731 Spacers can be used to provide more space for bees to draw out comb. Some keepers use spacers in broad chambers and other use it for honey supers. Some probably do both. For my operation I use 9 frames spacers for honey supers so bees draw out the comb further which, allows easier uncapping of the frame. I won't go into detail as there are as many ideas as there are keepers. Good Luck. -- BeeFarmer BeeFarmer@HomeStead.Com http://www.homestead.com/BeeKeepers/Opening.html "Mike" wrote in message news:20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com... > I am VERY new to beekeeping, and have done some reading about bees, > hives ect. > > In all the books they talk about "bee space" and I understand all that. > > Hive bodies, & supers are built to hold 10 frames for....."bee space"!! > > Now in some catalogs I see FRAME SPACERS for 9 or 8 frames. > > I don't understand ??? > > Why would you want less frames ??? > > > Thank You for Your Time, > -= Mike =- Article 28732 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!news.redhat.com!news-reader.ntrnet.net!uunet!sac.uu.net!news.compaq.com!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!newsfeed.stanford.edu!feed.textport.net!sn-xit-04!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "BeArLc" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: When should i apply strips?????? Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 08:19:17 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 9 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28732 Supposed to hit 61 F today....Should i put the strips in? Live in Washington state. ===================================== http://www.jaxworld.com/lowcarb/stories.html To bad honey isn't Low Carb. ===================================== Article 28733 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!216.167.138.83!not-for-mail From: Charlie Kroeger Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 13:32:10 -0600 Lines: 9 Message-ID: References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> Reply-To: ckrogrr@frankensteinface.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.167.138.83 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983907131 141764 216.167.138.83 (16 [35320]) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28733 Peter Edwards sniffed: >I regret that my attempt, a little while ago, to poll contributors to this >newsgroup on their experience of arthritis met with little success. That's because you didn't poll the archives first, where there are many such threads, including some of my own views. C.K. Article 28734 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!uunet!dca.uu.net!ash.uu.net!xyzzy!nntp From: J Subject: Re: Frame spacers X-Nntp-Posting-Host: 144.113.127.111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com> Sender: nntp@news.boeing.com (Boeing NNTP News Access) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Organization: Yes, I work. X-Accept-Language: en References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 23:22:14 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD Boeing Kit (Win98; I) Lines: 22 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28734 I don't use spacers. In my opinion if you use spacers the bees will draw the comb out further. This means when you uncap it's either harder to take just the cap, or you cut off more of the comb when cutting back to level with the frame. Mike wrote: > > I am VERY new to beekeeping, and have done some reading about bees, > hives ect. > > In all the books they talk about "bee space" and I understand all that. > > Hive bodies, & supers are built to hold 10 frames for....."bee space"!! > > Now in some catalogs I see FRAME SPACERS for 9 or 8 frames. > > I don't understand ??? > > Why would you want less frames ??? > > Thank You for Your Time, > -= Mike =- Article 28735 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!howland.erols.net!newsfeed.skycache.com!Cidera!skycache.prestige.net!not-for-mail From: "mikebee" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> <3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com> Subject: Re: Frame spacers Lines: 36 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 22:54:04 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.94.220.131 X-Complaints-To: administrator@prestige.net X-Trace: skycache.prestige.net 983919244 63.94.220.131 (Tue, 06 Mar 2001 17:54:04 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 17:54:04 EST Organization: Prestige Communications/ Prestige.Net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28735 I have been using spacers for a number of years in the extracting supers. It makes it easier to uncap as the cells are pulled out farther. You can use spacers in the brood chamber, it makes it easier to get the frames out. When you remove frames, start with an outside frame and work inwards to help prevent rolling the bees and possibly killing the queen. Once you move the outside frame you then have room to move the next frame over. For a new beekeeper I suggest joining a beekeeping club, you can get a lot of information and there will be experienced beekeepers to help you. Good luck. J wrote in message news:3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com... > I don't use spacers. In my opinion if you use spacers the bees will > draw the comb out further. This means when you uncap it's either harder > to take just the cap, or you cut off more of the comb when cutting back > to level with the frame. > > Mike wrote: > > > > I am VERY new to beekeeping, and have done some reading about bees, > > hives ect. > > > > In all the books they talk about "bee space" and I understand all that. > > > > Hive bodies, & supers are built to hold 10 frames for....."bee space"!! > > > > Now in some catalogs I see FRAME SPACERS for 9 or 8 frames. > > > > I don't understand ??? > > > > Why would you want less frames ??? > > > > Thank You for Your Time, > > -= Mike =- Article 28736 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.gblx.net!news-peer-west.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news1.alsv1.occa.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com> From: maverick X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: wintering = dead bees? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 19 Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 00:02:55 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.10.145.159 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news1.alsv1.occa.home.com 983923375 24.10.145.159 (Tue, 06 Mar 2001 16:02:55 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2001 16:02:55 PST Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28736 hello all I live in southern california. I have four hives. two all american, and buckfast. three weeks ago while dusting with Terramycin , I noticed that one of the all american hives has been extremely active and reproducing. fearing a swarm I placed a shallow super and closed the entrance and covered the super with a tarp. yesterday I opened the hive, and what a disaster. there is approximately six inch high worth of dead bees on the bottom super. its an apparent stampede to the entrance. I still have not found the queen. I'm hoping she is still alive. ok after you call me names, I hope you would answer this question? how the hay do pro beekeepers transport the hives without having such a disaster? or how beekeepers who live in cold climates wrap the hive in a tarp and leave it outside in the snow without having such a disaster thanks Mike Article 28737 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!paloalto-snh1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!dfiatx1-snr1.gtei.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AA58146.1DD01562@gte.net> From: Chad Howell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en]C-CCK-MCD {GTE Internetworking} (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: When should i apply strips?????? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 12 X-Trace: /whjskj4E/4/gXJ640PKwdBeMJ5PVVsFNL7iXbZ+x9tGgkenxNLGGrvMuxlkElqjLJfaQBSL77Cr!/edLYcqGcC2j5Q4jvDO0bQhZbvGnRad9aJb4eSQlGpn7uBkDBuXT/TBBBRdT X-Complaints-To: abuse@gte.net X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 00:31:11 GMT Distribution: world Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 00:31:11 GMT Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28737 Did you put Apistan in last fall? BeArLc wrote: > Supposed to hit 61 F today....Should i put the strips in? Live in > Washington state. > > ===================================== > http://www.jaxworld.com/lowcarb/stories.html > To bad honey isn't Low Carb. > ===================================== Article 28738 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.kjsl.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news.isc.org!news.gnac.net!uunet!sac.uu.net!ash.uu.net!xyzzy!nntp From: J Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? X-Nntp-Posting-Host: 144.113.127.111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> Sender: nntp@news.boeing.com (Boeing NNTP News Access) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Organization: Yes, I work. X-Accept-Language: en References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2001 23:41:04 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD Boeing Kit (Win98; I) Lines: 19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28738 Ya know, it's really hard to happen upon a news group and know how or where to go "poll the archives". I've been watching this NG for over 6 months now - and commenting every now and then, and I still don't have a clue as to what "archives" you are referring to. Most of us probably purge our posts over 14 days old, as well, we have lives outside of computing, newsgroups and beekeeping. So, cut us some slack and don't be so snippy. Charlie Kroeger wrote: > > Peter Edwards sniffed: > > >I regret that my attempt, a little while ago, to poll contributors to this > >newsgroup on their experience of arthritis met with little success. > > That's because you didn't poll the archives first, where there are > many such threads, including some of my own views. > > C.K. Article 28739 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsfeed.icl.net!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!news.tele.dk!134.222.94.5!npeer.kpnqwest.net!EU.net!Norway.EU.net!not-for-mail From: Xavier Dequaire Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 08:15:35 +0100 Organization: XDi Lines: 43 Message-ID: <3AA5E017.609C97A3@futurich.com> References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> Reply-To: xavier@futurich.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 193.91.191.10 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: oslo-nntp.eunet.no 983949045 15224 193.91.191.10 (7 Mar 2001 07:10:45 GMT) X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@eunet.no NNTP-Posting-Date: 7 Mar 2001 07:10:45 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28739 About archive on this NG, you can check http://groups.google.com/ or more specifically for this NG http://groups.google.com/groups?num=25&hl=en&lr=&group=sci.agriculture.beekeeping&safe=off&start=50&group=sci.agriculture.beekeeping Bee in peace Xavier J wrote: > Ya know, it's really hard to happen upon a news group and know how or > where to go "poll the archives". I've been watching this NG for over 6 > months now - and commenting every now and then, and I still don't have a > clue as to what "archives" you are referring to. Most of us probably > purge our posts over 14 days old, as well, we have lives outside of > computing, newsgroups and beekeeping. So, cut us some slack and don't > be so snippy. > > Charlie Kroeger wrote: > > > > Peter Edwards sniffed: > > > > >I regret that my attempt, a little while ago, to poll contributors to this > > >newsgroup on their experience of arthritis met with little success. > > > > That's because you didn't poll the archives first, where there are > > many such threads, including some of my own views. > > > > C.K. -- ----------------------------------- | XDi, Xavier Dequaire interaktiv | e-learning og multimedia konsulent |-@------------------------------@- | Dataforhandler: | maskinvare og programvare | Forhandler av en glimrende urtedrikk | http://www.futurich.com ----------------------------------- Article 28740 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-10.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 06:17:40 -0700 Lines: 28 Message-ID: <985cd6$btqm$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> <3AA5E017.609C97A3@futurich.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-10.internode.net (198.161.229.186) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983971047 390998 198.161.229.186 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28740 > About archive on this NG, you can check http://groups.google.com/ > or more specifically for this NG > http://groups.google.com/groups?num=25&hl=en&lr=&group=sci.agriculture.beeke eping&safe=off&start=50&group=sci.agriculture.beekeeping Thanks for this. I was aware that Deja's searches had degenerated in depth, but not that this new service had replaced it. Hope it lasts. Anyone else have any neat tricks for accessing sci.agriculture.beekeeping or the archives? Anyone know if the archives at Google go all the way back? I keep a page about sci.agriculture.beekeeping at http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/Bee/sci.htm , and I see I'm going to have to overhaul it now. For those wanting to look into archives, BEE-L has searchable archives over a decade deep accessible from http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/BEE-L/ -- allen http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ --- When I was little, my grandfather used to make me stand in a closet for five minutes without moving. He said it was elevator practice. -- Steven Wright Article 28741 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!saltmine.radix.net!not-for-mail From: adamf@saltmine.radix.net (Adam Finkelstein) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Queen Selection for Varroa tolerance (was Re: Standards for Organic Honey) Date: 7 Mar 2001 08:25:02 -0500 Organization: Self-Organized. Dig that. Lines: 20 Message-ID: <985cre$rs6$1@saltmine.radix.net> References: <97qk9d$j5i$1@saltmine.radix.net> Reply-To: adamf@radix.net NNTP-Posting-Host: saltmine.radix.net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28741 In article , Teri Bachus wrote: >btw, how did your queen trials go last year and do you plan to repeat them >this year? > > We're still awaiting Spring buildup to assess completely how our tests went. We've been in contact with others and as soon as everyone pools their data and arranges for crosses (i.e. exchanging germplasm via virgins/semen) I'll post a summary. I'm still looking for queen testers for this season. Adam -- Adam Finkelstein adamf@radix.net http://www.ibiblio.org/bees/adamf Article 28742 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.kjsl.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: Patrick M. Hennessey Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: frames Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 08:57:07 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <3AA2889D.116C69@mail.tqci.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 21 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28742 I do wire my brood frames, this is how I was first taught to make brood frames. I use two wires. This helps to keep the foundation straight in the frame to prevent bowing. You also might run into sagging of the comb as you get into the summer. With all of the bees and the stores that they have put into the comb, plus the heat, the comb can easily be deformed and sag. You can get support pins, I have two jars I got from a beekeeper, but I have never used them. I extract most of my honey, so I also wire the super frames. My advice is to wire. Pat On Sun, 04 Mar 2001 18:25:18 GMT, Christopher Drazba wrote: >Do brood frames need horizontal wires? I am using wired >brood foundation. If so, should I use 2 or 4 wires? > >Chris D. Article 28743 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 37 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 07 Mar 2001 15:40:31 GMT References: <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: wintering = dead bees? Message-ID: <20010307104031.01735.00000182@ng-da1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28743 From: maverick maldimassi@home.com >one of the all american hives has been extremely active and reproducing. >fearing a swarm I placed a shallow super and closed the entrance and >covered the super with a tarp. yesterday I opened the hive, and what a >disaster. there is approximately six inch high worth of dead bees on the >bottom super. its an apparent stampede to the entrance. I still have not >found the queen. I'm hoping she is still alive. More likely they suffocated. You can't close up a strong hive. They HAVE to fly. >how the hay do pro beekeepers transport the hives without having such a >disaster? I just give them a puff of smoke (at any time when bees are not flying) and set them on the truck. I NEVER close the entrances. I've often seen hobbyists close up hives with duct tape for moving, and suffocate them the same way. As long as the truck keeps moving, the bees will not fly. And they will get air, which they desperately need. Another possibility strikes my mind. Did you actually look at the brood when you say this was a strong hive? Or did you just see a lot of frenzied flight at the entrance. Whenever you see a lot of flight at the entrance in late winter, look to see if they are bringing in pollen. If so, it is a strong hive. If no pollen on the bees, they may well be robbing out a dead or weak hive. You can reduce the entrance to a very small one that is more easily defended, but it may be too late by the time you see robbing. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 28744 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!130.133.1.3!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-10.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: wintering = dead bees? Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 06:44:24 -0700 Lines: 37 Message-ID: <985dvb$df7i$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-10.internode.net (198.161.229.186) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 983972652 441586 198.161.229.186 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28744 These questions and more are answered in detail at http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/diary/ , but finding what you are looking for might not be a quick process, since there is no index at present, just a search., so I'll give a few ideas below... > fearing a swarm I placed a shallow super and closed the entrance and > covered the super with a tarp. yesterday I opened the hive, and what a > disaster. there is approximately six inch high worth of dead bees on the > bottom super... how the hay > do pro beekeepers transport hives without having such a disaster? In a nutshell, it is very important to get air to bees being moved. Screening individual hives can get them dead fast if the enclosed bees inside -- or lost bees outside -- cover the screens and cut off airflow. Most pros move them open and unscreened or open with screens over the entire load. We use tarps, but with assured airflow and open entrances. >or how beekeepers who live in cold climates wrap the hive in >a tarp and leave it outside in the snow without having such a disaster There are pictures at my site. One feature of all wintering wraps is holes somewhere for air flow. Even though the entire hive is wrapped, there is always an air hole. See the pictures at http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/diary/Diary120100.htm -- allen http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ --- My girlfriend does her nails with white-out. When she's asleep, I go over there and write misspelled words on them. -- Steven Wright Article 28745 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!headwall.stanford.edu!unlnews.unl.edu!newsfeed.ksu.edu!nntp.ksu.edu!news.okstate.edu!not-for-mail From: Gary Johns Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: wintering = dead bees? Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 10:32:23 -0600 Organization: Oklahoma State University Lines: 10 Message-ID: <3AA66297.54C0A10A@okstate.edu> References: <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: galoot.ets.okstate.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28745 Mike, Both Allen Dick and Dave Green provided good answers to your question. I would add just one thing. Please don't use the shallow super you added to the hive for honey that will be consumed by humans. I would think it is well and truly contaminated with Terramyacin now. Gary J. Article 28746 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.cwix.com!chnws02.mediaone.net!chnws06.ne.mediaone.net!24.128.8.202!typhoon.ne.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Steve Huston" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> <3AA5E017.609C97A3@futurich.com> <985cd6$btqm$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Lines: 22 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 17:19:51 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.31.137.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.ne.mediaone.net 983985591 66.31.137.46 (Wed, 07 Mar 2001 12:19:51 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 12:19:51 EST Organization: Road Runner Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28746 Just FYI... "Allen Dick" wrote in message news:985cd6$btqm$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de... > > About archive on this NG, you can check http://groups.google.com/ > > or more specifically for this NG > > > http://groups.google.com/groups?num=25&hl=en&lr=&group=sci.agriculture.beeke > eping&safe=off&start=50&group=sci.agriculture.beekeeping > > Thanks for this. I was aware that Deja's searches had degenerated in depth, > but not that this new service had replaced it. They didn't replace it... google bought deja.com's groups service. See http://www.google.com/press/pressrel/pressrelease48.html. -Steve Article 28747 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "BeArLc" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: When should i apply strips?????? Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 09:27:56 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <3AA58146.1DD01562@gte.net> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 5 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28747 yes...i treated with apistan last fall.... Article 28748 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!news-hub.cableinet.net!uunet!ash.uu.net!xyzzy!nntp From: J Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? X-Nntp-Posting-Host: 144.113.127.111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <3AA6744F.D1578680@NOTaol.com> Sender: nntp@news.boeing.com (Boeing NNTP News Access) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Organization: Yes, I work. X-Accept-Language: en References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> <3AA5E017.609C97A3@futurich.com> <985cd6$btqm$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 17:47:59 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD Boeing Kit (Win98; I) Lines: 33 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28748 Thank you all. This is helpful. However, this website will have to be posted every couple of weeks or so for those that are new to the newsgroup and don't know where to look. Thanks again! Allen Dick wrote: > > > About archive on this NG, you can check http://groups.google.com/ > > or more specifically for this NG > > > http://groups.google.com/groups?num=25&hl=en&lr=&group=sci.agriculture.beeke > eping&safe=off&start=50&group=sci.agriculture.beekeeping > > Thanks for this. I was aware that Deja's searches had degenerated in depth, > but not that this new service had replaced it. Hope it lasts. > > Anyone else have any neat tricks for accessing sci.agriculture.beekeeping or > the archives? Anyone know if the archives at Google go all the way back? I > keep a page about sci.agriculture.beekeeping at > http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/Bee/sci.htm , and I see I'm going to have > to overhaul it now. > > For those wanting to look into archives, BEE-L has searchable archives over > a decade deep accessible from http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/BEE-L/ > > -- > allen > > http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ > --- > When I was little, my grandfather used to make me stand in a closet for five > minutes without moving. He said it was elevator practice. -- Steven Wright Article 28749 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!news-feeds.jump.net!uunet!dfw.uu.net!ash.uu.net!xyzzy!nntp From: J Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? X-Nntp-Posting-Host: 144.113.127.111 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <3AA676AD.5DC6064@NOTaol.com> Sender: nntp@news.boeing.com (Boeing NNTP News Access) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Organization: Yes, I work. X-Accept-Language: en References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> <3AA5E017.609C97A3@futurich.com> <985cd6$btqm$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <3AA6744F.D1578680@NOTaol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 17:58:05 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD Boeing Kit (Win98; I) Lines: 40 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28749 Ok, so how do you make this google site work. I can only see part of the threads and it seems to be WAY behind. For example the two newest posts aren't even out there. I'm also not seeing these posts out there..... J wrote: > > Thank you all. This is helpful. However, this website will have to be > posted every couple of weeks or so for those that are new to the > newsgroup and don't know where to look. > > Thanks again! > > Allen Dick wrote: > > > > > About archive on this NG, you can check http://groups.google.com/ > > > or more specifically for this NG > > > > > http://groups.google.com/groups?num=25&hl=en&lr=&group=sci.agriculture.beeke > > eping&safe=off&start=50&group=sci.agriculture.beekeeping > > > > Thanks for this. I was aware that Deja's searches had degenerated in depth, > > but not that this new service had replaced it. Hope it lasts. > > > > Anyone else have any neat tricks for accessing sci.agriculture.beekeeping or > > the archives? Anyone know if the archives at Google go all the way back? I > > keep a page about sci.agriculture.beekeeping at > > http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/Bee/sci.htm , and I see I'm going to have > > to overhaul it now. > > > > For those wanting to look into archives, BEE-L has searchable archives over > > a decade deep accessible from http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/BEE-L/ > > > > -- > > allen > > > > http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ > > --- > > When I was little, my grandfather used to make me stand in a closet for five > > minutes without moving. He said it was elevator practice. -- Steven Wright Article 28750 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!colt.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peer2.news.dircon.net!reader.news.dircon.net!not-for-mail From: steven.turner@zbee.com (Steven Turner) To: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Live beekeeping experiment Message-ID: <983993040@zbee.com> Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 19:24:00 +0000 Distribution: world Organization: ZbeeNet computer networking for beekeepers X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.43.78 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 194.112.32.19 Lines: 9 NNTP-Posting-Host: newsread3.dircon.co.uk X-Trace: 983996285 peer2.news.dircon.net 18119 194.112.32.19 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28750 This is a live beekeeping experiment with monthly updates on a website. Read the document at: http://www.beedata.com/data3/experiment Author: Ian Rumsey Address: Morris Green Farm, Morris Green, Sible Hedingham, Halstead, Essex C09 3LU Email: ianrumsey@hotmail.com Regards Steve ... When you go in search of honey you must expect to be stung by bees. Article 28751 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 8 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 07 Mar 2001 23:43:03 GMT References: <985cre$rs6$1@saltmine.radix.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Queen Selection for Varroa tolerance (was Re: Standards for Organic Honey) Message-ID: <20010307184303.06638.00000206@ng-ct1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28751 >I'm still looking for queen testers for this season. > fill me in adam....????? Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC Article 28752 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Apimo" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: new software Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:52:50 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 50 Message-ID: <986h67$4ml$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip35.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984008711 4821 195.249.242.35 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28752 Bidata now up to Scandinavian (and many other) Standards. The 2001 edition includes the following : Queen breeder Register card (build on the Swedish queen register card) with dropdown lists for a lot of stuff. Index calculation on hives can give a help to determine, which hives to keep. It also gives access to a graphic show of hives that gives a visual sight to compare from.. Disease form with dropdown lists for diseases, treatment and control. the forms have changed to tabbed notebook format to get a better overview. Number of frames in a hive is now reflected when you enter a new hive-note. Multi-selection of hives to handle. means that you only have to e.g. enter disease treatment ones and then by accepting the entries, add to all selected hives. This also goes for data entries to hives and some of the hive manipulations. To multi-select use Ctrl + mouse-click. Hives in a yard can be additional grouped. Such as identified by placement on e.g. pallets. If grouped the hives will be kept together. Hives can also be marked colored, so that it is easy to spot a hive on the screen. E.g. a hive you must follow, or a group of hives to visual make it more easy to spot on the screen. dial up your queen breeder from within software You can let the software create the first records for all your families and at the same time group them. Barcodes to identify your hives with can be created and put on Avery labels or printed out on letter paper. the barcodes will contain visual information on hive and queen too. The palm OS software now also support scanning of hive labels to place you on the correct record on the Palm OS compatible Handheld device. backup of data added. If you use this facility when leaving the software, you will have the ability to restore data after an eventually power failure. The manual is again in the archive but see it just as a guideline, the help is updated and much more instructive. The software is free for use up to 10 hives and will not expire. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28753 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Software updated! Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:45:51 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 28 Message-ID: <986gp4$2ms$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip35.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984008292 2780 195.249.242.35 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28753 To all interrested in beekeeping software! I have now been updating my software! it is now free of charge for up to 10 hives, and a lot of new facilities have been added. Handheld software also renewed, now with scanning facilities. If you have been disapointed before this new software might be a solid replacement. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28754 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsfeed.germany.net!fr.clara.net!heighliner.fr.clara.net!news.stealth.net!24.30.200.2.MISMATCH!news-east.rr.com!news.rr.com!cyclone.kc.rr.com!news.kc.rr.com!cyclone.austin.rr.com!cyclone2.austin.rr.com!typhoon.austin.rr.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Robert Talk" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Drone with white eyes? Lines: 11 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 03:49:49 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.27.124.89 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rr.com X-Trace: typhoon.austin.rr.com 984023389 24.27.124.89 (Wed, 07 Mar 2001 21:49:49 CST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2001 21:49:49 CST Organization: Road Runner - Texas Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28754 My son found a drone today that had pale white eyes instead of black eyes. It was crawling around and he picked it up to look at it. It crawled on his hand for a minute then flew off. Any ideas on why the drone's eyes may be white. (Only one we have ever seen.) Robert http://beetalk.tripod.com Article 28755 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-10.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Can Honey Bee Stings Ameliorate Arthritis? Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 00:04:31 -0700 Lines: 19 Message-ID: <987au9$k4o2$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <3aa325b0.437164063@news.stic.net> <3aa3878c.761793325@news1.radix.net> <3AA57590.90FF9007@NOTaol.com> <3AA5E017.609C97A3@futurich.com> <985cd6$btqm$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <3AA6744F.D1578680@NOTaol.com> <3AA676AD.5DC6064@NOTaol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-10.internode.net (198.161.229.186) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 984035083 660226 198.161.229.186 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28755 > Ok, so how do you make this google site work. I can only see part of > the threads and it seems to be WAY behind. For example the two newest > posts aren't even out there. I'm also not seeing these posts out > there..... Dunno. It says it is still Beta. They say they now update only once a day. They say they plan to go back to'95. They say they plan to allow posting from there too. Hope so. -- allen > > > > About archive on this NG, you can check http://groups.google.com/ --- Smoking cures weight problems...eventually... -- Steven Wright Article 28756 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "gomer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: swarm bee-havior Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2001 23:48:30 -0800 Lines: 20 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.192.109.195 Message-ID: <3aa70f68.0@newsman.viper.net> X-Trace: 8 Mar 2001 04:49:44 GMT, 209.192.109.195 Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!feeder.qis.net!news-peer1.sprintlink.net!news-in-central.sprintlink.net!news.sprintlink.net!newsman.viper.net!209.192.109.195 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28756 I searched the FAQ and skimmed this newgroup but I can't find the answer to these questions. I would think they're asked a lot. Several times I've seen pictures or film clips of beekeepers who have an entire swarm of bees crawling around on their bodies or faces. Often the person is unprotected --not wearing a bee suit, smiling for the camera. #1 What are the bees doing? #2 Isn't this a little dangerous? #3 How does the beekeeper encourage this to happen? (or does he?) #4 How does the beekeeper get them off? Just curious. Article 28757 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!lester.appstate.edu!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!news.redhat.com!news-reader.ntrnet.net!uunet!ash.uu.net!EU.net!blackbush.xlink.net!renate.komtel.net!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Call for help Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 11:20:44 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 48 Message-ID: <987m04$dj5$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip81.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984046404 13925 195.215.97.81 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28757 my software is multi lingual but some of the languages available suchs a little. the following languages is surported but except from the danish and english the rest needs revision that I can't do because my language knowlege is limited. Danish *German *Swedish English *Finnish *French *Spanish *Dutch *Brazil Portuguese those with a star need revision. I need helpt to the language file which is a plain text file editable in notepad. The helpfile need translation. it is a winword document with some foot notes. because I am working voluntary on tis software, I can't pay you, but I can give you a free registration. anybody out there. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28758 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!lester.appstate.edu!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!news.deepthot.org!solaris.cc.vt.edu!news.vt.edu!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsxfer.eecs.umich.edu!cyclone.rdc-detw.rr.com!news.mw.mediaone.net!cyclone3.rdc-detw.rr.com!news3.mw.mediaone.net!typhoon.mn.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Christopher Hadden" Newsgroups: rec.crafts.winemaking,rec.crafts.brewing,alt.beer.home-brewing,alt.hobbies.beekeeping,rec.food.historic,rec.org.sca,sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: OT: Proposed mead newsgroup - rec.crafts.meadmaking Lines: 10 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 14:36:32 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.163.160.238 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.mn.mediaone.net 984062192 24.163.160.238 (Thu, 08 Mar 2001 08:36:32 CST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 08:36:32 CST Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu rec.crafts.winemaking:69498 rec.crafts.brewing:256796 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:255 rec.food.historic:24456 rec.org.sca:315333 sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28758 Just as a reminder, the vote for the proposed mead newsgroup closes today. For more information about this newsgroup and the newsgroup creation process, you can visit http://mead.contecrayon.com/resources/usenet.html . Christopher Hadden Proponent - rec.crafts.meadmaking http://mead.contecrayon.com/resources/usenet.html chadden@contecrayon.com Article 28759 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!clgrtnt4-port-71.dial.telus.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Quality of Honey Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 09:37:12 -0700 Lines: 95 Message-ID: <988cdj$ouas$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: clgrtnt4-port-71.dial.telus.net (161.184.49.71) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 984069364 817500 161.184.49.71 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28759 I was writing this for BEE-L and thought I'd send it here too. ----- > In a similar manner, those who are worried that plastics heated to anything > less than around 200 degrees will somehow release chemicals into food are > repeating old wives tales. That said, there are many kinds of plastics and > I am certain that some may vaporize chemicals...but not those common > plastics that are commonly used in food applications, and that includes the > plastics used in the manufacture of 5 gallon pails. Many plastics, > including polypropylene and polyethylene can and are heated to near 200 > degrees as a matter of course and, if handled properly, will show no damage. Hmmm. Old wives tales, eh? I must be hitting close to the bone. After all that, I see the words "if handled properly". That's the point. If people are melting the pails, what =is= the temperature? Also I see "near 200 degrees", isn't that around the temperature of boiling water? When heat belts or hot air are used, what about the parts of the pail (hot spots) that are not well cooled by honey? I thought I might hit a nerve when pointing out that virtually all methods used commercially for handling honey damage it and that many common container materials are only appropriate for use at normal shelf temperatures. I actually didn't expect it from the guy who markets one of the few alternatives to damaging honey -- comb honey. I realise that Lloyd is likely an expert on plastics by now, since he is manufacturing Ross Rounds and likely reading a lot of technical stuff, but I do not share his confidence that beekeepers are in the safe zone when using plastic pails and plastic paints, etc. Granted, the damages to honey by today's processing are subtle, and for those who regard honey as just another sweetener or a mass commercial product, these effects don't matter. For those who use honey medicinally or have gourmet taste buds, even the slight damage caused by commercial packing can render honey worthless. We all know how honey is processed today. Commercial beekeepers typically use heat up to a max of 120 F (measured at the contact surfaces) . Many use lower heat, and it is usually only over a matter of minutes to remove large chunks of wax and debris. Honey in cappings is often subject to much more heat over a longer duration. Packers typically heat honey to 160 F for only a few moments, but they also typically hold that honey in vats for a day or more at about 130 F before running it through. We all know what is done, but the question is whether it is right. I know that one of the best built, managed and certified honey packing plants in the world darkens the honey it handles 100% from the time it enters the plant to the time it leaves. The colour number doubles from start to finish. When it leaves the plant it is pasteurized, filtered so that the pollen is gone and IMO, it is not really honey anymore. It is not the honey that I taste when I eat burr comb in the beeyard or the honey I eat when I sample packaged comb honey from markets or stores. I know I am stepping on toes here. Commercial beekeepers need packing plants and packing plants need heat and lots of it. They are in competition for markets and want to use the cheapest process possible because the mass market does not seem able to distinguish good honey from bad, at least in the short run. If they cannot recover the added cost of improved handling, then they have no incentive to seek new and technologically advanced methods of achieving higher quality. Unfortunately, because most of the honey offered to the public is either mass processed or from small operators who very often misunderstand and mishandle honey, the public has turned slowly away from our product and we are losing ground in the marketplace. I am talking here about the output of honest producers and packers and not considering the impact of adulteration, which is rampant worldwide and destroys our incentive to produce a premium product by diminishing the price spread between honey and cheap sweeteners as well as diminishing the differences apparent to consumers. I understand that as I write, a shipment of NZ manuka honey is in detention in Canada, since it tested positive for around seven percent corn syrup. Economics are driving the honey production and packing industry and our product is a poor shadow of what the bees make. The fact remains that the best honey is honey in the comb, and preferably comb made without manufactured foundation. Anything less is less. We all know it, but we don't like to face the fact. Any air, any knives, any augers, any extractors, any pumps, any heat exchangers, any tanks, and any containers that touch that honey on the way to your mouth change the honey subtly. And not for better. allen -- http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ Article 28760 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!/services/server/news!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Files available if you dont want to go online Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 09:45:53 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 48 Message-ID: <987h4s$qvt$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip126.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984041436 27645 195.215.97.126 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28760 Because some filenames have changed here is the url to files: Filenames to get if you don't want to go online: The help file have been heavy expanded, and is the main documentation. You will have help to nearly everything, and if you need help on what is not covered I trust you to figure it out. Help file in English and Danish. full install if you don't have the archive present on CD or somewhere else. http://apimo.dk/programs/bidatawin95inst.exe Update archive if you have the CD or have the full archive present somewhere. http://apimo.dk/programs/bidatawin95_98_update.exe Palm software full install http://apimo.dk/programs/bidata_palm.exe Palm update http://apimo.dk/programs/bidatapalmup.exe It is strongly recommended that if you Update both the normal bidata and the palm software if you are using this. About language support: if you see a star * in program items then you know that this must be edited. Use the facility to do that from tool menu. In edit window right click to get options to save abandon or reload the language file. Language file will be saved with extension of your country code. Take a little time to do this, it is not much work Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28761 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!/services/server/news!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: swarm bee-havior Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 10:24:20 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 44 Message-ID: <987imf$23n$1@news.inet.tele.dk> References: <3aa70f68.0@newsman.viper.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip9.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984043023 2167 195.215.97.9 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28761 "gomer" skrev i en meddelelse news:3aa70f68.0@newsman.viper.net... > bodies or faces. Often the person is unprotected --not wearing > a bee suit, smiling for the camera. > > #1 What are the bees doing? it is a swarm clustering about the queen (not the beekeeper) > > #2 Isn't this a little dangerous? There is a risk about everything in life :-) but I a have in my more than 25 years doing beekeeping never been attached by a swarm. > > #3 How does the beekeeper encourage this to happen? (or does he?) he looks up the queen in the swarm. Put her into a box of some kind (can be a match box) I use a hair curler old fashion. Then he put this container under his neck goes a little away from the svarm and drinking a cool beer he just wait. after a while the swarm recognize the new place for the queen and the fly or walk to the beekeeper to get clustered araund the queen. > > #4 How does the beekeeper get them off? removes the box and places it in a swarm catcher or in front of the entrance to a new hive. then the bees will leave the beekeeper and follow the queen. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28762 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!uni00nw.unity.ncsu.edu!/services/server/news!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Drone with white eyes? Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 13:59:42 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 24 Message-ID: <3aa78eb3.92580620@news1.radix.net> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: p31.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28762 On Thu, 08 Mar 2001 03:49:49 GMT, "Robert Talk" wrote: >My son found a drone today that had pale white eyes instead of black eyes. >It was crawling around and he picked it up to look at it. It crawled on his >hand for a minute then flew off. > >Any ideas on why the drone's eyes may be white. (Only one we have ever >seen.) > >Robert >http://beetalk.tripod.com > Since drones are haploid they reflect their mother's genotype, thus they show phenotypes of recessive mutations more readily. You can expect to find one mutant in every 10^6 or 10^7 drones. Mutant eye color is the most common mutation seen. It is also the easiest to see. Others includ hairlessness, cuticular color, and the morphology of the eyes, wings, and sting. beekeep Article 28763 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed1.uni2.dk!news.get2net.dk!not-for-mail From: "peter white" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com> Subject: Re: wintering = dead bees? Lines: 18 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.5 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 20:18:51 +0100 NNTP-Posting-Host: 195.47.135.39 X-Complaints-To: abuse@get2.net X-Trace: news.get2net.dk 984079255 195.47.135.39 (Thu, 08 Mar 2001 20:20:55 MET) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 20:20:55 MET Organization: get2net Internet Kunde Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28763 Hi Mick No great secret here, The bees probably suffocated.-Having begun to fly, closing the ventilation for three weeks is going to kill them, when pro beekeepers move hives if the weather is hot, we put a ventilation cover on .This is a hive roof made of a wire mesh,and no cover. the bees are then selfventilating. I have never had a case where the bees became too cold under transport. As to your question concerning tarps on hives-they are normaly used when the bees are not flying, thats to say when the weather is to cold, in your case they were already out and about. An interresting point here I live in Denmark where the weather can be cold. Bees that die in the winter are more likely to die from packing them in and restricting ventilation and creating damp conditions in the hive than from cold. We now use hives with open,wire mesh bases and these seem to overwinter without problems from cold.Good luck with the other 3 hives. maverick skrev i meddelelsen <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com>... Article 28764 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Please respond if testing my software Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 23:06:17 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 24 Message-ID: <988va7$an6$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip121.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984088711 10982 195.249.242.121 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28764 I want to make the software better, so all responds are very welcome. please be aware, that I do this of interest for beekeeping not for profit even if I claim a little money to be able to continue with this. I am autodidact programmer so errors may occur, even if I am doing my very best to avoid this. Think about this before you fire your misssil. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28765 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Building Boxes Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 23:50:20 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <9h6gat43df3ofpeti14mvimbmi930ifrbs@4ax.com> References: <3A9EC5E8.1D66DA53@coldspring.com> <3A9FF5B2.5A3979B4@tucson.ars.ag.gov> <97p89u02qpu@drn.newsguy.com> <97qra6$qa51g$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <97reid01ndg@drn.newsguy.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 62 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28765 In the UK they did establish a standard to govern the construction of a hive, the size of brood and many other aspect of beekeeping. However, it was all withdrawn many years ago. I have recently purchased the plans for the hive which are widely used in our area. On 3 Mar 2001 10:53:01 -0800, James Fischer wrote: >Allen Dick said: > >>I'm thinking that we need a standard endorsed by a national, >>continental, or world body. This applies not only to woodenware, >>but also things like 'hygienic' queens. > >Yeah, I know a "hygenic queen"... he will come and clean >your house every week at reasonable prices! :) > >The concept of a "standard" implies that some number of >people come to agreement on a consensus view, and that >compromises are made to achive the consensus. > >I have yet to see a consensus develop among any number >of beekeepers on any issue. In fact, discussion most >often results in additional divergent views being added >to the mix! :) > >>Seems to me that a large organisation already in place like >>Sue Bee, ABF or AHPA could pick up the ball on this and establish >>a standard, then licence the use of marks for the nominal cost of >>>administering and policing the standards. > >The same issue has existed for years in technology markets. >In this case, the key word is "interoperability". Of course, >there is some debate over the optimal minimum and maximum gap >that can be called "bee space", so there must first be a >consensus on the core issue of "standard bee space". > >>If there were a standard, I am assuming that consumer pressure >>would encourage producer conformance. > >At least the first step has been taken - names have been named, >and brands of woodenware that are not even "interoperable" with >more of the same brand have been exposed to light and air. This >was a brave thing for Bee Culture to do, given that some number >of advertisers have been found to be lacking. > >I wish I could agree on that "consumer pressure" is a powerful >force, but "consumer pressure" has not forced Microsoft to comply >with well-known standards, and computer products are both sold >to more people, and are much more expensive than woodenware. > >It is easy to write up a document that says "respect bee space", >but it is hard (and expensive) to re-tool one's entire set of jigs >and implement strict quality-control over tolerances when working >with wood. > >I'd hope that the woodenware vendors would negotiate among themselves >and come to their own consensus, but I'm not going to hold my breath. > >What beekeepers owe the vendors is a clear consensus on >what "bee space" should be, with minmum and maximum tolerances. Article 28766 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.direct.ca!look.ca!newshub2.rdc1.sfba.home.com!news.home.com!news1.alsv1.occa.home.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AA7BC54.B8BD95FE@home.com> From: maverick X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: wintering = dead bees? References: <3AA57A9E.79166691@home.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 6 Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 17:07:50 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 65.5.215.160 X-Complaints-To: abuse@home.net X-Trace: news1.alsv1.occa.home.com 984071270 65.5.215.160 (Thu, 08 Mar 2001 09:07:50 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 09:07:50 PST Organization: Excite@Home - The Leader in Broadband http://home.com/faster Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28766 thank you all for your response. your answers have truly been helpful Mike > Article 28767 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.alt.net!oz.net!usenet From: Scott & Martha Eby Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Quality of Honey Date: 9 Mar 2001 00:49:34 GMT Lines: 40 Message-ID: <9899au$1cr$0@216.39.130.139> References: <988cdj$ouas$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: 216.39.130.139 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en]C-CCK-MCD {TLC;RETAIL} (Win95; U) X-Accept-Language: en Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28767 Allen Dick wrote: > I was writing this for BEE-L and thought I'd send it here too. > ----- > > > I am talking here about the output of honest producers and packers and not > considering the impact of adulteration, which is rampant worldwide and > destroys our incentive to produce a premium product by diminishing the price > spread between honey and cheap sweeteners as well as diminishing the > differences apparent to consumers. I understand that as I write, a shipment > of NZ manuka honey is in detention in Canada, since it tested positive for > around seven percent corn syrup. > > Economics are driving the honey production and packing industry and our > product is a poor shadow of what the bees make. The fact remains that the > best honey is honey in the comb, and preferably comb made without > manufactured foundation. > > Anything less is less. We all know it, but we don't like to face the fact. > Any air, any knives, any augers, any extractors, any pumps, any heat > exchangers, any tanks, and any containers that touch that honey on the way > to your mouth change the honey subtly. > > And not for better. > > allen > > -- > http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ Allen, could you please post more details about the NZ honey adulteration? This is very disturbing if a reputable supplier is involved. Thanks, Scott Eby Seattle, Washington Article 28768 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!europa.netcrusader.net!64.152.100.70!news-out.usenetserver.com!news-out-sjo.usenetserver.com!gestalt.direcpc.com!news.direcpc.com!not-for-mail From: tbpwpp@aol.com Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: If Napster won't help - WE WILL! Read how inside! Lines: 122 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 19:21:20 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.71.111.202 X-Complaints-To: abuse@direcpc.com X-Trace: news.direcpc.com 984079280 206.71.111.202 (Thu, 08 Mar 2001 14:21:20 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 14:21:20 EST Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28768 Having Napster withdrawal pains? Well, cry no more! Everything you want is available RIGHT NOW at #MP3_DEPOT on IRC; the server is irc.action-irc.net. We have Jazz, Blues, Country, Bluegrass, Rock, Classical, as well as every new popular group you can think of. Need some Metallica? Then come to us! We got it! New Deftones, Eminem, Staind, Tool, Backstreet Boys, Britney Spears, Whitney Houston and m0re! Thousands of videos. Direct instant downloads, cable speeds, no hassles! If you are new to IRC, you are in for a real treat. There are none of the hassles you have with Napster. You don't get half a file then never see the user again. And, unlike Napster, we don't have a million users, each with the same 3 files! Just download a database list, select your file and download. You can choose from over 50 MP3 databases. Our MP3 databases range from 100 gigabytes to a terabyte - that's right, a Terrabyte of MP3's in ONE PLACE! Need speed? Well, most of our databases are cable or T-1. The servers are all megaspeed - all are on a fiber channel. You won't be disappointed. And we have servers in the U.S., Canada, Europe, even Australia. Wherever you are, there is a server close enough to give you top speed! Action_IRC is a small network, owned and operated By the users. We are a friendly bunch - but we unquestionably have the largest music library on the Internet. We have 10 servers worldwide and 300 channels. Our selection is absolutely incredible. Of course we have all the modern pop, rock, and rap. But then we also have jazz, blues, bluegrass, country, classical, 50's, and anything else you are looking for. Looking for Celtic Mouth Music? No? Well, how about Hilary Hahn, BEETHOVEN Violin Concerto or BERNSTEIN Serenade - Aristophanes? Or a rare Jimmi Hendrix boot? Frank Zappa Compositions by the Kronos Quartet? All of the works of Robert Johnson or Howlin' Wolf? Carter Family, anyone? Or the Library of Congress collection of great American folk? Or Hank Williams demos? That oldie from your Senior Prom - or the newbie, as the case may be... we have it all. Did you know that the Chordettes did a female barbarshop album? Yeah, we got that. But music is not all we have. Action_IRC also has the largest binary library on the net. Want movies? Then visit #Movietime or #Movieland for them. Is videos your thing? Then you will want to check out #Musicvideos. And don't forget to stop by #Warez4u, #Hotwarez, #Crackhouse, or #Gametime. Everything you need and want, in one convenient place and, as a bonus, REAL NICE PPL! Friendly chat, and OPS who are actually users, not pricks. You have a real opportunity to pitch in and help your fellow internet junkies, and maybe earn OP or even IRCOP status. So stop by and see us. We will be waiting for you! IF YOU HAVE NEVER USED IRC BEFORE --------------------------------- If you have never used IRC before, IRC is really easy to use. Any of the following links will directly download MIRC, the program you need: http://www.kissland.com/mirc/mirc582t.exe http://www.carbosoft.com/mirc/mirc582t.exe ftp://mirc.entic.net/pub/mIRC/mirc582t.exe http://mirc.mcclimans.com/downloads/mirc582t.exe NOTE TO TECHIES: ONLY use MIRC, 5.71 or above. That's because you will need to load SpR, a MIRC script to access the databases. It works only on MIRC 5.71 or higher. Install MIRC, then look for this server: Action-IRC If you can't find it, or are using an earlier version of MIRC (or another client) then either add this server: irc.action-irc.net or just type /join irc.action-irc.net When you connect to irc.action-irc.net, a window will pop up with lots of channels. Select them all and delete them. Then add this channel #MP3_Depot You need the #. Join that channel. If you can't figure out how to add a channel, once you have logged into a server and get the welcome message, close the menu box and at the bottom of the page just type this: /join #MP3_Depot No space or other character before the / That will bring you to our channel From there just ask any question you have and someone will answer it. urehfbkplcfrbblgyutnkqddwtkpp Article 28769 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Changing Brood Combs Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 23:40:08 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <97cni4$ojvr9$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 23 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28769 Sure, no problem. In one hive last year the bees swarn\med almost completely out. The few that were left seemed very 'down hearted' (not very active). The existing combs were torn apart to try and build emergency queen cells and, because there were fewer bees and the weather was very damp, most of the frames gort damp and covered in fungus. I took the worst ones out before winter set in but I want to get them on good and clean new comb for winter. The two other boxes were bees I bought from an old beekeeper who had given up. They were in a bad state and, where one frame had been missed out, the bees had built wild comb. Again, they were very old and dark frames. Aside from that, many thanks to everyone for their help. On Sun, 25 Feb 2001 21:56:10 -0700, "Allen Dick" wrote: >> > With three of my hives this year I want to replace all the brood combs >> > and boxes. >Do you mind if I ask why? >allen Article 28770 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 00:02:37 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 44 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28770 Interesting to hear the comments. In the UK cedar is used (in the main) for hive bodies etc and painting seems to be frowned upon, they prefer to treat with preservative recommended for use with bees. I think the reason depends upon climate. In the UK we are a little damp! Therefore to seal wood with paint stops any breathing. Also pine (or at least the pine we get here in the UK) would not last five minutes. Having said that I do know of a couple of people using pine. On 3 Mar 2001 11:18:45 -0800, James Fischer wrote: >Jennifer said: > >>...what kind of wood would be best suited for building >>my own hive bodies and supers? We've got hemlock, beech, >>maple (although that's used for the sugaring), pine, and >>probably a lot more. The wood he'll mill the most is >>probably the hemlock, and he says that's a very hard wood. >> >>How suitable would that bee for building hives? The pine would >>probably be best, from what he says. Any thoughts on the woods >>I mentioned, and any others that might work? > >The bees won't mind, no matter which wood you use. > >Your table saw (unless equipped with carbide blades) >certainly WILL mind harder woods. (I love the carbide- >tipped adjustable dado blade sold by Sears that "wobbles", >as it cuts through oak like it was butter.) > >Most of the woodenware one can buy is pine, and I have yet >to hear anyone criticize pine as a "poor choice". A good >paint job seems to be more important than the type of wood >used. > >Rossman makes their woodenware from Cypress >see http://www.gabees.com/cypress.htm > >Here's one option that starts to seem silly - MAHOGANY!!! >see http://www.bee-commerce.com/gifts/estatehive.htm >of course, at $1,500 each, one should expect a solid >gold entrance reducer! Article 28771 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnitebee" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <3aa78eb3.92580620@news1.radix.net> Subject: George's PINK PAGES March 2001 Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 20:33:45 -0500 Lines: 8 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.181 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.181 Message-ID: <3aa832f5_2@news.cybertours.com> X-Trace: 8 Mar 2001 20:33:41 -0500, 64.208.65.181 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.98.63.6 Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!news.cybertours.com!64.208.65.181 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28771 George's PINK PAGES March 2001 http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/contentpages/articles.html Regards, Herb/Norma Article 28772 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool2-12.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Quality of Honey Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 20:37:17 -0700 Lines: 22 Message-ID: <989j5j$14nds$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <988cdj$ouas$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <9899au$1cr$0@216.39.130.139> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool2-12.internode.net (198.161.229.204) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 984109047 1203644 198.161.229.204 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28772 > > I understand that as I write, a shipment > > of NZ manuka honey is in detention in Canada, since it tested positive for > > around seven percent corn syrup. > Allen, could you please post more details about the NZ honey adulteration? This > is very disturbing if a reputable supplier is involved. Sorry, this is all I have. -- allen http://www.internode.net/HoneyBee/ --- I worked in a health food store once. A guy came in and asked me, "If I melt dry ice, can I take a bath without getting wet?" -- Steven Wright Article 28773 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!uunet!dca.uu.net!eanews1.unisys.com!plnews.pl.unisys.com!not-for-mail From: "Clive Tooth" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: All your bees are belong to us. Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 11:17:16 -0000 Organization: We get signal. Lines: 8 Message-ID: <98ae1c$m2i$1@mail.pl.unisys.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.39.129.234 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3612.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3612.1700 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28773 For great justice. -- Clive Tooth http://www.pisquaredoversix.force9.co.uk/ End of document Article 28774 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "BeArLc" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Veil.... Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 11:27:18 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 14 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28774 Heya... I have 2 veils. One ive never used that has the strings attached in the back...and a loop in the front. How do I tie this thing on...doesn't seem to fit as snug as the one with strings attached in the front. Joe -- ===================================== http://www.jaxworld.com/lowcarb/joe.html ===================================== Article 28775 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnitebee" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: George's PINK PAGES March 2001 Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 08:37:39 -0500 Lines: 21 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.29 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.29 Message-ID: <3aa8dc80_2@news.cybertours.com> X-Trace: 9 Mar 2001 08:37:04 -0500, 64.208.65.29 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.98.63.6 Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!newsfeed.cwix.com!news.cybertours.com!64.208.65.29 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28775 Greetings! Updated pages: George's PINK PAGES March 2001 http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/contentpages/articles.html -- Herb/Norma Bee Holly-B Apiary PO Box 26 Wells,Maine 04090-0026 "an educated consumer is YOUR best customer" The Beekeeper's Home on the Internet http://www.mainebee.com Stony Critters http://www.stonycritters.com Betty's Driftwood Santa Site http://pages.ivillage.com/santasite/index.html Article 28776 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Confused? Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 17:42:28 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 23 Message-ID: <98b0o4$cku$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip122.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984155716 12958 195.215.97.122 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28776 Bidata is win98/NT software despit of the naming of the archive. Registration have changed. $US45 for a twenty hive registration included a CD. $US100 for a full registration CD included. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28777 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Confused? Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 18:05:27 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 43 Message-ID: <98b224$g1a$1@news.inet.tele.dk> References: <98b0o4$cku$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip83.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984157060 16426 195.249.242.83 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28777 sorry should have gone private! -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk "Jorn Johanesson" skrev i en meddelelse news:98b0o4$cku$1@news.inet.tele.dk... > Bidata is win98/NT software despit of the naming of the archive. > > Registration have changed. $US45 for a twenty hive registration included a > CD. > > $US100 for a full registration CD included. > > -- > Best regards > Jorn Johanesson > > Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 > > hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software > 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. > all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen > breeder > free of charge up to 10 hives. > > home page = HTTP://apimo.dk > e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk > > Article 28778 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!news.stealth.net!newspeer1.nac.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Veil.... Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 22:22:07 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 12 Message-ID: <3aa95764.82205961@news1.radix.net> References: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p35.a4.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28778 On 09 Mar 2001 20:55:40 GMT, beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) wrote: >Run the strings through the loop. Down to your hips across your waist and tie >in front. > >My strings shrunk over winter. > Once the season gets underway and they have you going 24/7 they get longer. beekeep Article 28779 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 30 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 09 Mar 2001 20:55:40 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Veil.... Message-ID: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28779 Run the strings through the loop. Down to your hips across your waist and tie in front. My strings shrunk over winter. Taliban's supreme commander, Mullah Mohammed Omar can kiss my ass. Article 28780 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "BeArLc" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Veil.... Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 14:13:20 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 11 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28780 Hmm...dunno if there is enough string on mine either...but i will try that. You say your strings shrunk or is it something else has grown...lol... Click on my link and see what NOT eating honey will do...hehe thanks man...Joe ===================================== http://www.jaxworld.com/lowcarb/joe.html ===================================== Article 28781 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Lines: 25 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:43 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.137.191.133 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 984181953 212.137.191.133 (Fri, 09 Mar 2001 23:52:33 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 23:52:33 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28781 "Steven Newport" wrote in message news:lo6gatkur4i3fjjocnisdsrmv7cu18v3gf@4ax.com... > Interesting to hear the comments. In the UK cedar is used (in the > main) for hive bodies etc and painting seems to be frowned upon, they > prefer to treat with preservative recommended for use with bees. I > think the reason depends upon climate. In the UK we are a little damp! > Therefore to seal wood with paint stops any breathing. Also pine (or > at least the pine we get here in the UK) would not last five minutes. > > Having said that I do know of a couple of people using pine. ------------------------ I can't agree with much of this! Certainly, amateurs with just one or two hives often buy cedar, but most of the hives that I know of in this area are pine. For anything other than a very small operation, the price of cedar is far to high - and woodpeckers love it! Paint is not favoured because it seals in water and the wood rots - a wood preservative that soaks in to the wood is far better or, best of all in my opinion, the wood can be dipped in hot paraffin wax. Once you start painting you have to keep going and if it starts to peel then you really need to strip the lot and start again. Unpainted hives are also less obvious to thieves and vandals than white painted ones. Article 28782 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 18 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 10 Mar 2001 05:13:43 GMT References: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Veil.... Message-ID: <20010310001343.00549.00000599@ng-cd1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28782 >My strings shrunk over winter. >From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) That's why I gave up strings. My wife makes my veils out of black tulle, which is kinda fragile, but offers the best vision of any material. She started making them when Dadant quit selling them. She uses elastic in them, but no strings. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 28783 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!63.208.208.143!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp2.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAA4C73.4770A04C@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Frame spacers References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> <3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 36 Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 10:46:59 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.89 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp2.onemain.com 984238686 206.231.24.89 (Sat, 10 Mar 2001 10:38:06 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 10:38:06 EST Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28783 This is the whole idea. To make it easier to uncap. Fat combs are easier to uncap. I don't use frame spacers. I find it easier to use a spacing tool. Try scraping the rabbets when a spacer is present! My biggest objection to spacers concerns mostly brood combs. There is a difference in spacing between worker brood and honey combe. Bees build honey comb fatter than worker brood. When brood combs are spaced, by spacers, to honey comb spacing. much drone comb is constructed. Many good worker combs can be ruined in this way. J wrote: > I don't use spacers. In my opinion if you use spacers the bees will > draw the comb out further. This means when you uncap it's either harder > to take just the cap, or you cut off more of the comb when cutting back > to level with the frame. > > Mike wrote: > > > > I am VERY new to beekeeping, and have done some reading about bees, > > hives ect. > > > > In all the books they talk about "bee space" and I understand all that. > > > > Hive bodies, & supers are built to hold 10 frames for....."bee space"!! > > > > Now in some catalogs I see FRAME SPACERS for 9 or 8 frames. > > > > I don't understand ??? > > > > Why would you want less frames ??? > > > > Thank You for Your Time, > > -= Mike =- Article 28784 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!news-hog.berkeley.edu!ucberkeley!newsswitch.lcs.mit.edu!newsfeed.cwix.com!feed2.news.rcn.net!rcn!newsfeed1.earthlink.net!newsfeed.earthlink.net!newsmaster1.prod.itd.earthlink.net!newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Reply-To: "Info" From: "Info" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Hive Splitting Lines: 1776 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Message-ID: Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 13:27:45 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.21.71.202 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net 984230865 63.21.71.202 (Sat, 10 Mar 2001 05:27:45 PST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 05:27:45 PST Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28784 With the swarming season rapidly approaching, hive splitting should be a consideration for those wishing to minimize the possibility of swarming while replacing those dead colonies that did not winter. For those bee keepers not up on the fine points of hive splitting, American Digital Media puts out an informative video on the subject. The video received strong reviews from Bee Culture Magazine (Sept 2000 issue pg. 9). See the attached jpg for further info. begin 666 split.jpg M_]C_X `02D9)1@`!`@$`2 !(``#_[7T04&AO=&]S:&]P(#,N, `X0DE-`^T` M`````! `2 ````$``0!(`````0`!.$))30/S```````(``````````$X0DE- M)Q ```````H``0`````````".$))30/U``````!(`"]F9@`!`&QF9@`&```` M```!`"]F9@`!`*&9F@`&```````!`#(````!`%H````&```````!`#4````! M`"T````&```````!.$))300````````"```X0DE-! (```````0`````.$)) M300)`````($4`````0```( ```!6```!@ ``@0```!?#`!@``?_8_^ `$$I& M248``0(!`$@`2 ``__X`)T9I;&4@=W)I='1E;B!B>2!!9&]B92!0:&]T;W-H M;W"H(#0N, #_[@`.061O8F4`9( ````!_]L`A `(!@8&!@8(!@8(# @'" P. 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M9=5M:#>AE4'[FH,GNI8\/\`A:9Z#G\A>2YOM:1" M*_RZ32_Q8Y9BT)Q$F.]^:3JX'^$CY/ K&,RW<2 M5+.!M\\ZYHVES*BEE/0$[9)M-_+?RIIERMW;6S-,FZ-+(ST/L/LY)5TZV0`( M@%,R<6*0-RV#C9LW&1P@T.]([*V*`4VI[8=0(0`=R<76W1315IB@4*-AO[9D M6*H-'#WE<@VK2F7[8WE04RP1@5NHS5IFJ1M^.4:'YXK3COX95:;=N7M3;IGCO-B@]'V'X4WQ_P`6_'\,\.L MV!+[&%:YMN^>.-LV*OLK*/OGC;-@ M2^RYSQKFQ0^R=J;G;-M\CVSQMFPJ.3[*[YOA^G/&N; E]D[4]LU!X]N M^>-LV*OLG;OTRQ3VSQKFQ0^RMN^5\&>-LV/S2^R3TZ_=FV\<\;9L5?9(IRS& MF>-LV*OLB@\>.LV%7V*OSS'KMGCK-BE]B'I_#&CC M_M9X]S85'XI]@FF^_P!V7MXYX]S8&+[!/;,<\?9L*]'U\?8YA7WIVZYY!S8J M^O3RIC&K7/(N;"%#Z\6M=]SBH)\,\?9L2GH^PA_GXY8IXYX\S8$/L/:O7-VS EQYFQ5]B?+*WITSQYFQ0^PMNV4??/'V;%+[ _7FSQ_FPJ_P#_V0`` ` end Article 28785 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 7 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 10 Mar 2001 14:23:55 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Veil.... Message-ID: <20010310092355.00602.00000622@ng-cb1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28785 Nice work, I could lose 50 myself and not die. Article 28786 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!not-for-mail From: jwg6@cornell.edu (JG in NY) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Frame spacers Date: 10 Mar 2001 21:47:44 GMT Organization: Cornell University Lines: 13 Sender: verified_for_usenet@cornell.edu (jwg6 on syr-24-95-169-25.twcny.rr.com) Message-ID: <98e7e0$2o4$1@news01.cit.cornell.edu> References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> <3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com> <3AAA4C73.4770A04C@together.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: syr-24-95-169-25.twcny.rr.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Trace: news01.cit.cornell.edu 984260864 2820 24.95.169.25 (10 Mar 2001 21:47:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news01.cit.cornell.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 10 Mar 2001 21:47:44 GMT X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.9 (Released Version) (x86 32bit) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28786 In article <3AAA4C73.4770A04C@together.net>, mpalmer@together.net says... > >This is the whole idea. To make it easier to uncap. Fat combs are easier to >uncap. I don't use frame spacers. I find it easier to use a spacing tool. Try >scraping the rabbets when a spacer is present! > My biggest objection to spacers concerns mostly brood combs. There is a >difference in spacing between worker brood and honey combe. Bees build honey >comb fatter than worker brood. When brood combs are spaced, by spacers, to >honey comb spacing. much drone comb is constructed. Many good worker combs >can be ruined in this way. (ditto) Article 28787 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!kilty.demon.co.uk!honeymountain From: James Kilty Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:31:14 +0000 Message-ID: References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 984264241 nnrp-13:8886 NO-IDENT kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Lines: 18 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28787 In article , Steven Newport writes >Interesting to hear the comments. In the UK cedar is used (in the >main) for hive bodies etc and painting seems to be frowned upon, they >prefer to treat with preservative recommended for use with bees. There's no point painting (red) cedar. It lasts and lasts without preservative. If needed a cuprinol type bee friendly coat is all that is needed to keep the wood good for more years. I have some that must be 50 years old that have probably never been treated. > I >think the reason depends upon climate. In the UK we are a little damp! >Therefore to seal wood with paint stops any breathing. Also pine (or >at least the pine we get here in the UK) would not last five minutes. Some of us make our own from 12mm ply and they work out a small but significant % cheaper than Thorne's cedar seconds which are superb quality with a few knots only. -- James Kilty Article 28788 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!kilty.demon.co.uk!honeymountain From: James Kilty Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Preserving Hive Bodies Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:32:35 +0000 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 984264244 nnrp-13:8886 NO-IDENT kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Lines: 6 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28788 In article , Me writes all snipped Sometimes we like to reply off list. To you (you@home.com>? -- James Kilty Article 28789 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: James Fischer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: 10 Mar 2001 19:06:05 -0800 Organization: Newsguy News Service [http://newsguy.com] Lines: 43 Message-ID: <98eq2t0gh@drn.newsguy.com> References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-674.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News v2.65 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28789 Peter said, about painting of hives in the UK: > Paint is not favoured because it seals in water and the > wood rots - a wood preservative that soaks in to the wood > is far better or, best of all in my opinion, the wood can > be dipped in hot paraffin wax. To each his own, and certainly the UK holds the original patent on the damp/rainy day. There are a few points in favor of painting in areas where one has more sun, not the least of which is the lower solar gain and lower internal hive temperatures of a hive painted a light color versus a "natural wood" finish. As I recall, this newsgroup was the forum for a lengthy discussion of the "advantages" of dark-colored hive bodies in lowering varroa mite populations, but the trade-off was that these darker colors also produced less brood, and less honey. As I recall, the study sample size was a bit small, but the results were statistically significant. > Once you start painting you have to keep going and if it > starts to peel then you really need to strip the lot and > start again. True - painting implies eventual repainting. > Unpainted hives are also less obvious to thieves and > vandals than white painted ones. ...but who said anything about WHITE paint? :) All my woodenware is painted shades of greenish-yellow, just to blend in with the surrounding grasses and be unobtrusive. This is certainly not the best job of camouflage possible, but I have never seen a true "camouflaged hive". Come to think of it, "true camouflage" would be something that one would NEVER see, so I guess all I can say is that I have not seen any poor attempts at army-style camouflage. Honestly, most purists in the US DO paint their hives white. Most photos do show white equipment. Article 28790 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!europa.netcrusader.net!63.208.208.143!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp1.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAB6F73.23B67F91@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <98eq2t0gh@drn.newsguy.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 25 Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:28:35 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.30 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp1.onemain.com 984313194 206.231.24.30 (Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:19:54 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:19:54 EST Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28790 I prefer the rainbow effect. With all the new house construction in my area, there are lots of folks painting houses. Everybody seems to want their house one of the "new" colors. If the color isn't mixed just right, the homeowner complains. The storekeeper is left with gallons and gallons of "mistinted" paint. These can usually be gotten for free, or $5 a gallon. The only color I ever repainted was a lemon yellow. Too bright for me! Also, I think it better not to hide your bees. If you are friendly with the neighbors, they will tell you if the covers have blown off or a heifer has knocked some hives over. A reward of honey, and your phone number will work wonders. Mike James Fischer wrote: > ...but who said anything about WHITE paint? :) All my > woodenware is painted shades of greenish-yellow, just to > blend in with the surrounding grasses and be unobtrusive. > This is certainly not the best job of camouflage possible, > but I have never seen a true "camouflaged hive". > Honestly, most purists in the US DO paint their hives white. > Most photos do show white equipment. Article 28791 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 21:06:21 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com> References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 11 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28791 On Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:43 -0000, "Peter Edwards" wrote: >I can't agree with much of this! Certainly, amateurs with just one or two >hives often buy cedar, but most of the hives that I know of in this area are >pine. For anything other than a very small operation, the price of cedar is >far to high - and woodpeckers love it! I thought all Thornes hives were Cedar? I know a local bee keeping supplier close to me was looking at buying in pine bodies but decided against it because she felt they wouldn't last as long. Article 28792 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!newsfeed.icl.net!colt.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com> Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Lines: 24 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:06 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 195.44.239.204 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 984350289 195.44.239.204 (Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:09 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:09 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28792 Thorne is not the only manufacturer of hives and just as well - I have just received their latest price list quoting £222.30 for a complete National hive - or £237.56 for a Langstroth! Local suppliers would sell you six pine ones for that much money. "Steven Newport" wrote in message news:31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com... > On Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:43 -0000, "Peter Edwards" > wrote: > >I can't agree with much of this! Certainly, amateurs with just one or two > >hives often buy cedar, but most of the hives that I know of in this area are > >pine. For anything other than a very small operation, the price of cedar is > >far to high - and woodpeckers love it! > > I thought all Thornes hives were Cedar? > I know a local bee keeping supplier close to me was looking at buying > in pine bodies but decided against it because she felt they wouldn't > last as long. Article 28793 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!213.56.195.71!fr.usenet-edu.net!usenet-edu.net!freenix!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Rodney Isom" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Drone comb & menthol questions Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:54:21 -0600 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: "Rodney Isom" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 21 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28793 2 questions: 1) When reversing my hive bodies, I found that the bees had built a lot of drone comb on the bottoms of the frames, between the top (before I reversed them) and bottom boxes. Should I leave it be or remove it? In one hive, they had actually connected the bottoms of the top frames & the tops of the bottom frames, making a bit of a mess when I pulled them apart. 2) I used menthol in the fall. Do I need to use it again in the spring? Thanks, Rodney -- Rodney Isom North Alabama rodneyi@nooospam.hiwaay.net (remove obvious part to reply) Article 28794 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!arclight.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!paloalto-snh1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!paloalto-snr1.gtei.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAC447A.DE12D143@gte.net> From: Chad Howell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en]C-CCK-MCD {GTE Internetworking} (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <98eq2t0gh@drn.newsguy.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 50 X-Trace: +4LrtsY0c/dIpYajdFbwTKHs8yWgcJgRjR1/Z6AVcIKfNVSXBtABpWr0KC7psuL9PzHscqU08lVy!BKEymlI4i3Pfneml0K9Dxou3HD7zytMlQSYKHFhObJdFTep/rEoehI2RCt3s0Q== X-Complaints-To: abuse@gte.net X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 03:37:50 GMT Distribution: world Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 03:37:50 GMT Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28794 I paint my supers with an exterior oil based stain made by Cabot here in the US. My preferred color is a custom color I call calypso green. Stain will not peel like paint. It also cuts the steps in half since with paint one should prime new wood first. James Fischer wrote: > Peter said, about painting of hives in the UK: > > > Paint is not favoured because it seals in water and the > > wood rots - a wood preservative that soaks in to the wood > > is far better or, best of all in my opinion, the wood can > > be dipped in hot paraffin wax. > > To each his own, and certainly the UK holds the original > patent on the damp/rainy day. There are a few points in > favor of painting in areas where one has more sun, not > the least of which is the lower solar gain and lower > internal hive temperatures of a hive painted a light > color versus a "natural wood" finish. > > As I recall, this newsgroup was the forum for a lengthy > discussion of the "advantages" of dark-colored hive bodies > in lowering varroa mite populations, but the trade-off was > that these darker colors also produced less brood, and less > honey. As I recall, the study sample size was a bit small, > but the results were statistically significant. > > > Once you start painting you have to keep going and if it > > starts to peel then you really need to strip the lot and > > start again. > > True - painting implies eventual repainting. > > > Unpainted hives are also less obvious to thieves and > > vandals than white painted ones. > > ...but who said anything about WHITE paint? :) All my > woodenware is painted shades of greenish-yellow, just to > blend in with the surrounding grasses and be unobtrusive. > This is certainly not the best job of camouflage possible, > but I have never seen a true "camouflaged hive". > > Come to think of it, "true camouflage" would be something > that one would NEVER see, so I guess all I can say is that > I have not seen any poor attempts at army-style camouflage. > > Honestly, most purists in the US DO paint their hives white. > Most photos do show white equipment. Article 28795 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Apimo" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: I am so sorry! Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 09:42:23 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 36 Message-ID: <98i1nk$siq$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip30.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984386100 29274 195.215.97.30 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28795 I thought all was OK, but no. The software was working here by me, and that is only the gurantie I can give, but this time, I succeded building in a nice error. that prevented the software from running on new computers with new install. If you can see me now I am frightened out of my wits, and whatever I can write I am very sorry, more than you can imagine. Who saw the rrroe could not initialize the engine????? Please write me and I will do what ican to get this as undone as possible. (CD). The working archive is now in place. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 28796 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 20 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 12 Mar 2001 11:01:12 GMT Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Message-ID: <20010312060112.20641.00000897@ng-cn1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28796 Hi gang a note here for all part timers and those of us who cant afford a "air nailer " I've tried electric staplers but they didn't work, but i found a new tool this weekend that is just great. Its made by Sears Craftsman, its a new type of staple gun that shoots 9/16 brad nails as well as staples. It's the best thing since buttered toast, it sinks those brads right on into the wedge cleats good an tight. Man what a time saver!!!!! Its just a hand held manual stapler, got a big handle makes it easier to use. No more tack hammering. makes loading foundation a breeze !! cost was 20.00 US Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC Article 28797 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.stealth.net!24.30.200.2.MISMATCH!news-east.rr.com!news.rr.com!chnws02.mediaone.net!chnws06.ne.mediaone.net!24.128.8.202!typhoon.ne.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Steve Huston" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: Subject: Re: Veil.... Lines: 18 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:08:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.31.137.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.ne.mediaone.net 984416881 66.31.137.46 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 12:08:01 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 12:08:01 EST Organization: Road Runner Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28797 "BeArLc" wrote in message news:taibklrq3sd2f9@corp.supernews.com... > Heya... > > I have 2 veils. One ive never used that has the strings attached in the > back...and a loop in the front. How do I tie this thing on...doesn't seem > to fit as snug as the one with strings attached in the front. The trick is to run the strings under your arms (one on each side), and then through the loops in front. Then across your chest, around the back and tie in front. Unless they shrunk... ;-) -Steve Article 28798 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!nntp-out.monmouth.com!newspeer.monmouth.com!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.gblx.net!news.phx.gblx.net!dakidd From: Don Bruder Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 09:23:13 -0800 Organization: Chaotic Creations Unlimited Lines: 124 Message-ID: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209-130-137-142.nas3.roc.gblx.net X-Complaints-To: abuse@gblx.net X-Posted-By: @209.130.137.142 (dakidd) User-Agent: MT-NewsWatcher/3.0 (PPC) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28798 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:256 Greetings from northern California... For the last several years, I've been kicking around the idea of getting into small-scale beekeeping. When I say small-scale, I mean *REALLY* small - 2, maybe 3 hives max. Nothing that even remotely resembles commercial level stuff. I don't much care about turning a profit, I just want a hobby-type setup that might turn out some honey for the biscuits. Recently, I've come into contact with a fellow who used to be into the game in a big way - We're talking several hundred (thousand?) hives that he used to shuttle around the area orchards for profit. From the way he tells the tale, mites hit him hard about 5-6 years back, and between that and his age, he decided it was time to bail out of the biz. As a result, he's got literally hundreds of abandoned hives, supers, frames, etc. piled in one corner of his alfalfa field, some in various states of rotting away, others in near-new condition, several buzzing merrily away with swarms he says he hasn't done anything with other than look at as he drove past on the tractor for the past 2-3 years, but most dead and silent. Since I've got an interest (and not much of a budget) I asked him about 'em. I got the whole story of him bailing out, and to make a long story short, I'm welcome to however many of 'em I feel like carting away, including, if I feel brave enough, the ones that are buzzing, so long as I leave one "live one" for him to maybe tinker with if he gets the urge to do so. So yesterday, after putting a load of hay on the pickup, I stopped on the way out, he helped me do some picking and choosing, and I loaded up the makings for a 10-frame hive in the cab - bottom box (an 8-ish inch high super with bottom board/landing platform nailed on) a second 8-ish inch super, 20 frames, 15 with plastic foundation, 5 with bare wires for wax foundation, and a lid that's rigged for a 2-liter bottle feeder. Plus, of course, I can go back and get whatever else I think I might need next time I go get a load of hay from him. "Great," sez I... "I've got me a Bee-starter-kit. Just add bees, sugar-water, and brain-power." So the first thing I do after getting home and unloading the hay is get on the phone to a local apiary looking for how much it's gonna cost me to install a batch of buzzers in my nifty new box. This is where I got "stung", you might say... Joe Beekeeper (not his real name, obviously) did everything he could, up to and including flat-out telling me that I was friggin' NUTS, to persuade me that I didn't want anything to do with the game, that all I was gonna get out of it was a box of dead bees and disappointment, I was gonna spend money from here to tuesday and not see anything come of it, and just basically "YOU DON'T WANNA DO THIS, but if you insist, I'll cheerfully take your money, supply you with bees I know are going to die, and then tell you "I told ya so" when you decide you've had enough frustration and offer to sell me your hives, which I won't give you anything for because I've already got so many I can't use 'em all for my own operation." A seriously "rosy" picture... A frat-hazing to the tune of "You maggot!" might have been a tad easier to swallow, but I'm not one to take "no" for an answer, and slowly, as I kept insisting that I was going into the game with eyes open, no delusions about swimming around in a lake of honey and/or money, was willing to bust my hump (after all, I know about hobbies where your money literally turns to shit - I'm a horseman) for little or no return other than the enjoyment of doing it, and so on, he finally started to "lighten up" a bit and actually dispense some information. In the end, we reached an agreement: On Thursday night, I'm going over to his place to set his computer up for internet access, show him the basics of going online, and get him hooked up. In exchange, I'm gonna get a queen and some bees, some basic tools, and as much bee-education as I can soak up. Barter in action at it's finest! :) Now to get the hive I have cleaned up and ready for new inhabitants... Now, the point of this whole ramble: Is the "NO YOU CRAZY FOOL!!! DON'T DO IT!!!" speech fairly typical (this is about the third time I've gotten it over the last 3-4 years and 4-5 inquiries to various beekeepers in three states) or have I just stumbled onto folks who are sour on the whole biz? I mean, are we talking a "boot-camp" style hazing that every rookie gets to try to gauge their "serious level" and weed out the ones that think they're gonna turn a quick buck without effort, or has beekeeping really become as difficult as the folks I've been talking to seem to imply? George (the fellow I'm getting my boxes from) tells me he was pretty much wiped out by mites, but the "wave" seems to have passed, since he's had several of his abandoned hives "come to life" and survive for 2-3 years with no intervention. As evidence, I can only offer his claim and the 4 hives (that I could tell... there may have been more) that are buzzing right now out there in his "junkpile" - If those weren't healthy, happy, fully-functional bees that were so thick they were bouncing off me as they came and went, then I'm a TOTAL idiot. The one that sat on (nope, she didn't sting - why would she?) my finger long enough for me to get a good look at sure didn't appear to have any problem other than slighly ratty wings - Not real surprising, since she's probably been mondo-busy wth the almond orchard that's in blossom on the other side of the alfalfa field. Finally, what, if any, information would you guys (and/or gals) here on the newsgroups offer a new-but-not-dumb person trying to get a hive started? I've already got a book (If memory serves me rightly, the title is "Practical Beekeeping" - I can't remember author right now. I do recall seeing a picture of it on one of the web pages I hit last night while surfing for bee-info, and noticing that it was listed as one of the highly recommended references) and I've done a fair bit of research over the years since I first considered the idea, so I'm not going in TOTALLY blind. I either already have, can easily get, or can make much of the hardware needed. About the only thing I'm missing right now (aside from knowledge and experience) is the trendy white coveralls, the veil, and the bees. So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? Hoping to hear some useful information, since I've already had the "you don' wanna do dat" speech... -- Don Bruder - Dakidd@primenet.com <--- Preferred Email - unmunged I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart Article 28799 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!mtunews.mtu.edu!not-for-mail From: Timothy C. Eisele Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: 12 Mar 2001 12:59:01 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3aad0e65$1@mtunews.mtu.edu> References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX IT-DCS binary version 970321; sun4u SunOS 5.8] X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 141.219.66.33 X-Original-Trace: 12 Mar 2001 12:59:01 -0500, 141.219.66.33 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 39 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28799 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:257 In sci.agriculture.beekeeping Don Bruder wrote: > So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? > We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe > getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning > a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance > to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to > seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed > out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? I'd say you're doing fine, and going into this with your eyes about as wide open as anybody does. You should probably give all of the equipment that you are getting for free a really thorough going-over to look for signs of disease, particularly American Foulbrood, and be prepared to treat for mites right away, but other than that, go right ahead. As long as you are approaching this as a hobby that is likely to have setbacks from time to time, no problem. Incidentally, now is a good time to think about how you feel about getting stung. You *will* get stung, one way or another, and if you decide that one sting or twenty is all the same to you, then you can save a lot of money on the protective gear by just wearing one of those mosquito-proofing headnets (cost about $3 at WalMart, compared to $12-$20 for a regular bee veil). You can skip the gloves most of the time, and get a couple of latex surgical gloves (about 20 cents apiece) from the drugstore for the times that you *really* need gloves. Aside from that, clothing actually stops a lot of stings. Those that do get through, say, a thin shirt seem to be moderated quite a bit, probably because they don't penetrate so deep and a small motion of the cloth relative to the skin pulls it out before too much venom gets pumped in. Don't cheap out on your mite monitoring and treatment, though. With all the money saved on everything else, you'll be more able to afford the $10 per hive or so for mite control every year, right? -- Tim Eisele tceisele@mtu.edu Article 28800 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.radix.net!news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 13:24:57 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 27 Message-ID: <3aaccdfd.52671140@news1.radix.net> References: <20010312060112.20641.00000897@ng-cn1.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p9.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28800 On 12 Mar 2001 11:01:12 GMT, hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) wrote: >Hi gang > a note here for all part timers and those of us who cant afford a "air nailer >" > >I've tried electric staplers but they didn't work, but i found a new tool this >weekend that is just great. > >Its made by Sears Craftsman, its a new type of staple gun that shoots 9/16 brad >nails as well as staples. >It's the best thing since buttered toast, it sinks those brads right on into >the wedge cleats good an tight. Man what a time saver!!!!! > >Its just a hand held manual stapler, got a big handle makes it easier to use. >No more tack hammering. makes loading foundation a breeze !! > >cost was 20.00 US > > >Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC > There is an electric paneling nailer out there that works equally well. beekeep Article 28801 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 10 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 12 Mar 2001 13:58:43 GMT References: <3aaccdfd.52671140@news1.radix.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Message-ID: <20010312085843.16816.00000968@ng-fe1.aol.com> Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28801 I paid around 100$ US for an Airy brad nailer. it shoots from 5/16 to 1-9/16. Came with 5000 brads. It nails frames, inner covers bottom boards and fingers equally well. Article 28802 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!wn3feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.71!wnfilter1!worldnet-localpost!bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "George Styer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <98i1nk$siq$1@news.inet.tele.dk> Subject: Re: I am so sorry! Lines: 51 Organization: Productive Solutions X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:46:31 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.73.40.132 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 984419191 12.73.40.132 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:46:31 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:46:31 GMT Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28802 Hanging the laundry out again! -- Geo Sacramento, in California's great Central Valley "Honey is sweet but the bee stings" gstyLer@att.net To respond via email, get the "L" out of there "Apimo" wrote in message news:98i1nk$siq$1@news.inet.tele.dk... > I thought all was OK, but no. The software was working here by me, and that > is only the gurantie I can give, but this time, I succeded building in a > nice error. that prevented the software from running on new computers with > new install. If you can see me now I am frightened out of my wits, and > whatever I can write I am very sorry, more than you can imagine. > > Who saw the rrroe could not initialize the engine????? > > Please write me and I will do what ican to get this as undone as possible. > (CD). > > The working archive is now in place. > > > -- > Best regards > Jorn Johanesson > > Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 > > hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software > 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. > all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen > breeder > free of charge up to 10 hives. > > home page = HTTP://apimo.dk > e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk > > > > > > > > Article 28803 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news2.isis.unc.edu!news-relay.ncren.net!newsgate.duke.edu!news-hog.berkeley.edu!ucberkeley!newsfeed.stanford.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.gblx.net!news.phx.gblx.net!dakidd From: Don Bruder Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 10:59:18 -0800 Organization: Chaotic Creations Unlimited Lines: 135 Message-ID: <98j69s$8n5$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> <3aad0e65$1@mtunews.mtu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: 64-212-194-240.nas8.roc.gblx.net X-Complaints-To: abuse@gblx.net X-Posted-By: @64.212.194.240 (dakidd) User-Agent: MT-NewsWatcher/3.0 (PPC) Xref: news2.isis.unc.edu sci.agriculture.beekeeping:28803 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:258 In article <3aad0e65$1@mtunews.mtu.edu>, Timothy C. Eisele wrote: > In sci.agriculture.beekeeping Don Bruder wrote: > > > So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? > > We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe > > getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning > > a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance > > to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to > > seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed > > out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? > > I'd say you're doing fine, and going into this with your eyes about > as wide open as anybody does. You should probably give all of the > equipment that you are getting for free a really thorough going-over > to look for signs of disease, particularly American Foulbrood, and > be prepared to treat for mites right away, but other than that, > go right ahead. As long as you are approaching this as a hobby that > is likely to have setbacks from time to time, no problem. There's a load off :) I know (from pictures and reading) what to look for in terms of foulbrood in an active hive, but since I've got "dead" boxes, what would I be looking for in them to tell? Would cloroxing them be a wise preventative move? I'm already planning on a hot-water dip and some scraping to remove what wax there is in/on them, so adding some clorox to the mix would be a simple alteration to my plans. I've considerd leaving what drawn comb there is on the plastic foundation alone, but it's heavily discolored, and in some places, just plain melted, so I've pretty well scrapped that idea, and my working plan now is to go with the hot water and scrape regimen to strip everything totally bare before putting any bees in. > Incidentally, now is a good time to think about how you feel about > getting stung. You *will* get stung, one way or another, and if you Wise advice. However, if I'm willing to get close enough to a working hive to have the bees bouncing off of me as they come and go while digging out parts to make another hive, do you think I'm severely worried about a sting or three? :) > decide that one sting or twenty is all the same to you, then you can As long as we aren't talking 20 *AT ONCE*, I'm probably going to be able to cope just fine. Been stung before, probably will be again, never been *PARTICULARLY* bothered by any but one that got me just behind the ear one time. That's gotta be the worst one I ever had... felt like somebody hit me upside the head with a baseball bat, complete with a flash of light, then *THROBBED* for about 15 minutes. Otherwise, Yeah, it smarts, but unless I've developed an allergy since my last sting, it's pretty non-fatal. > save a lot of money on the protective gear by just wearing one of > those mosquito-proofing headnets (cost about $3 at WalMart, compared > to $12-$20 for a regular bee veil). You can skip the gloves most of the Y'know, I was actually considering the idea of trying to cook up a veil (from fiberglass window screen) that I could attatch to my Stetson. Not so much for the "cheap" concept, but just to see if I could come up with something useful. I'm going into this whole thing as a "play with it" hobby, and what better way to "play" than to try improving the tools, y'know? :) > time, and get a couple of latex surgical gloves (about 20 cents apiece) Dang... you're paying a *LOT* for surgical gloves! We pick 'em up for about $2.50 per box of 200 at Costco. > from the drugstore for the times that you *really* need gloves. > Aside from that, clothing actually stops a lot of stings. Those > that do get through, say, a thin shirt seem to be moderated quite > a bit, probably because they don't penetrate so deep and a small motion > of the cloth relative to the skin pulls it out before too much venom > gets pumped in. Warning: Story of evil kid behavior follows... I recall a time, when I was a goofy kid, suiting up to go hive-raiding on a hot July day in northern Michigan. I knew where there were a bunch of hives in a nearby apple orchard, and I was by-god gonna get me some honey! Two pairs of jeans, a couple rubber bands for the legs, an extra pair of high-top socks to pull over the cuffs, two long-sleeve sweatshirts, two full-face ski masks like the bank robbers wear (How appropriate, I thought, since I was going to rob a hive), a knit scarf to seal the gap between ski masks and sweatshirts, and a pair of leather mitts with the heavy knit liners. The ski masks went on with one "frontwise", and the next "backwards" so I was looking out through the "proper" hole of one, then actually looking through the fabric of the second. Everything else went on as might be imagined. On, as I said, a hot (probably 90+) July day, with the sun beating down and trying to cook some sense into my honey-fevered little brain-cell. (looking back over the years at some of my kid-antics, I'm pretty sure I probably only had the one back in those days...) Thus prepared, off I went, figuring I was king of the world. After sweating my way up the slope to where the hives were, I picked out a likely target, and set to work. A broken branch made a fine "thump bar" to knock the lid loose, and I got a hive opened up. Of course, the bees came boiling out immediately after the first thump, and then they *REALLY* started boiling when I peeled the lid off, and of course, I was a little bit freaked, but hey... I was safe in my "armor" and didn't pay much attention to them after the first few seconds without getting a sting. Confident in the protection of my layers, I went to work trying to get a frame loose. My pocket knife made a crude but effective "hive tool" to break the first frame loose (once I figured out how things were arranged inside, that is...) and I had managed to fumble one frame out, and was working on another, when a lone bee managed to crawl under the cuff of one of the mitts to zap me on the wrist. Being the youngster I was (I think I was all of 10 or 12 at the time) I dropped everything (my knife went into the hive - I had fun explaining to grandpa why I needed a new one) and ran like hell, with a cloud of peeved bees following, just like a Yogi bear cartoon. I think I even remember them forming the cartoon "arrow-cloud" behind me. :) :) So much for my career as a hive-robber. In hindsight, I should have added a couple more rubber bands on the cuffs of the mitts, but... I was young and dumb. When I stripped down, I found dozens and dozens of stingers in the outer layer of sweatshirt and jeans, but the only one that actually made contact with flesh was the one that got under the cuff of the mitt. I'd have to agree... normal clothing can go a LONG way in preventing stings. > Don't cheap out on your mite monitoring and treatment, though. With > all the money saved on everything else, you'll be more able to afford > the $10 per hive or so for mite control every year, right? One can only hope :) Thanks for the commentary! -- Don Bruder - Dakidd@primenet.com <--- Preferred Email - unmunged I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart Article 49597 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Rodney Isom" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: European hornet problem Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:37:22 -0600 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: "Rodney Isom" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 15 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49597 What's the best way to deal with European hornets (big yellow hornets, we got 'em in the south) harassing my hives? They're not a problem now, but later in the summer, they kill & eat a lot of bees. Anything I can do about them? Thanks, Rodney -- Rodney Isom Arab, AL (North AL) rodneyi@nooospam.hiwaay.net (remove obvious part to reply) Article 49598 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "David Eyre" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: European hornet problem Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 22:11:20 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 27 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49598 Yes. Trap them out. Use a jar with two holes in the lid, about the size of a pencil. Place some jam or 'jelly' plus water with a few drops of liquid detergent to about 1/2 full. The wasps go after the sticky, get into the jar, can't get out and end up drowning. If you start them early enough you can keep the nest under control to even wipe them out. You're removing the foragers! I place two or three around each yard, change and recharge when necessary. Eventually the problem becomes manageable. Regards Dave....-- ******************************************** The Bee Works, 5 Edith Drive, R R # 2, Orillia, ON. Canada. L3V 6H2 705 326 7171 http://www.beeworks.com *************************************** > What's the best way to deal with European hornets (big yellow hornets, we > got 'em in the south) harassing my hives? They're not a problem now, but > later in the summer, they kill & eat a lot of bees. Anything I can do about > them? Article 49599 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 15 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 16 Mar 2001 03:11:47 GMT References: <3AB0E6AD.3965317A@together.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! Message-ID: <20010315221147.00571.00001499@ng-cd1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49599 From: michael palmer mpalmer@together.net >Hmm... Do wasps behave differently in warm climates? Some do survive the winter in central and south Florida, so I presume they would in San Diego. They don't make it thru winter here in South Carolina. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 49600 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Get the updates Plase! Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 10:25:11 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 19 Message-ID: <98slmr$c5s$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip21.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984734235 12476 195.215.97.21 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49600 I know some are interested! Please get the update that removes the errors. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 49532 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!newsfeed.icl.net!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!uunet!dca.uu.net!eanews1.unisys.com!plnews.pl.unisys.com!not-for-mail From: "Clive Tooth" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: All your bees are belong to us. Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 11:17:16 -0000 Organization: We get signal. Lines: 8 Message-ID: <98ae1c$m2i$1@mail.pl.unisys.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.39.129.234 X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3612.1700 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3612.1700 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49532 For great justice. -- Clive Tooth http://www.pisquaredoversix.force9.co.uk/ End of document Article 49533 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Midnitebee" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: George's PINK PAGES March 2001 Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 08:37:39 -0500 Lines: 21 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.3018.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.3018.1300 NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.29 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 64.208.65.29 Message-ID: <3aa8dc80_2@news.cybertours.com> X-Trace: 9 Mar 2001 08:37:04 -0500, 64.208.65.29 X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.98.63.6 Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.cwix.com!news.cybertours.com!64.208.65.29 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49533 Greetings! Updated pages: George's PINK PAGES March 2001 http://www.cybertours.com/%7Emidnitebee/contentpages/articles.html -- Herb/Norma Bee Holly-B Apiary PO Box 26 Wells,Maine 04090-0026 "an educated consumer is YOUR best customer" The Beekeeper's Home on the Internet http://www.mainebee.com Stony Critters http://www.stonycritters.com Betty's Driftwood Santa Site http://pages.ivillage.com/santasite/index.html Article 49534 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!fr.usenet-edu.net!usenet-edu.net!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Confused? Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 17:42:28 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 23 Message-ID: <98b0o4$cku$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip122.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984155716 12958 195.215.97.122 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49534 Bidata is win98/NT software despit of the naming of the archive. Registration have changed. $US45 for a twenty hive registration included a CD. $US100 for a full registration CD included. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 49535 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!colt.net!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Confused? Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 18:05:27 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 43 Message-ID: <98b224$g1a$1@news.inet.tele.dk> References: <98b0o4$cku$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip83.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984157060 16426 195.249.242.83 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49535 sorry should have gone private! -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk "Jorn Johanesson" skrev i en meddelelse news:98b0o4$cku$1@news.inet.tele.dk... > Bidata is win98/NT software despit of the naming of the archive. > > Registration have changed. $US45 for a twenty hive registration included a > CD. > > $US100 for a full registration CD included. > > -- > Best regards > Jorn Johanesson > > Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 > > hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software > 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. > all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen > breeder > free of charge up to 10 hives. > > home page = HTTP://apimo.dk > e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk > > Article 49536 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.he.net!sn-xit-03!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "BeArLc" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Veil.... Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 11:27:18 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 14 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49536 Heya... I have 2 veils. One ive never used that has the strings attached in the back...and a loop in the front. How do I tie this thing on...doesn't seem to fit as snug as the one with strings attached in the front. Joe -- ===================================== http://www.jaxworld.com/lowcarb/joe.html ===================================== Article 49537 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 30 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 09 Mar 2001 20:55:40 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Veil.... Message-ID: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49537 Run the strings through the loop. Down to your hips across your waist and tie in front. My strings shrunk over winter. Taliban's supreme commander, Mullah Mohammed Omar can kiss my ass. Article 49538 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "BeArLc" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Veil.... Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 14:13:20 -0800 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 11 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49538 Hmm...dunno if there is enough string on mine either...but i will try that. You say your strings shrunk or is it something else has grown...lol... Click on my link and see what NOT eating honey will do...hehe thanks man...Joe ===================================== http://www.jaxworld.com/lowcarb/joe.html ===================================== Article 49539 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Veil.... Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 22:22:07 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 12 Message-ID: <3aa95764.82205961@news1.radix.net> References: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p35.a4.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49539 On 09 Mar 2001 20:55:40 GMT, beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) wrote: >Run the strings through the loop. Down to your hips across your waist and tie >in front. > >My strings shrunk over winter. > Once the season gets underway and they have you going 24/7 they get longer. beekeep Article 49540 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.icl.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Lines: 25 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:43 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.137.191.133 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 984181953 212.137.191.133 (Fri, 09 Mar 2001 23:52:33 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2001 23:52:33 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49540 "Steven Newport" wrote in message news:lo6gatkur4i3fjjocnisdsrmv7cu18v3gf@4ax.com... > Interesting to hear the comments. In the UK cedar is used (in the > main) for hive bodies etc and painting seems to be frowned upon, they > prefer to treat with preservative recommended for use with bees. I > think the reason depends upon climate. In the UK we are a little damp! > Therefore to seal wood with paint stops any breathing. Also pine (or > at least the pine we get here in the UK) would not last five minutes. > > Having said that I do know of a couple of people using pine. ------------------------ I can't agree with much of this! Certainly, amateurs with just one or two hives often buy cedar, but most of the hives that I know of in this area are pine. For anything other than a very small operation, the price of cedar is far to high - and woodpeckers love it! Paint is not favoured because it seals in water and the wood rots - a wood preservative that soaks in to the wood is far better or, best of all in my opinion, the wood can be dipped in hot paraffin wax. Once you start painting you have to keep going and if it starts to peel then you really need to strip the lot and start again. Unpainted hives are also less obvious to thieves and vandals than white painted ones. Article 49541 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!europa.netcrusader.net!152.163.239.130!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 18 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 10 Mar 2001 05:13:43 GMT References: <20010309155540.23450.00000602@ng-fd1.aol.com> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Veil.... Message-ID: <20010310001343.00549.00000599@ng-cd1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49541 >My strings shrunk over winter. >From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) That's why I gave up strings. My wife makes my veils out of black tulle, which is kinda fragile, but offers the best vision of any material. She started making them when Dadant quit selling them. She uses elastic in them, but no strings. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 49542 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 7 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 10 Mar 2001 14:23:55 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Veil.... Message-ID: <20010310092355.00602.00000622@ng-cb1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49542 Nice work, I could lose 50 myself and not die. Article 49543 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp2.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAA4C73.4770A04C@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Frame spacers References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> <3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 36 Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 10:46:59 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.89 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp2.onemain.com 984238686 206.231.24.89 (Sat, 10 Mar 2001 10:38:06 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 10:38:06 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49543 This is the whole idea. To make it easier to uncap. Fat combs are easier to uncap. I don't use frame spacers. I find it easier to use a spacing tool. Try scraping the rabbets when a spacer is present! My biggest objection to spacers concerns mostly brood combs. There is a difference in spacing between worker brood and honey combe. Bees build honey comb fatter than worker brood. When brood combs are spaced, by spacers, to honey comb spacing. much drone comb is constructed. Many good worker combs can be ruined in this way. J wrote: > I don't use spacers. In my opinion if you use spacers the bees will > draw the comb out further. This means when you uncap it's either harder > to take just the cap, or you cut off more of the comb when cutting back > to level with the frame. > > Mike wrote: > > > > I am VERY new to beekeeping, and have done some reading about bees, > > hives ect. > > > > In all the books they talk about "bee space" and I understand all that. > > > > Hive bodies, & supers are built to hold 10 frames for....."bee space"!! > > > > Now in some catalogs I see FRAME SPACERS for 9 or 8 frames. > > > > I don't understand ??? > > > > Why would you want less frames ??? > > > > Thank You for Your Time, > > -= Mike =- Article 49544 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc01.blue.aol.com!newsstand.cit.cornell.edu!not-for-mail From: jwg6@cornell.edu (JG in NY) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Frame spacers Date: 10 Mar 2001 21:47:44 GMT Organization: Cornell University Lines: 13 Sender: verified_for_usenet@cornell.edu (jwg6 on syr-24-95-169-25.twcny.rr.com) Message-ID: <98e7e0$2o4$1@news01.cit.cornell.edu> References: <20010306092901.15387.00000007@ng-fg1.aol.com> <3AA57126.4BB7ED89@NOTaol.com> <3AAA4C73.4770A04C@together.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: syr-24-95-169-25.twcny.rr.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Trace: news01.cit.cornell.edu 984260864 2820 24.95.169.25 (10 Mar 2001 21:47:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@news01.cit.cornell.edu NNTP-Posting-Date: 10 Mar 2001 21:47:44 GMT X-Newsreader: WinVN 0.99.9 (Released Version) (x86 32bit) Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49544 In article <3AAA4C73.4770A04C@together.net>, mpalmer@together.net says... > >This is the whole idea. To make it easier to uncap. Fat combs are easier to >uncap. I don't use frame spacers. I find it easier to use a spacing tool. Try >scraping the rabbets when a spacer is present! > My biggest objection to spacers concerns mostly brood combs. There is a >difference in spacing between worker brood and honey combe. Bees build honey >comb fatter than worker brood. When brood combs are spaced, by spacers, to >honey comb spacing. much drone comb is constructed. Many good worker combs >can be ruined in this way. (ditto) Article 49545 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!kilty.demon.co.uk!honeymountain From: James Kilty Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:31:14 +0000 Message-ID: References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 984264241 nnrp-13:8886 NO-IDENT kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Lines: 18 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49545 In article , Steven Newport writes >Interesting to hear the comments. In the UK cedar is used (in the >main) for hive bodies etc and painting seems to be frowned upon, they >prefer to treat with preservative recommended for use with bees. There's no point painting (red) cedar. It lasts and lasts without preservative. If needed a cuprinol type bee friendly coat is all that is needed to keep the wood good for more years. I have some that must be 50 years old that have probably never been treated. > I >think the reason depends upon climate. In the UK we are a little damp! >Therefore to seal wood with paint stops any breathing. Also pine (or >at least the pine we get here in the UK) would not last five minutes. Some of us make our own from 12mm ply and they work out a small but significant % cheaper than Thorne's cedar seconds which are superb quality with a few knots only. -- James Kilty Article 49546 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!kilty.demon.co.uk!honeymountain From: James Kilty Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Preserving Hive Bodies Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 20:32:35 +0000 Message-ID: References: NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 984264244 nnrp-13:8886 NO-IDENT kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Lines: 6 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49546 In article , Me writes all snipped Sometimes we like to reply off list. To you (you@home.com>? -- James Kilty Article 49547 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: James Fischer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: 10 Mar 2001 19:06:05 -0800 Organization: Newsguy News Service [http://newsguy.com] Lines: 43 Message-ID: <98eq2t0gh@drn.newsguy.com> References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-674.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News v2.65 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49547 Peter said, about painting of hives in the UK: > Paint is not favoured because it seals in water and the > wood rots - a wood preservative that soaks in to the wood > is far better or, best of all in my opinion, the wood can > be dipped in hot paraffin wax. To each his own, and certainly the UK holds the original patent on the damp/rainy day. There are a few points in favor of painting in areas where one has more sun, not the least of which is the lower solar gain and lower internal hive temperatures of a hive painted a light color versus a "natural wood" finish. As I recall, this newsgroup was the forum for a lengthy discussion of the "advantages" of dark-colored hive bodies in lowering varroa mite populations, but the trade-off was that these darker colors also produced less brood, and less honey. As I recall, the study sample size was a bit small, but the results were statistically significant. > Once you start painting you have to keep going and if it > starts to peel then you really need to strip the lot and > start again. True - painting implies eventual repainting. > Unpainted hives are also less obvious to thieves and > vandals than white painted ones. ...but who said anything about WHITE paint? :) All my woodenware is painted shades of greenish-yellow, just to blend in with the surrounding grasses and be unobtrusive. This is certainly not the best job of camouflage possible, but I have never seen a true "camouflaged hive". Come to think of it, "true camouflage" would be something that one would NEVER see, so I guess all I can say is that I have not seen any poor attempts at army-style camouflage. Honestly, most purists in the US DO paint their hives white. Most photos do show white equipment. Article 49548 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp1.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAB6F73.23B67F91@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <98eq2t0gh@drn.newsguy.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 25 Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:28:35 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.30 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp1.onemain.com 984313194 206.231.24.30 (Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:19:54 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 07:19:54 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49548 I prefer the rainbow effect. With all the new house construction in my area, there are lots of folks painting houses. Everybody seems to want their house one of the "new" colors. If the color isn't mixed just right, the homeowner complains. The storekeeper is left with gallons and gallons of "mistinted" paint. These can usually be gotten for free, or $5 a gallon. The only color I ever repainted was a lemon yellow. Too bright for me! Also, I think it better not to hide your bees. If you are friendly with the neighbors, they will tell you if the covers have blown off or a heifer has knocked some hives over. A reward of honey, and your phone number will work wonders. Mike James Fischer wrote: > ...but who said anything about WHITE paint? :) All my > woodenware is painted shades of greenish-yellow, just to > blend in with the surrounding grasses and be unobtrusive. > This is certainly not the best job of camouflage possible, > but I have never seen a true "camouflaged hive". > Honestly, most purists in the US DO paint their hives white. > Most photos do show white equipment. Article 49549 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 21:06:21 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com> References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 11 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49549 On Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:43 -0000, "Peter Edwards" wrote: >I can't agree with much of this! Certainly, amateurs with just one or two >hives often buy cedar, but most of the hives that I know of in this area are >pine. For anything other than a very small operation, the price of cedar is >far to high - and woodpeckers love it! I thought all Thornes hives were Cedar? I know a local bee keeping supplier close to me was looking at buying in pine bodies but decided against it because she felt they wouldn't last as long. Article 49550 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!colt.net!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com> Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Lines: 24 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:06 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 195.44.239.204 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 984350289 195.44.239.204 (Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:09 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:09 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49550 Thorne is not the only manufacturer of hives and just as well - I have just received their latest price list quoting £222.30 for a complete National hive - or £237.56 for a Langstroth! Local suppliers would sell you six pine ones for that much money. "Steven Newport" wrote in message news:31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com... > On Fri, 9 Mar 2001 23:52:43 -0000, "Peter Edwards" > wrote: > >I can't agree with much of this! Certainly, amateurs with just one or two > >hives often buy cedar, but most of the hives that I know of in this area are > >pine. For anything other than a very small operation, the price of cedar is > >far to high - and woodpeckers love it! > > I thought all Thornes hives were Cedar? > I know a local bee keeping supplier close to me was looking at buying > in pine bodies but decided against it because she felt they wouldn't > last as long. Article 49551 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!isdnet!teaser.fr!freenix!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Rodney Isom" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Drone comb & menthol questions Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2001 18:54:21 -0600 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: "Rodney Isom" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 21 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49551 2 questions: 1) When reversing my hive bodies, I found that the bees had built a lot of drone comb on the bottoms of the frames, between the top (before I reversed them) and bottom boxes. Should I leave it be or remove it? In one hive, they had actually connected the bottoms of the top frames & the tops of the bottom frames, making a bit of a mess when I pulled them apart. 2) I used menthol in the fall. Do I need to use it again in the spring? Thanks, Rodney -- Rodney Isom North Alabama rodneyi@nooospam.hiwaay.net (remove obvious part to reply) Article 49552 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!paloalto-snh1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!paloalto-snr1.gtei.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAC447A.DE12D143@gte.net> From: Chad Howell X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.6 [en]C-CCK-MCD {GTE Internetworking} (Win95; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <98eq2t0gh@drn.newsguy.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 50 X-Trace: +4LrtsY0c/dIpYajdFbwTKHs8yWgcJgRjR1/Z6AVcIKfNVSXBtABpWr0KC7psuL9PzHscqU08lVy!BKEymlI4i3Pfneml0K9Dxou3HD7zytMlQSYKHFhObJdFTep/rEoehI2RCt3s0Q== X-Complaints-To: abuse@gte.net X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 03:37:50 GMT Distribution: world Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 03:37:50 GMT Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49552 I paint my supers with an exterior oil based stain made by Cabot here in the US. My preferred color is a custom color I call calypso green. Stain will not peel like paint. It also cuts the steps in half since with paint one should prime new wood first. James Fischer wrote: > Peter said, about painting of hives in the UK: > > > Paint is not favoured because it seals in water and the > > wood rots - a wood preservative that soaks in to the wood > > is far better or, best of all in my opinion, the wood can > > be dipped in hot paraffin wax. > > To each his own, and certainly the UK holds the original > patent on the damp/rainy day. There are a few points in > favor of painting in areas where one has more sun, not > the least of which is the lower solar gain and lower > internal hive temperatures of a hive painted a light > color versus a "natural wood" finish. > > As I recall, this newsgroup was the forum for a lengthy > discussion of the "advantages" of dark-colored hive bodies > in lowering varroa mite populations, but the trade-off was > that these darker colors also produced less brood, and less > honey. As I recall, the study sample size was a bit small, > but the results were statistically significant. > > > Once you start painting you have to keep going and if it > > starts to peel then you really need to strip the lot and > > start again. > > True - painting implies eventual repainting. > > > Unpainted hives are also less obvious to thieves and > > vandals than white painted ones. > > ...but who said anything about WHITE paint? :) All my > woodenware is painted shades of greenish-yellow, just to > blend in with the surrounding grasses and be unobtrusive. > This is certainly not the best job of camouflage possible, > but I have never seen a true "camouflaged hive". > > Come to think of it, "true camouflage" would be something > that one would NEVER see, so I guess all I can say is that > I have not seen any poor attempts at army-style camouflage. > > Honestly, most purists in the US DO paint their hives white. > Most photos do show white equipment. Article 49553 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!colt.net!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Apimo" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: I am so sorry! Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 09:42:23 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 36 Message-ID: <98i1nk$siq$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip30.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984386100 29274 195.215.97.30 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49553 I thought all was OK, but no. The software was working here by me, and that is only the gurantie I can give, but this time, I succeded building in a nice error. that prevented the software from running on new computers with new install. If you can see me now I am frightened out of my wits, and whatever I can write I am very sorry, more than you can imagine. Who saw the rrroe could not initialize the engine????? Please write me and I will do what ican to get this as undone as possible. (CD). The working archive is now in place. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 49554 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!newspeer2.tds.net!nntp.frontiernet.net!nntp.gblx.net!europa.netcrusader.net!205.252.116.205!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 20 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 12 Mar 2001 11:01:12 GMT Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Message-ID: <20010312060112.20641.00000897@ng-cn1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49554 Hi gang a note here for all part timers and those of us who cant afford a "air nailer " I've tried electric staplers but they didn't work, but i found a new tool this weekend that is just great. Its made by Sears Craftsman, its a new type of staple gun that shoots 9/16 brad nails as well as staples. It's the best thing since buttered toast, it sinks those brads right on into the wedge cleats good an tight. Man what a time saver!!!!! Its just a hand held manual stapler, got a big handle makes it easier to use. No more tack hammering. makes loading foundation a breeze !! cost was 20.00 US Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC Article 49555 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 13:24:57 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 27 Message-ID: <3aaccdfd.52671140@news1.radix.net> References: <20010312060112.20641.00000897@ng-cn1.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p9.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49555 On 12 Mar 2001 11:01:12 GMT, hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) wrote: >Hi gang > a note here for all part timers and those of us who cant afford a "air nailer >" > >I've tried electric staplers but they didn't work, but i found a new tool this >weekend that is just great. > >Its made by Sears Craftsman, its a new type of staple gun that shoots 9/16 brad >nails as well as staples. >It's the best thing since buttered toast, it sinks those brads right on into >the wedge cleats good an tight. Man what a time saver!!!!! > >Its just a hand held manual stapler, got a big handle makes it easier to use. >No more tack hammering. makes loading foundation a breeze !! > >cost was 20.00 US > > >Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC > There is an electric paneling nailer out there that works equally well. beekeep Article 49556 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dc1.nntp.concentric.net!newsfeed.concentric.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 10 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 12 Mar 2001 13:58:43 GMT References: <3aaccdfd.52671140@news1.radix.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Message-ID: <20010312085843.16816.00000968@ng-fe1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49556 I paid around 100$ US for an Airy brad nailer. it shoots from 5/16 to 1-9/16. Came with 5000 brads. It nails frames, inner covers bottom boards and fingers equally well. Article 49557 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news.stealth.net!24.30.200.2.MISMATCH!news-east.rr.com!news.rr.com!chnws02.mediaone.net!chnws06.ne.mediaone.net!24.128.8.202!typhoon.ne.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Steve Huston" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: Subject: Re: Veil.... Lines: 18 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:08:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.31.137.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.ne.mediaone.net 984416881 66.31.137.46 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 12:08:01 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 12:08:01 EST Organization: Road Runner Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49557 "BeArLc" wrote in message news:taibklrq3sd2f9@corp.supernews.com... > Heya... > > I have 2 veils. One ive never used that has the strings attached in the > back...and a loop in the front. How do I tie this thing on...doesn't seem > to fit as snug as the one with strings attached in the front. The trick is to run the strings under your arms (one on each side), and then through the loops in front. Then across your chest, around the back and tie in front. Unless they shrunk... ;-) -Steve Article 49558 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.gblx.net!news.phx.gblx.net!dakidd From: Don Bruder Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 09:23:13 -0800 Organization: Chaotic Creations Unlimited Lines: 124 Message-ID: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209-130-137-142.nas3.roc.gblx.net X-Complaints-To: abuse@gblx.net X-Posted-By: @209.130.137.142 (dakidd) User-Agent: MT-NewsWatcher/3.0 (PPC) Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49558 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1380 Greetings from northern California... For the last several years, I've been kicking around the idea of getting into small-scale beekeeping. When I say small-scale, I mean *REALLY* small - 2, maybe 3 hives max. Nothing that even remotely resembles commercial level stuff. I don't much care about turning a profit, I just want a hobby-type setup that might turn out some honey for the biscuits. Recently, I've come into contact with a fellow who used to be into the game in a big way - We're talking several hundred (thousand?) hives that he used to shuttle around the area orchards for profit. From the way he tells the tale, mites hit him hard about 5-6 years back, and between that and his age, he decided it was time to bail out of the biz. As a result, he's got literally hundreds of abandoned hives, supers, frames, etc. piled in one corner of his alfalfa field, some in various states of rotting away, others in near-new condition, several buzzing merrily away with swarms he says he hasn't done anything with other than look at as he drove past on the tractor for the past 2-3 years, but most dead and silent. Since I've got an interest (and not much of a budget) I asked him about 'em. I got the whole story of him bailing out, and to make a long story short, I'm welcome to however many of 'em I feel like carting away, including, if I feel brave enough, the ones that are buzzing, so long as I leave one "live one" for him to maybe tinker with if he gets the urge to do so. So yesterday, after putting a load of hay on the pickup, I stopped on the way out, he helped me do some picking and choosing, and I loaded up the makings for a 10-frame hive in the cab - bottom box (an 8-ish inch high super with bottom board/landing platform nailed on) a second 8-ish inch super, 20 frames, 15 with plastic foundation, 5 with bare wires for wax foundation, and a lid that's rigged for a 2-liter bottle feeder. Plus, of course, I can go back and get whatever else I think I might need next time I go get a load of hay from him. "Great," sez I... "I've got me a Bee-starter-kit. Just add bees, sugar-water, and brain-power." So the first thing I do after getting home and unloading the hay is get on the phone to a local apiary looking for how much it's gonna cost me to install a batch of buzzers in my nifty new box. This is where I got "stung", you might say... Joe Beekeeper (not his real name, obviously) did everything he could, up to and including flat-out telling me that I was friggin' NUTS, to persuade me that I didn't want anything to do with the game, that all I was gonna get out of it was a box of dead bees and disappointment, I was gonna spend money from here to tuesday and not see anything come of it, and just basically "YOU DON'T WANNA DO THIS, but if you insist, I'll cheerfully take your money, supply you with bees I know are going to die, and then tell you "I told ya so" when you decide you've had enough frustration and offer to sell me your hives, which I won't give you anything for because I've already got so many I can't use 'em all for my own operation." A seriously "rosy" picture... A frat-hazing to the tune of "You maggot!" might have been a tad easier to swallow, but I'm not one to take "no" for an answer, and slowly, as I kept insisting that I was going into the game with eyes open, no delusions about swimming around in a lake of honey and/or money, was willing to bust my hump (after all, I know about hobbies where your money literally turns to shit - I'm a horseman) for little or no return other than the enjoyment of doing it, and so on, he finally started to "lighten up" a bit and actually dispense some information. In the end, we reached an agreement: On Thursday night, I'm going over to his place to set his computer up for internet access, show him the basics of going online, and get him hooked up. In exchange, I'm gonna get a queen and some bees, some basic tools, and as much bee-education as I can soak up. Barter in action at it's finest! :) Now to get the hive I have cleaned up and ready for new inhabitants... Now, the point of this whole ramble: Is the "NO YOU CRAZY FOOL!!! DON'T DO IT!!!" speech fairly typical (this is about the third time I've gotten it over the last 3-4 years and 4-5 inquiries to various beekeepers in three states) or have I just stumbled onto folks who are sour on the whole biz? I mean, are we talking a "boot-camp" style hazing that every rookie gets to try to gauge their "serious level" and weed out the ones that think they're gonna turn a quick buck without effort, or has beekeeping really become as difficult as the folks I've been talking to seem to imply? George (the fellow I'm getting my boxes from) tells me he was pretty much wiped out by mites, but the "wave" seems to have passed, since he's had several of his abandoned hives "come to life" and survive for 2-3 years with no intervention. As evidence, I can only offer his claim and the 4 hives (that I could tell... there may have been more) that are buzzing right now out there in his "junkpile" - If those weren't healthy, happy, fully-functional bees that were so thick they were bouncing off me as they came and went, then I'm a TOTAL idiot. The one that sat on (nope, she didn't sting - why would she?) my finger long enough for me to get a good look at sure didn't appear to have any problem other than slighly ratty wings - Not real surprising, since she's probably been mondo-busy wth the almond orchard that's in blossom on the other side of the alfalfa field. Finally, what, if any, information would you guys (and/or gals) here on the newsgroups offer a new-but-not-dumb person trying to get a hive started? I've already got a book (If memory serves me rightly, the title is "Practical Beekeeping" - I can't remember author right now. I do recall seeing a picture of it on one of the web pages I hit last night while surfing for bee-info, and noticing that it was listed as one of the highly recommended references) and I've done a fair bit of research over the years since I first considered the idea, so I'm not going in TOTALLY blind. I either already have, can easily get, or can make much of the hardware needed. About the only thing I'm missing right now (aside from knowledge and experience) is the trendy white coveralls, the veil, and the bees. So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? Hoping to hear some useful information, since I've already had the "you don' wanna do dat" speech... -- Don Bruder - Dakidd@primenet.com <--- Preferred Email - unmunged I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart Article 49559 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer1.nac.net!netnews.com!wn1feed!worldnet.att.net!135.173.83.71!wnfilter1!worldnet-localpost!bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "George Styer" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <98i1nk$siq$1@news.inet.tele.dk> Subject: Re: I am so sorry! Lines: 51 Organization: Productive Solutions X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:46:31 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 12.73.40.132 X-Complaints-To: abuse@worldnet.att.net X-Trace: bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net 984419191 12.73.40.132 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:46:31 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 17:46:31 GMT Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49559 Hanging the laundry out again! -- Geo Sacramento, in California's great Central Valley "Honey is sweet but the bee stings" gstyLer@att.net To respond via email, get the "L" out of there "Apimo" wrote in message news:98i1nk$siq$1@news.inet.tele.dk... > I thought all was OK, but no. The software was working here by me, and that > is only the gurantie I can give, but this time, I succeded building in a > nice error. that prevented the software from running on new computers with > new install. If you can see me now I am frightened out of my wits, and > whatever I can write I am very sorry, more than you can imagine. > > Who saw the rrroe could not initialize the engine????? > > Please write me and I will do what ican to get this as undone as possible. > (CD). > > The working archive is now in place. > > > -- > Best regards > Jorn Johanesson > > Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 > > hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software > 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. > all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen > breeder > free of charge up to 10 hives. > > home page = HTTP://apimo.dk > e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk > > > > > > > > Article 49560 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!mtunews.mtu.edu!not-for-mail From: Timothy C. Eisele Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: 12 Mar 2001 12:59:01 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3aad0e65$1@mtunews.mtu.edu> References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> X-Newsreader: TIN [UNIX IT-DCS binary version 970321; sun4u SunOS 5.8] X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 141.219.66.33 X-Original-Trace: 12 Mar 2001 12:59:01 -0500, 141.219.66.33 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 39 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49560 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1381 In sci.agriculture.beekeeping Don Bruder wrote: > So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? > We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe > getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning > a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance > to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to > seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed > out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? I'd say you're doing fine, and going into this with your eyes about as wide open as anybody does. You should probably give all of the equipment that you are getting for free a really thorough going-over to look for signs of disease, particularly American Foulbrood, and be prepared to treat for mites right away, but other than that, go right ahead. As long as you are approaching this as a hobby that is likely to have setbacks from time to time, no problem. Incidentally, now is a good time to think about how you feel about getting stung. You *will* get stung, one way or another, and if you decide that one sting or twenty is all the same to you, then you can save a lot of money on the protective gear by just wearing one of those mosquito-proofing headnets (cost about $3 at WalMart, compared to $12-$20 for a regular bee veil). You can skip the gloves most of the time, and get a couple of latex surgical gloves (about 20 cents apiece) from the drugstore for the times that you *really* need gloves. Aside from that, clothing actually stops a lot of stings. Those that do get through, say, a thin shirt seem to be moderated quite a bit, probably because they don't penetrate so deep and a small motion of the cloth relative to the skin pulls it out before too much venom gets pumped in. Don't cheap out on your mite monitoring and treatment, though. With all the money saved on everything else, you'll be more able to afford the $10 per hive or so for mite control every year, right? -- Tim Eisele tceisele@mtu.edu Article 49561 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.gblx.net!news.phx.gblx.net!dakidd From: Don Bruder Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 10:59:18 -0800 Organization: Chaotic Creations Unlimited Lines: 135 Message-ID: <98j69s$8n5$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> <3aad0e65$1@mtunews.mtu.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: 64-212-194-240.nas8.roc.gblx.net X-Complaints-To: abuse@gblx.net X-Posted-By: @64.212.194.240 (dakidd) User-Agent: MT-NewsWatcher/3.0 (PPC) Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49561 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1382 In article <3aad0e65$1@mtunews.mtu.edu>, Timothy C. Eisele wrote: > In sci.agriculture.beekeeping Don Bruder wrote: > > > So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? > > We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe > > getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning > > a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance > > to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to > > seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed > > out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? > > I'd say you're doing fine, and going into this with your eyes about > as wide open as anybody does. You should probably give all of the > equipment that you are getting for free a really thorough going-over > to look for signs of disease, particularly American Foulbrood, and > be prepared to treat for mites right away, but other than that, > go right ahead. As long as you are approaching this as a hobby that > is likely to have setbacks from time to time, no problem. There's a load off :) I know (from pictures and reading) what to look for in terms of foulbrood in an active hive, but since I've got "dead" boxes, what would I be looking for in them to tell? Would cloroxing them be a wise preventative move? I'm already planning on a hot-water dip and some scraping to remove what wax there is in/on them, so adding some clorox to the mix would be a simple alteration to my plans. I've considerd leaving what drawn comb there is on the plastic foundation alone, but it's heavily discolored, and in some places, just plain melted, so I've pretty well scrapped that idea, and my working plan now is to go with the hot water and scrape regimen to strip everything totally bare before putting any bees in. > Incidentally, now is a good time to think about how you feel about > getting stung. You *will* get stung, one way or another, and if you Wise advice. However, if I'm willing to get close enough to a working hive to have the bees bouncing off of me as they come and go while digging out parts to make another hive, do you think I'm severely worried about a sting or three? :) > decide that one sting or twenty is all the same to you, then you can As long as we aren't talking 20 *AT ONCE*, I'm probably going to be able to cope just fine. Been stung before, probably will be again, never been *PARTICULARLY* bothered by any but one that got me just behind the ear one time. That's gotta be the worst one I ever had... felt like somebody hit me upside the head with a baseball bat, complete with a flash of light, then *THROBBED* for about 15 minutes. Otherwise, Yeah, it smarts, but unless I've developed an allergy since my last sting, it's pretty non-fatal. > save a lot of money on the protective gear by just wearing one of > those mosquito-proofing headnets (cost about $3 at WalMart, compared > to $12-$20 for a regular bee veil). You can skip the gloves most of the Y'know, I was actually considering the idea of trying to cook up a veil (from fiberglass window screen) that I could attatch to my Stetson. Not so much for the "cheap" concept, but just to see if I could come up with something useful. I'm going into this whole thing as a "play with it" hobby, and what better way to "play" than to try improving the tools, y'know? :) > time, and get a couple of latex surgical gloves (about 20 cents apiece) Dang... you're paying a *LOT* for surgical gloves! We pick 'em up for about $2.50 per box of 200 at Costco. > from the drugstore for the times that you *really* need gloves. > Aside from that, clothing actually stops a lot of stings. Those > that do get through, say, a thin shirt seem to be moderated quite > a bit, probably because they don't penetrate so deep and a small motion > of the cloth relative to the skin pulls it out before too much venom > gets pumped in. Warning: Story of evil kid behavior follows... I recall a time, when I was a goofy kid, suiting up to go hive-raiding on a hot July day in northern Michigan. I knew where there were a bunch of hives in a nearby apple orchard, and I was by-god gonna get me some honey! Two pairs of jeans, a couple rubber bands for the legs, an extra pair of high-top socks to pull over the cuffs, two long-sleeve sweatshirts, two full-face ski masks like the bank robbers wear (How appropriate, I thought, since I was going to rob a hive), a knit scarf to seal the gap between ski masks and sweatshirts, and a pair of leather mitts with the heavy knit liners. The ski masks went on with one "frontwise", and the next "backwards" so I was looking out through the "proper" hole of one, then actually looking through the fabric of the second. Everything else went on as might be imagined. On, as I said, a hot (probably 90+) July day, with the sun beating down and trying to cook some sense into my honey-fevered little brain-cell. (looking back over the years at some of my kid-antics, I'm pretty sure I probably only had the one back in those days...) Thus prepared, off I went, figuring I was king of the world. After sweating my way up the slope to where the hives were, I picked out a likely target, and set to work. A broken branch made a fine "thump bar" to knock the lid loose, and I got a hive opened up. Of course, the bees came boiling out immediately after the first thump, and then they *REALLY* started boiling when I peeled the lid off, and of course, I was a little bit freaked, but hey... I was safe in my "armor" and didn't pay much attention to them after the first few seconds without getting a sting. Confident in the protection of my layers, I went to work trying to get a frame loose. My pocket knife made a crude but effective "hive tool" to break the first frame loose (once I figured out how things were arranged inside, that is...) and I had managed to fumble one frame out, and was working on another, when a lone bee managed to crawl under the cuff of one of the mitts to zap me on the wrist. Being the youngster I was (I think I was all of 10 or 12 at the time) I dropped everything (my knife went into the hive - I had fun explaining to grandpa why I needed a new one) and ran like hell, with a cloud of peeved bees following, just like a Yogi bear cartoon. I think I even remember them forming the cartoon "arrow-cloud" behind me. :) :) So much for my career as a hive-robber. In hindsight, I should have added a couple more rubber bands on the cuffs of the mitts, but... I was young and dumb. When I stripped down, I found dozens and dozens of stingers in the outer layer of sweatshirt and jeans, but the only one that actually made contact with flesh was the one that got under the cuff of the mitt. I'd have to agree... normal clothing can go a LONG way in preventing stings. > Don't cheap out on your mite monitoring and treatment, though. With > all the money saved on everything else, you'll be more able to afford > the $10 per hive or so for mite control every year, right? One can only hope :) Thanks for the commentary! -- Don Bruder - Dakidd@primenet.com <--- Preferred Email - unmunged I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart Article 49562 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!news.Arizona.EDU!not-for-mail From: John Edwards Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Small Hive Beetle Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 14:06:21 -0700 Organization: Hayden Bee Research Center, USDA-ARS,Tucson, Arizona Lines: 13 Message-ID: <3AAD3A4C.E6039FF5@tucson.ars.ag.gov> NNTP-Posting-Host: feral-bee.tucson.ars.ag.gov Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en,pdf Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49562 I received this through another newsgroup - I have no reason to doubt its authenticity. ------------------------------------ In Merced County, California small hive beetles or SHB (Aethina tumida Murray) were discovered during a routine apiary strength inspection of 198 colonies on February 28, 2001. CDFA Meadowview lab confirmed the sample on March 2. The bees were originally purchased from an out-of-business Florida based operation. The colonies traveled from Florida to Maine to North Dakota and then to California in October of 2000. ------------------------------------ Article 49563 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!news-out.uswest.net!news.uswest.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Matthew Westall Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: bee extraction fees and other questions Organization: ACS Reply-To: qualityram@yahoo.ie Message-ID: References: <07d19tc8eh5c8m3m8iei9hdmf7u4qrb2qb@4ax.com> <20010305185354.22312.00000582@ng-bk1.news.cs.com> <3aa4340d.805948391@news1.radix.net> <3aa4d049.845928440@news1.radix.net> <65o9ats0h97sdk4gvr95bbfv9p3gq6bu3b@4ax.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 90 Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 15:40:20 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 63.227.62.99 X-Trace: news.uswest.net 984436776 63.227.62.99 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 16:39:36 CST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 16:39:36 CST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49563 This is kind of late to the thread. We're still a month away from bee season here and all free time is consumed with preparations. ----------------------------------------- Even if the (one-way) bee escape worked, it's at best a short term solution. Greg (beekeep) is right concerning the ability of bees to find another entrance. I've seen bees march across the other side of a roof when one entrance was closed. EVEN if you could find every entrance (nearly impossible even on newly constructed houses with fresh caulking) the smell of rotting brood later in the summer would shortly convince you that it was the wrong decision. Depending on how hot your area gets during summer, you might find a nice pool of wax and honey slurry waiting at the bottom of your fireplace. Bees (alive) keep a hive from melting down. My solution? Stuff insulation up into the chimney to fill the inside so bees can't find their way into your house. That seems to be Dennis Haisten's objection to the bees. If you were to let a beehive live in your house, the chimney would be the perfect location. Long term solution? Find a beekeeper whom is willing to do what's known as "The cone method". It basically forces a majority of the workforce out of the hive and into another (beekeeper's) hive immediately outside the entrance. Bees fly out and can't return so they use the new hive as a 'cheap' substitute. When the bulk of the hive is trapped out and the hive is requeened, the trap (cone) is removed and the hive inside your chimney is robbed out. Bees are thorough in robbing. Everything but wax comes out - honey & dead brood. When they are finished robbing the beekeeper removes the new hive. Following the removal, you must seal the entrance(s) or another swarm will eventurally find the robbed out hive. You could also have the chimney more easily cleaned once the honey is robbed. The cone method is rather tricky since the beekeeper has to monitor each stage of the activity and add a new queen with brood as things get under way. Matthew Westall // Earthling Bees >8(())))- "Take me to your feeder" \\ Castle Rock, CO, USA On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 13:24:17 +0000, Kidney John wrote: >On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 11:56:45 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: > >>On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 10:37:32 +0000, Kidney John >> wrote: >> >>>On Tue, 06 Mar 2001 00:50:49 GMT, honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) wrote: >>> >>>>On 05 Mar 2001 23:53:54 GMT, dhaist77@cs.com (Dhaist77) wrote: >>>> >>>>>I have a unique problem. The bees are a the top of my 60 foot chimmney, between >>>>>the inner chimmeny and outer "false" chimmney. It is not accessible without 1) >>>>>building 60 feet of scofloding(sp) and 2)spending several hundred dollars to >>>>>remove the chimmney crown and cap. About a dozen a day make their way down the >>>>>chimmney into the living room where they sting my children and eventually >>>>>die(the bees). Any suggestions? >>>>>Dennis Haisten >>>> >>>>A good fire in the fire place might just do the trick. Of coarse if >>>>they have been there awhile and filled the chimney with wax and honey >>>>you are going to have a real problem on your hands. >>>> >>>>beekeep >>> >>>If you can see where the bees are entering and exiting, you could fit a >>>bee escape (one-way) so that, over a relatively short period, all the >>>foragers will be excluded, and the colony (what's left of it) will >>>perish. >>>-- >>>kj @ jaffullstopcoanotherfullstopuk >>>TERMINUS - www.jaf.co.uk/terminus.htm >> >>If the chimney is that bad chances are they will find a way around the >>the cone. >> >>beekeep > >True. >Extra entrances can be closed, though (assuming you can find them all, >or reach them). >I'm probably clutching at straws here, but that's because I hate the >idea of killing the bees, but sometimes it's the only answer. Article 49564 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-02!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:44:46 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 12 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49564 Who ??? Where do you buy from? Steele & Brodie are/were? there only other UK primary supplier. Who else is making hives? Its not that I don't believe you, honestly, I would just be very interested to see about buying them. On Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:06 -0000, "Peter Edwards" wrote: >Thorne is not the only manufacturer of hives and just as well - I have just >received their latest price list quoting £222.30 for a complete National >hive - or £237.56 for a Langstroth! Article 49565 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsxfer.eecs.umich.edu!cyclone.rdc-detw.rr.com!news.mw.mediaone.net!cyclone3.rdc-detw.rr.com!news3.mw.mediaone.net!typhoon.mn.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Christopher Hadden" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <98ae1c$m2i$1@mail.pl.unisys.com> Subject: Re: All your bees are belong to us. Lines: 16 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:10:05 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 24.163.160.238 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.mn.mediaone.net 984442205 24.163.160.238 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 18:10:05 CST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 18:10:05 CST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49565 "Clive Tooth" wrote in message news:98ae1c$m2i$1@mail.pl.unisys.com... > For great justice. > > -- > Clive Tooth > http://www.pisquaredoversix.force9.co.uk/ > End of document All your hives are belong to us! Nice Q*bert score! That was my favorite game. That is all... Article 49566 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp1.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AAD84AA.642D74DA@midwest.net> From: AL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! References: <3aaccdfd.52671140@news1.radix.net> <20010312085843.16816.00000968@ng-fe1.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 20 Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 18:23:38 -0800 NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.235.28.15 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp1.onemain.com 984442761 208.235.28.15 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 19:19:21 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 19:19:21 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49566 BeeCrofter wrote: > It nails frames, inner covers bottom boards and fingers equally well. I hear that!!! AL -- ************************************************* It's not the pace of life that concerns me, it's the sudden stop at the end. ************************************************* Article 49567 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.skycache.com!Cidera!cyclone-0.nyroc.rr.com!cyclone-out.nyroc.rr.com!typhoon.nyroc.rr.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Leif Woodman Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New tool for wedge cleats !!!! Message-ID: <03rqato29r6bnul1ef9tfduomtc81bek92@4ax.com> References: <20010312060112.20641.00000897@ng-cn1.aol.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.7/32.534 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 26 Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 00:43:01 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.24.98.101 X-Complaints-To: abuse@rochester.rr.com X-Trace: typhoon.nyroc.rr.com 984444181 66.24.98.101 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 19:43:01 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 19:43:01 EST Organization: Time Warner Road Runner - Rochester NY Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49567 On 12 Mar 2001 11:01:12 GMT, hk1beeman@aol.com (Hk1BeeMan) wrote: >Hi gang > a note here for all part timers and those of us who cant afford a "air nailer >" > >I've tried electric staplers but they didn't work, but i found a new tool this >weekend that is just great. > >Its made by Sears Craftsman, its a new type of staple gun that shoots 9/16 brad >nails as well as staples. >It's the best thing since buttered toast, it sinks those brads right on into >the wedge cleats good an tight. Man what a time saver!!!!! > >Its just a hand held manual stapler, got a big handle makes it easier to use. >No more tack hammering. makes loading foundation a breeze !! > >cost was 20.00 US > > >Kevin Johnson, Big Johnson Beekeeping, Lillington NC I have an electric version of the staple gun that also does brads. I prefer my porter cable brad nailer. Does 3/4" to 2" and holds everything great, even the muscles in my leg. Article 49568 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 22 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: miksahf@aol.com (David Miksa) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 13 Mar 2001 00:58:27 GMT References: <3AAD3A4C.E6039FF5@tucson.ars.ag.gov> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Small Hive Beetle Message-ID: <20010312195827.00570.00000907@ng-ce1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49568 > >I received this through another newsgroup - I have no reason to doubt >its authenticity. >------------------------------------ >In Merced County, California small hive beetles or SHB (Aethina tumida >Murray) were discovered during a routine apiary strength inspection of >198 colonies on February 28, 2001. CDFA Meadowview lab confirmed the >sample on March 2. The bees were originally purchased from an >out-of-business >Florida based operation. The colonies traveled from Florida to Maine to >North >Dakota and then to California in October of 2000. >------------------------------------ > Everything sounds correct except for "out-of-business Florida based operation, that outfit is not out of business the man in Deland, FL is still going strong, David Miksa Miksa Honey Farms 13404 Honeycomb Road Groveland, Fl 34736 home page http://members.aol.com/miksahf/index.html Article 49569 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 19 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 13 Mar 2001 03:56:13 GMT References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Message-ID: <20010312225613.05403.00000103@ng-mo1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49569 >From: Don Bruder dakidd@primenet.com >Hoping to hear some useful information, since I've already had the "you >don' wanna do dat" speech... Well Jesus weeded out many would-be disciples by telling them the hardships and reminding them to "count the cost." Those who still followed were serious. There are lots of resources for new beekeepers at: http://pollinator.com/beekper_resources.htm I recommend that you start with the online course by Dr. Keith Delaplane. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 49570 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 15 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 13 Mar 2001 03:58:58 GMT References: <98j69s$8n5$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Message-ID: <20010312225858.05403.00000105@ng-mo1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49570 From: Don Bruder dakidd@primenet.com >There's a load off :) >I know (from pictures and reading) what to look for in terms of >foulbrood in an active hive, but since I've got "dead" boxes, what would >I be looking for in them to tell? http://pollinator.com/afbscale.htm Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 49571 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp3.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AADB858.4EBA4A68@midwest.net> From: AL X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> <20010312225613.05403.00000103@ng-mo1.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 22 Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 22:04:08 -0800 NNTP-Posting-Host: 208.235.28.41 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp3.onemain.com 984455941 208.235.28.41 (Mon, 12 Mar 2001 22:59:01 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 22:59:01 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49571 Dave Green wrote: > > >From: Don Bruder dakidd@primenet.com > > >Hoping to hear some useful information, since I've already had the "you > >don' wanna do dat" speech... > > Well Jesus weeded out many would-be disciples by telling them the hardships > and reminding them to "count the cost." Those who still followed were serious. yeah, and repeatedly nodded off and when told not to, and sold him down the river.... AL ************************************************* It's not the pace of life that concerns me, it's the sudden stop at the end. ************************************************* Article 49572 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!sn-xit-03!sn-post-02!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: Dave and Judy Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 23:28:54 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: <3AADA206.825C7A1E@fuse.net> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en]C-CCK-MCD compaq (Win98; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 38 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49572 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1383 Don: How wonderful that you will be getting into beekeeping. How sad that so many are trying to talk you out of it. Once you get started, you will discover a peace that you have never known. When you work with your bees the calmer you are the better. It is a wonderful way to learn a Zen way of acting. And your ladies will reward you for it. Your job as a beekeeper will be to help your ladies survive in a time when the humans have made their way harder than it should be. You will find that you have more time to stop and see the flowers. You will be amazed at how many blooms you have never seen that have been there all along. As a beekeeper you will become an expert on the weather, the length of summer and spring and fall. You will quickly learn to never ask an open-ended question of another beekeeper - you will never hear the end of it. You will learn that a bee spends her whole life gathering that nectar to make that honey, and that she flies from flower to flower to hive until her wings wear out. And, having learned this, the honey will taste that much sweeter because you appreciate their work. But most important of all, you will find that you now have 40,000 or more friends who will always listen to anything you have to say - and they will never judge your delivery. By all means, become a beekeeper. Join a beekeeping club. Read a lot of books. You will make plenty of mistakes, but they will make you wiser. Judy (A leader of 4H beekeepers) Don Bruder wrote: > Greetings from northern California... > Article 49573 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: From: "Jeffrey A. Crowther" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <988va7$an6$1@news.inet.tele.dk> Subject: Re: Please respond if testing my software Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2001 00:03:11 +1100 Lines: 26 Organization: Poor, but getting better X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 203.101.40.39 Message-ID: <3aadb0b2$1_1@news01.one.net.au> X-Trace: 13 Mar 2001 16:31:30 +1100, 203.101.40.39 Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!uunet!dca.uu.net!ash.uu.net!news01.one.net.au!203.101.40.39 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49573 Jorn I downloaded the BiData program 9/3/2001 and was planning to use it in the demo, 5 hive mode, to try it out. Unfortunately I am having a problem with the software. When starting the BiData program, it did not behave as stated in the manual. On startup, prior to the program running I get an error message "An error occurred while attempting to initialize the Borland Database Engine (error $2AO6)". Next I get the message "Unknown Database. Alias: DEFAULT1." At this point I have the basic screen showing the program info (Version number, Evaluation mode etc). When I try to start a new database set I receive the error message "Unknown database. Alias: DATA." I then get a password dialogue box. After I enter the password this box closes but nothing else happens. I just end up at the basic screen. I tried completely deleting the software followed by Norton Windoctor to make sure I have no problems with the system. After this I reinstalled the software but have exactly the same set of problems occur. The program states it is version 3.3.2.2 and is on a Windows 98 (second edition) IBM-compatible PC laptop. Any comments that you can suggest to get the software running would be welcome. Hope the information I have given is helpful. Article 49574 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!nntp.primenet.com!nntp.gblx.net!news.phx.gblx.net!dakidd From: Don Bruder Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2001 21:41:11 -0800 Organization: Chaotic Creations Unlimited Lines: 55 Message-ID: <98kbtb$dc9$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> References: <98j69s$8n5$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> <20010312225858.05403.00000105@ng-mo1.aol.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 209-130-148-25.nas3.roc.gblx.net X-Complaints-To: abuse@gblx.net X-Posted-By: @209.130.148.25 (dakidd) User-Agent: MT-NewsWatcher/3.0 (PPC) Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49574 In article <20010312225858.05403.00000105@ng-mo1.aol.com>, pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) wrote: > From: Don Bruder dakidd@primenet.com > > >There's a load off :) > >I know (from pictures and reading) what to look for in terms of > >foulbrood in an active hive, but since I've got "dead" boxes, what would > >I be looking for in them to tell? > > http://pollinator.com/afbscale.htm Hmmm... looks like there's no simple way to tell with the frames I've got, then... On the few frames I have with intact drawn comb, I can see nothing obviously bad. These frames all contain the plastic foundation. The comb on most of them is slumped and melted, presumably because it overheated during multiple seasons without any inhabitants. The "non-plastic" frames I have basically have a few clumps of distorted-beyond-recognition, very dark, nasty-looking wax hanging on the wires, if they have anything at all. Probably due to having been weathering for multiple years. At this stage of the game, I'm thinking I'll probably discard the "naked-wire" frames, and jsut go with the plastic foundation. Bringing along the wires was mainly for the sake of "Well, let's see what I can do with them, if anything". On the plastic frames, the slumped comb is fairly light in color, and is quite brittle (where it hasn't melted) almost like little paper hexagons. It doesn't "moosh" into a mass like I'd expect good wax to do. Instead, it more or less crumbles, or "powders away" when touched. Again, I'd suspect this is due to it weathering for multiple years. I probably don't need to do any scraping or hot water to get rid of it... by the way it acts, a dry brush would most likely remove it all quite nicely. Of course, I intend to hot water and bleach the bejeebers out of everything anyway as a sanitary precaution, but as far as mechanical removal of existing wax, it doesn't look as if there's going to be much effort involved. The few recognizable (not melted into a blob) cells show no sign of anything at all inside them. I would assume this means they were honey cells that were robbed clean over the years they were idle, as opposed to brood cells, and therefore, should be little or no risk as far as AFB? I imagine the fact that all the plastic frames I have were in upper-level supers tends to strengthen that supposition, since from the reading I've done, it seems to be more common practice (if not a practically-engraved-in-stone rule) to keep the brood frames isolated in the lower sections of the hive. The fellow I'm getting the gear from doesn't strike me as someone to go in for innovation - No insult to him intended, he just seems like a "strictly by the book" type - so I figure he probably went with "the standard way of doing things". -- Don Bruder - Dakidd@primenet.com <--- Preferred Email - unmunged I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart Article 49575 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.skycache.com!Cidera!news-sjo.usenetserver.com!news-out.usenetserver.com!e420r-sjo2.usenetserver.com.POSTED!not-for-mail From: hamilton@pbssite.com (Dave Hamilton) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Message-ID: <3aae1b71.963419921@west.usenetserver.com> References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> <3AADA206.825C7A1E@fuse.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Lines: 10 X-Complaints-To: abuse@usenetserver.com X-Abuse-Info: Please be sure to forward a copy of ALL headers X-Abuse-Info: Otherwise we will be unable to process your complaint properly. NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 08:20:08 EST Organization: WebUseNet Corp http://www.usenetserver.com - Home of the fastest NNTP servers on the Net. Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 13:09:14 GMT Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49575 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1384 Very nice Judy .. I would also say you can invite the state bee inspector or any beekeeper over for a look .. most would be glad to spend some time with you. Until you see foul brood scales in old equipment, its not obvious, but once someone shows it to you, you've learned a step along the path. Dave www.libertybee.com Article 49576 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!colt.net!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Please respond if testing my software Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 15:10:55 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 41 Message-ID: <98l9ao$g25$1@news.inet.tele.dk> References: <988va7$an6$1@news.inet.tele.dk> <3aadb0b2$1_1@news01.one.net.au> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip23.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984492184 16453 195.249.242.23 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49576 I know that after I got informed from another beekeeper, so what you can do is to log on apimo again and then press the update button. It will bring you to the update page. there you can taake down the update software, and install this upon the previusly downloaded and installed software. This will then create the database and then exit. I have made it so because I want this software to work smothly without giving errors. After that you can use it in unlimitid time for 10 hives. I hope this will help you out. I have had problems getting this editon up because of IP problems, I was simply cut of from uploading software this is now fixed. information about Future updates can be send to you when big changes are made, but please inform me if this is OK then you will be added to the update group. best regards Jorn -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk "Jeffrey A. Crowther" skrev i en meddelelse news:3aadb0b2$1_1@news01.one.net.au... > Jorn > > I downloaded the BiData program 9/3/2001 and was planning to use it in the > demo, Article 49577 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.cwix.com!chnws02.mediaone.net!chnws06.ne.mediaone.net!24.128.8.202!typhoon.ne.mediaone.net.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Steve Huston" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Cleaning up defecated-on frames? Lines: 25 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Message-ID: Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 14:26:47 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 66.31.137.46 X-Complaints-To: abuse@mediaone.net X-Trace: typhoon.ne.mediaone.net 984493607 66.31.137.46 (Tue, 13 Mar 2001 09:26:47 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 09:26:47 EST Organization: Road Runner Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49577 Hi, I am in southern Massachusetts, US, and found one dead-out last week. The cluster was a little small a few weeks ago, and defecating in the hive, mostly on the top bars of the top brood box. I gave them some Fumidil-B syrup, but no help. I found a couple patches of brood in all stages, egg -> capped, and the queen in the middle of a small bunch of bees. Some bees were dead head first in cells, but for the most part they were on the surface of the comb. I'm guessing they just got too weak, and last week's cold/snow blast did them in. I cleaned out the boxes and frames this weekend and didn't find any evidence of any disease like AFB.... I scraped off as much feces from top bars as I could. However, some ran down the sides of frames, across comb and sealed honey. Should I replace those frames before putting in more bees? How much can I expect the new bees to clean out? Thanks, -Steve Article 49578 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!tank.news.pipex.net!pipex!tube.news.pipex.net!pipex!not-for-mail From: "Winnie" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Is anyone selling beeswax in the UK? Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 15:46:43 -0000 Organization: UUNET WorldCom server (post doesn't reflect views of UUNET WorldCom Lines: 11 Message-ID: <98lfd5$8dp$1@soap.pipex.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: staff2.gbb.uk.uu.net X-Trace: soap.pipex.net 984498405 8633 158.43.128.153 (13 Mar 2001 15:46:45 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@uk.uu.net NNTP-Posting-Date: 13 Mar 2001 15:46:45 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49578 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1385 Hi there. I don't suppose any of you are selling beeswax, or know of a supplier, do you please? I'm looking for several pounds with which to treat all the wood in our 17thC timber house.Finding pure wax in any but the tiniest bars is quite hard, so any hints welcome! Thanks for your time Winnie (winny AT dial DOT pipex DOT com) xx Article 49579 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newspeer.clara.net!news.clara.net!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping References: <98lfd5$8dp$1@soap.pipex.net> Subject: Re: Is anyone selling beeswax in the UK? Lines: 18 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: <4wyr6.21976$Cq.566529@news2-hme0> Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 00:00:13 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.137.179.94 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 984528000 212.137.179.94 (Wed, 14 Mar 2001 00:00:00 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 00:00:00 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49579 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1386 I have well over 100 lbs of very clean wax available. "Winnie" wrote in message news:98lfd5$8dp$1@soap.pipex.net... > Hi there. I don't suppose any of you are selling beeswax, or know of a > supplier, do you please? I'm looking for several pounds with which to treat > all the wood in our 17thC timber house.Finding pure wax in any but the > tiniest bars is quite hard, so any hints welcome! > > Thanks for your time > > Winnie (winny AT dial DOT pipex DOT com) > xx > > Article 49580 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "David Eyre" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Cleaning up defecated-on frames? Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 22:43:01 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 28 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49580 "Steve Huston" wrote in message news:H6qr6.3550$G76.5440066@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net... . > > I cleaned out the boxes and frames this weekend and didn't find any evidence > of any disease like AFB.... I scraped off as much feces from top bars as I > could. However, some ran down the sides of frames, across comb and sealed > honey. Should I replace those frames before putting in more bees? How much > can I expect the new bees to clean out? If you can fumigate with Acetic acid then the bees will clean the remaining stuff off the frames. Pile the boxes onto the floor and seal the roof and openings with duct tape. Then place a tin lid with Acetic acid on the floor and seal the entrance, leave for a few days. This will fumigate the frames to prevent the incoming bees from being infected with the Nosema spores. Regards Dave....-- ************************** The Bee Works, 5 Edith Drive, R R # 2, Orillia, ON. Canada. L3V 6H2 705 326 7171 http://www.beeworks.com *************************** Article 49581 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!canoe.uoregon.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!pln-w!spln!dex!extra.newsguy.com!newsp.newsguy.com!drn From: James Fischer Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Quality of Honey Date: 13 Mar 2001 21:47:15 -0800 Organization: Newsguy News Service [http://newsguy.com] Lines: 78 Message-ID: <98n0l3011co@drn.newsguy.com> References: <988cdj$ouas$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> NNTP-Posting-Host: p-590.newsdawg.com X-Newsreader: Direct Read News v2.65 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49581 Allen Dick said: >I know that one of the best built, managed and certified honey packing >plants in the world darkens the honey it handles 100% from the time it >enters the plant to the time it leaves. The colour number doubles from >start to finish. When it leaves the plant it is pasteurized, filtered >so that the pollen is gone and IMO, it is not really honey anymore. >It is not the honey that I taste when I eat burr comb in the beeyard or >the honey I eat when I sample packaged comb honey from markets or stores. I think that it would be easy to form a 100% consensus that "heating, micro-filtering, and pasteurizing honey is bad", if not for the incentive that large-scale operations have to create a product with a longer "shelf life", a honey that will not crystallize. Consider the poor tomato. It has been cross-bred for properties that improve its ability to be harvested, packed, shipped, and shelved. Somewhere along the way, "flavor" and "texture" were compromised. Can honey avoid the same fate? Will packaging and marketing triumph again over all? Has it already done so? >Unfortunately, because most of the honey offered to the public >is either mass processed or from small operators who very often >misunderstand and mishandle honey, You clearly explained how large operators mangle honey, but how exactly do small operators mishandle honey? What are the most common errors in your view? I'd love to start making a list of the worst errors and the solutions, as I am sure that many small operators would wish to avoid errors, myself included. I can at least offer that smaller producers are less likely to blend, micro-filter, or pasteurize, simply due to a lack of the capital equipment required to commit these felonies upon honey. Sometimes, small really IS beautiful. >the public has turned slowly away from our product and we >are losing ground in the marketplace. Turned away? What with Honey cough-drops, Honey-Nut Breakfast Cereals, Honey-Flu medicines, and so on, it appears that "Honey" has a great reputation as a high-end sweetener. It appears that the robber-baron multinationals have done enough focus-group studies to conclude that one can sell more of ANYTHING if one simply puts the word "Honey" in front of it. This proves that honey is clearly a "value-added feature" to them. The trick now seems to be to start marketing honey from specific floral sources and/or areas, and take a page from the wine industry's play-book. Sadly, this forces the big operators who blend honey, micro-filter, and pasteurize into the position of selling "cheap beer" as compared to the smaller producers' "vintage wines", but there would be nothing stopping a large producer from marketing non-blended, not-so-filtered, unpasteurized honey. >Economics are driving the honey production and packing industry and our >product is a poor shadow of what the bees make. The fact remains that the >best honey is honey in the comb, and preferably comb made without >manufactured foundation. I think that all must admit that many people prefer extracted honey to in-the-comb honey, as there are a growing number who like "creamed" honey. While a true connoisseur like yourself may consider them "inferior", it might be more accurate to call them "different products". Also, you recently said that some imported honey had been tested and was found to contain 7% corn syrup. What if a simple requirement was made to require that all bulk honey be shipped from producer to packer IN THE CRYSTALLIZED STATE? I would think that this would eliminate some, perhaps much of the fraud. I may be wrong, but my impression has been that only real honey will crystallize. This might be an elegant way to avoid lots of expensive tests and complicated finger-pointing. Article 49582 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 10 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 14 Mar 2001 13:11:36 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Cleaning up defecated-on frames? Message-ID: <20010314081136.13310.00001331@ng-fq1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49582 I know you can get very strong acetic acid through a photogrophers supply. No doubt is is easily available through a chemical supply as well. It is also one of the chemicals the secret police monitor because it is used somehow to make street drugs. Article 49583 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey04.news.cs.com!not-for-mail Lines: 27 X-Admin: news@cs.com From: texasdrone@cs.com (Robert Williamson) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 14 Mar 2001 15:33:57 GMT Organization: CompuServe (http://www.compuserve.com/) Subject: British Beekeeper would like to see Nevada Bees Message-ID: <20010314103357.00548.00001234@ng-ce1.news.cs.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49583 Dear Robert I have had an e-mail from a beekeeper in this country who is visting Nevada shortly and wants to make contact with local beekeepers. I do not keep my customer list in state order so cannot find anything easily. If my memory serves me correctly, there is a Bee-List in the US and you are involved with this. Is it possible that we could use this to ask if anyone would be interested? Many thanks Gill respond to sales@thorne.co.uk Robert Williamson Southeast Texas Honey Co. P.O. Box 176 Vidor, Tx. 77670 " A simple and independent mind does not toil at the bidding of any prince" Article 49584 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Anne B." Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 13:27:31 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 28 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49584 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1388 "Don Bruder" wrote in message news:98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net... > Now, the point of this whole ramble: > Is the "NO YOU CRAZY FOOL!!! DON'T DO IT!!!" speech fairly typical (this > is about the third time I've gotten it over the last 3-4 years and 4-5 > inquiries to various beekeepers in three states) or have I just stumbled > onto folks who are sour on the whole biz? I mean, are we talking a > "boot-camp" style hazing that every rookie gets to try to gauge their > "serious level" and weed out the ones that think they're gonna turn a > quick buck without effort, or has beekeeping really become as difficult > as the folks I've been talking to seem to imply? I've never gotten this speech -- though certainly people who've lost hives to mites have told me about it -- no, I've only gotten encouragement. We're very small, too -- one hive -- we just wanted to have bees in the backyard cause we love them so. We don't even use the honey much -- we give it away. And we've had problems. But since you're not planning on making money, but are just planning on having a hobby, you don't have to worry about it. If it gets too expensive you can stop. It's so fascinating, though. The bees are really something. And you'll have lots of stories to tell the non-bee keepers. cheers, Anne B. (delurking) Article 49585 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: Is anyone selling beeswax in the UK? Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 20:36:27 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <98lfd5$8dp$1@soap.pipex.net> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 19 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49585 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1389 I am based in Worthing, West Sussex and may be able to supply. Where are you and how much do you require? Steven Newport On Tue, 13 Mar 2001 15:46:43 -0000, "Winnie" wrote: >Hi there. I don't suppose any of you are selling beeswax, or know of a >supplier, do you please? I'm looking for several pounds with which to treat >all the wood in our 17thC timber house.Finding pure wax in any but the >tiniest bars is quite hard, so any hints welcome! > >Thanks for your time > >Winnie (winny AT dial DOT pipex DOT com) >xx > Article 49586 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!peernews!peer.cwci.net!news2-hme0!not-for-mail From: "Peter Edwards" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <2m6o6.2$FQ3.702@monger.newsread.com> <97rg2l01tnj@drn.newsguy.com> <51eq6.19595$Cq.472137@news2-hme0> <31qnat0l6fgni0s9orb0tiiicocd7d7d4q@4ax.com> Subject: Re: A question on building my own bodies... Lines: 18 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Message-ID: <8KQr6.22372$Cq.574467@news2-hme0> Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 00:09:53 -0000 NNTP-Posting-Host: 212.137.182.188 X-Complaints-To: newsmaster@ic24.net X-Trace: news2-hme0 984602628 212.137.182.188 (Wed, 14 Mar 2001 20:43:48 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 20:43:48 GMT Organization: www.ic24.net Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49586 Try David Cotterill - 01926 651668 "Steven Newport" wrote in message news:jnnqat4tnp0rrupo2i6h7q1k24re5ojs6o@4ax.com... > Who ??? Where do you buy from? > Steele & Brodie are/were? there only other UK primary supplier. Who > else is making hives? > Its not that I don't believe you, honestly, I would just be very > interested to see about buying them. > > On Sun, 11 Mar 2001 22:38:06 -0000, "Peter Edwards" > wrote: > > >Thorne is not the only manufacturer of hives and just as well - I have just > >received their latest price list quoting £222.30 for a complete National > >hive - or £237.56 for a Langstroth! Article 49587 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!howland.erols.net!portc.blue.aol.com.MISMATCH!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 16 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: beecrofter@aol.com (BeeCrofter) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 14 Mar 2001 21:13:01 GMT References: Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Message-ID: <20010314161301.02698.00001387@ng-cl1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49587 If you win the lotto you can farm or keep bees as a business to your hearts content. If you keep bees for a hobby you will come closer to nature and never see a flower in quite the same way again. You will also meet an amazing number of people who remember their uncle or grandfather had a few hives out back somewhere. The first year most beginners are dressed like a nuclear accident. After they relax it gets much more casual. Have fun. Ask questions believe little. Article 49588 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!news.demon.co.uk!demon!kilty.demon.co.uk!honeymountain From: James Kilty Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping Subject: Re: Is anyone selling beeswax in the UK? Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2001 22:34:17 +0000 Message-ID: <2vqoDVApBqr6EwNp@kilty.demon.co.uk> References: <98lfd5$8dp$1@soap.pipex.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk X-NNTP-Posting-Host: kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Trace: news.demon.co.uk 984608678 nnrp-14:17446 NO-IDENT kilty.demon.co.uk:193.237.253.225 X-Complaints-To: abuse@demon.net MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Newsreader: Turnpike Integrated Version 4.02 S Lines: 13 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49588 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1390 In article <98lfd5$8dp$1@soap.pipex.net>, Winnie writes >Hi there. I don't suppose any of you are selling beeswax, or know of a >supplier, do you please? I'm looking for several pounds with which to treat >all the wood in our 17thC timber house.Finding pure wax in any but the >tiniest bars is quite hard, so any hints welcome! Thorne's at http://www.thorne.co.uk or mailto:sales@thorne.co.uk. They might tell you of a local supplier who sells wax from them or from local beekeepers. A slightly longer route might be to find out your local beekeepers association (library?) and make contact. Where do you live - I am sure we can find the address for you? -- James Kilty Article 49589 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newshub.sdsu.edu!ragnarok.cts.com!galanthis.cts.com!127.0.0.1.MISMATCH!not-for-mail From: "Dave" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2001 20:46:26 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Lines: 14 Message-ID: <3ab04939$0$39878$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.216.255.92 X-Trace: 984631609 nntp.cts.com 39878 dkern/204.216.255.92 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49589 A few months back I asked how to get rid of two yellow jacket hives I found in the ground around my property. Most said pour gas on it or let them live. Well, a few weeks ago I began to see some new skunks in the neighborhood. Shortly after that I found both + one hive I didn't see before dug up. The comb was spread out all over the ground. Some animal, I think the skunk, had mercy on me and fixed my problem. They did an excellent job of getting rid of all of them and digging the hole clean. One was at least 2 feet deep. Dave Article 49590 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!news.tele.dk!130.133.1.3!fu-berlin.de!uni-berlin.de!pool1-4.internode.NET!not-for-mail From: "Allen Dick" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Quality of Honey Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 01:49:34 -0700 Lines: 137 Message-ID: <98q06s$32vpq$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> References: <988cdj$ouas$1@ID-58605.news.dfncis.de> <98n0l3011co@drn.newsguy.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: pool1-4.internode.net (198.161.229.180) X-Trace: fu-berlin.de 984646686 3243834 198.161.229.180 (16 [58605]) X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49590 "James Fischer" wrote in message news:98n0l3011co@drn.newsguy.com... > Allen Dick said: > >Unfortunately, because most of the honey offered to the public > >is either mass processed or from small operators who very often > >misunderstand and mishandle honey, > > You clearly explained how large operators mangle honey, but > how exactly do small operators mishandle honey? What are the > most common errors in your view? I'd love to start making a > list of the worst errors and the solutions Well, I doubt that I can do the matter justice because there are so many pitfalls, and some are subtle, but it starts right at the hive. I can see you want to make me work... How is the hive built, and what glues, paints, preservatives, etc. are used? Where is the hive located? Is the area subject to serious pollution or vandalism? Do neighbours vandalise or spray the hive with insecticide? What then? What chemicals are used on the hive and when? 'Natural' substances are chemicals. Where are the hive parts stored when not in use? What fumes or liquids may contact the parts? What animals and insects might be in contact with the hive? What is fed to the hive? When? Can it get into the honey? If so, is it approved? Is it dangerous or...? How are diseases and pests controlled? Chemicals, radiation, fumigation? How is the honey removed and how is it handled and transported? Fumes? Dust? Dirt? Chemicals? How is it stored until extraction? What kind of extraction and uncapping devices are used? Materials? Cleanliness? What kind of room is being used for the job? Outdoors? How is the equipment and environment cleaned? Chemicals? Are the people healthy, clean and properly dressed? Hair nets or hats? Are they trained and "food conscious'? Is all honey from a known source or bought from another beekeeper? Are premises inspected? Questions answered? Can anything fall into a super or tank? Are things stored or placed above the honey at any point? Breast pockets? Are there flies or bees, vermin, dust, fumes, etc. in the packing room? Are lights protected against breakage? Ceiling beams -- if any -- clean? Are cleaning materials or pesticides etc. in the honey room? Is the water used in the honey handling area certified potable for public purposes? Is the honey dry enough to not ferment? Spills: What happened? What happens to the spilled honey? Bottling and storage tanks: Materials? History? Cleaning materials? Heating/warming method? What is it strained through and how fine? Material? Heat? What containers are used? New? Used? Washed? With what? When? Container materials? Previous contents? Labelling? Truthful? Lawful? Durable? Washable? Attractive? Labelling inks? Smelly? Lids stamped, then stacked? Transfer of smell? Filled containers stored where? Chemicals? Smells? Exterior contamination of jars, pails, etc. Store shelf: In sunlight? Containers sticky due to leaks? Old stock with unsightly partial granulation? Tamper-proof seal? Supervision of unsold product? Stale product: Melted? How? How often? Broken and damaged product: salvaged? How? These are just a few of the obvious points and I trust Murray or someone else will add some more. As you can see, there are zillion ways the uninitiated and untrained can go astray. > >the public has turned slowly away from our product and we > >are losing ground in the marketplace. > > Turned away? What with Honey cough-drops, Honey-Nut Breakfast > Cereals, Honey-Flu medicines, and so on, it appears that > "Honey" has a great reputation as a high-end sweetener. Our _word_ sweetens the bottom line of many companies, but our _product_ is not the primary sweetener in most of the products carrying the word "honey". People love our word and call their spouses, children and other loved ones 'honey', bit they do not buy our product in any significant quantity, especially compared to all other sweeteners. > It appears that the robber-baron multinationals have done > enough focus-group studies to conclude that one can sell > more of ANYTHING if one simply puts the word "Honey" in > front of it. This proves that honey is clearly a > "value-added feature" to them. If only they would show as much enthusiasm and commitment to putting significant amounts of real honey into the product. > The trick now seems to be to start marketing honey from > specific floral sources and/or areas, and take a page from > the wine industry's play-book. Sadly, this forces the big > operators who blend honey, micro-filter, and pasteurize into > the position of selling "cheap beer" as compared to the smaller > producers' "vintage wines", but there would be nothing stopping > a large producer from marketing non-blended, not-so-filtered, > unpasteurized honey. All the advertising in the world can only get the buyer to try a product once. When they give you that one try, it's Showtime -- make it or break it. One bad -- or even poor -- experience can turn people away for a lifetime and also even affect their friends and children's habits. Sadly, much of the honey sold does not convince the buyer that this is something to buy again, particularly in preference to cheaper standardised and predictable substitute items. > I think that all must admit that many people prefer > extracted honey to in-the-comb honey, as there are a > growing number who like "creamed" honey. While a true > connoisseur like yourself may consider them "inferior", it > might be more accurate to call them "different products". I doubt that I am a true connoisseur, but one of the things that has put people off comb honey is its perishable nature. Most people do not like hard granulated or coarse granulated honey and often comb becomes unattractive to eat long before it becomes unattractive to the eye. Consequently hard comb honey is sold once and the customer forever after avoids it. Comb really should be a freezer item. As for creamed honey, it is okay. Most of the honey turned out by the packing plants is okay. I eat it. I am talking about getting past "okay" to "great". > I may be wrong, but > my impression has been that only real honey will > crystallize. This might be an elegant way to avoid lots > of expensive tests and complicated finger-pointing. HFCS granulates nicer than any honey and quickly too. allen Article 49591 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!saltmine.radix.net!not-for-mail From: adamf@saltmine.radix.net (Adam Finkelstein) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Internet Apiculture and Beekeeping Archive/Metalab/Ibiblio Date: 15 Mar 2001 06:02:54 -0500 Organization: Self-Organized. Dig that. Lines: 18 Message-ID: <98q7gu$6k8$1@saltmine.radix.net> Reply-To: adamf@radix.net NNTP-Posting-Host: saltmine.radix.net Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49591 Hi. The site: http://metalab.unc.edu/bees http://www.ibiblio.org/bees is not quite right: they've migrated some of the machines from Solaris to Linux (Red Hat 7.0). I'll post back when things (like searching) are working properly. Pardon this inconvenience. Sincerely, Adam -- Adam Finkelstein adamf@radix.net http://www.ibiblio.org/bees/adamf Article 49592 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!colt.net!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Last introduction I hope :-) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 12:28:24 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 72 Message-ID: <98q8j7$kjp$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip86.mrgnxr1.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984655271 21113 195.249.242.86 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49592 Dear fellows beekeepers. Unregistered expanded to ten hives. Here is a short list of new things in the software and also a fixed bug list. 1) Added auto creating of hives with auto creating queen numbers. 2) Added multi selection of hives (groups) for easy maintaining of some tasks: i. Disease entries ii. Bulk adding of some data (mainly addresses) iii. Deleting of hives iv. Moving hives 3) Added the possibility to dial up persons from within the software (must have a modem allowing this). 4) Added the possibility to colour mark hives. 5) Added the possibility to group hives. 6) Added the possibility to repair the database within software (not all errors can be repaired) 7) Added the possibility to backup the database 8) Expanded the help file to cover nearly everything in software. (manual 9) Added barcode support 10) Nearly all text in software is placed in language file for easy altering. (Be careful if) Following is a bug list fixed: 1) Some fields on queen breeder queen entry screen lost connection to database (fixed) 2) After converting database to new format an error occurred with list out of bounds (fixed by making an exit from software when database is converted.) 3) An important database was not created (fixed). 4) My software got an error related to windows caking (fixed) Data is now explicit saved to HD) 5) Cleaned up some code having coursed problems. More to fix: Unregistered software can show an error when entering Quick entry screen. To remove this error just click on 'ALL BEEHIVES' in yard list window and this is gone 'for ever'; More to come For registered big software there will be included a full working accounting part to Bidata. Your suggestions if you have any. Please come forward J I still hope to be able to continue this software. You are the reason. Best regards Jĝrn Johanesson -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 49593 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp3.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AB0B21C.57DBCD3E@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! References: <3ab04939$0$39878$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 14 Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:14:21 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.133 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp3.onemain.com 984658183 206.231.24.133 (Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:09:43 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:09:43 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49593 I believe yellow jacket nests don't live through the winter anyway. Only the bred females survive to start a new colony in the spring. These new queens and their nests will be back soon enough. Dave wrote: > Some animal, I think the skunk, had mercy on me and fixed my problem. They > did an excellent job of getting rid of all of them and digging the hole > clean. One was at least 2 feet deep. > > Dave Article 49594 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newshub.sdsu.edu!ragnarok.cts.com!galanthis.cts.com!127.0.0.1.MISMATCH!not-for-mail From: "Dave" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping References: <3ab04939$0$39878$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> <3AB0B21C.57DBCD3E@together.net> Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:45:06 -0800 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4522.1200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4522.1200 Lines: 27 Message-ID: <3ab0e399$0$39877$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: 204.216.255.92 X-Trace: 984671129 nntp.cts.com 39877 dkern/204.216.255.92 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49594 Actually, I live in San Diego, California. The yellow jackets were very active up until that point. I still see several hovering around my hives today. Dave "michael palmer" wrote in message news:3AB0B21C.57DBCD3E@together.net... > I believe yellow jacket nests don't live through the winter anyway. Only the > bred females survive to start a new colony in the spring. These new queens and > their nests will be back soon enough. > > Dave wrote: > > > Some animal, I think the skunk, had mercy on me and fixed my problem. They > > did an excellent job of getting rid of all of them and digging the hole > > clean. One was at least 2 feet deep. > > > > Dave > > > Article 49595 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp1.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AB0E6AD.3965317A@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! References: <3ab04939$0$39878$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> <3AB0B21C.57DBCD3E@together.net> <3ab0e399$0$39877$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 32 Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:58:37 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.35 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp1.onemain.com 984671696 206.231.24.35 (Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:54:56 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 10:54:56 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49595 Hmm... Do wasps behave differently in warm climates? Dave wrote: > Actually, I live in San Diego, California. The yellow jackets were very > active up until that point. I still see several hovering around my hives > today. > > Dave > > "michael palmer" wrote in message > news:3AB0B21C.57DBCD3E@together.net... > > I believe yellow jacket nests don't live through the winter anyway. Only > the > > bred females survive to start a new colony in the spring. These new queens > and > > their nests will be back soon enough. > > > > Dave wrote: > > > > > Some animal, I think the skunk, had mercy on me and fixed my problem. > They > > > did an excellent job of getting rid of all of them and digging the hole > > > clean. One was at least 2 feet deep. > > > > > > Dave > > > > > > Article 49596 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!sn-uk-post-01!supernews.com!xo.supernews.co.uk!not-for-mail From: Steven Newport Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 21:35:01 +0000 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: <20010314161301.02698.00001387@ng-cl1.aol.com> X-Newsreader: Forte Agent 1.8/32.548 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Complaints-To: abuse@xo.supernews.co.uk Lines: 27 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49596 You aren't kidding. I have been doing craft shows in the UK selling honey and I had the good fortune to meet an elderly lady that used to keep bees. Over the past couple of years we have talked a lot and she has told me many stories about her father that was the local Councils official beekeeper (he ran the apiary site for the council) during the war.) When I attend the local bee keeper meetings I am very aware that there is a significant age gap in the people attending. I sell (this is not an advert) a honey with added bees venom for arthritis (honest I don't want to get involved in a conversation on this point). One day, whilst doing one of these shows, an elderly gentleman came up to the stand and we talked for ages. He recounted his time as a teacher on a South Pacific Island where he lived amongst cannibals. When on a hunting trip (for animals not humans) they would locate a bee's nest and grab a handful of bees and 'wipe' them up their arms. The stings giving them increased suppleness in their joints to throw spears. Priceless stories! Very worth recounting. >You will also meet an amazing number of people who remember their uncle or >grandfather had a few hives out back somewhere. Article 49597 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Rodney Isom" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: European hornet problem Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 19:37:22 -0600 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: "Rodney Isom" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 15 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49597 What's the best way to deal with European hornets (big yellow hornets, we got 'em in the south) harassing my hives? They're not a problem now, but later in the summer, they kill & eat a lot of bees. Anything I can do about them? Thanks, Rodney -- Rodney Isom Arab, AL (North AL) rodneyi@nooospam.hiwaay.net (remove obvious part to reply) Article 49598 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "David Eyre" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: European hornet problem Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2001 22:11:20 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: References: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 27 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49598 Yes. Trap them out. Use a jar with two holes in the lid, about the size of a pencil. Place some jam or 'jelly' plus water with a few drops of liquid detergent to about 1/2 full. The wasps go after the sticky, get into the jar, can't get out and end up drowning. If you start them early enough you can keep the nest under control to even wipe them out. You're removing the foragers! I place two or three around each yard, change and recharge when necessary. Eventually the problem becomes manageable. Regards Dave....-- ******************************************** The Bee Works, 5 Edith Drive, R R # 2, Orillia, ON. Canada. L3V 6H2 705 326 7171 http://www.beeworks.com *************************************** > What's the best way to deal with European hornets (big yellow hornets, we > got 'em in the south) harassing my hives? They're not a problem now, but > later in the summer, they kill & eat a lot of bees. Anything I can do about > them? Article 49599 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.mathworks.com!portc03.blue.aol.com!audrey05.news.aol.com!not-for-mail Lines: 15 X-Admin: news@aol.com From: pollinator@aol.comnospam (Dave Green) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Date: 16 Mar 2001 03:11:47 GMT References: <3AB0E6AD.3965317A@together.net> Organization: AOL http://www.aol.com Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! Message-ID: <20010315221147.00571.00001499@ng-cd1.aol.com> Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49599 From: michael palmer mpalmer@together.net >Hmm... Do wasps behave differently in warm climates? Some do survive the winter in central and south Florida, so I presume they would in San Diego. They don't make it thru winter here in South Carolina. Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 49600 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!newsfeed00.sul.t-online.de!t-online.de!news.tele.dk!Tele.Dk.POSTED!not-for-mail From: "Jorn Johanesson" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Get the updates Plase! Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 10:25:11 +0100 Organization: Posted Courtesy of Tele Danmark or one of its European Subsidiaries Lines: 19 Message-ID: <98slmr$c5s$1@news.inet.tele.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: ip21.mrgnxr2.ras.tele.dk X-Trace: news.inet.tele.dk 984734235 12476 195.215.97.21 X-Complaints-To: the appropriate department of the poster's provider X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49600 I know some are interested! Please get the update that removes the errors. -- Best regards Jorn Johanesson Multilingual software for beekeeping since 1997 hive note- queen breeding and handheld computer beekeeping software 18-01-2001 added grouping and colouring of hives + a lot more. all you need and a little more. being a little beekeeper or a big queen breeder free of charge up to 10 hives. home page = HTTP://apimo.dk e-mail Jorn_Johanesson@apimo.dk Article 49601 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!feed2.onemain.com!feed1.onemain.com!nntp3.onemain.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3AB1FABB.CF571997@together.net> From: michael palmer Reply-To: mpalmer@together.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en]C-DIAL (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! References: <3AB0E6AD.3965317A@together.net> <20010315221147.00571.00001499@ng-cd1.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Lines: 19 Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 06:36:27 -0500 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.231.24.128 X-Complaints-To: abuse@onemain.com X-Trace: nntp3.onemain.com 984742306 206.231.24.128 (Fri, 16 Mar 2001 06:31:46 EST) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 06:31:46 EST Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49601 So, are they perenial where they are able to survive the winter, or do they eventually die out? Dave Green wrote: > From: michael palmer mpalmer@together.net > > >Hmm... Do wasps behave differently in warm climates? > > Some do survive the winter in central and south Florida, so I presume they > would in San Diego. They don't make it thru winter here in South Carolina. > > Pollinator@aol.com Dave Green Hemingway, SC USA > The Pollination Home Page: http://pollinator.com > Disclaimer: Opinions aren't facts; learn the art of discrimination. Opinions > presented for your use and amusement; use at your own risk. Article 49602 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!newsfeed.stanford.edu!paloalto-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!webtv.net!not-for-mail From: BEE143@webtv.net Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 05:21:12 -0600 (CST) Organization: WebTV Subscriber Lines: 10 Message-ID: <19155-3AB1F728-4@storefull-164.iap.bryant.webtv.net> References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> NNTP-Posting-Host: localhost.webtv.net Mime-Version: 1.0 (WebTV) Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit X-WebTV-Signature: 1 ETAtAhQr/WM7OqMDQhR2ePPXsK6S2vnwPQIVAJuhKC+2PXrrxrt10a3bnuKxfkPY Content-Disposition: Inline Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49602 go for it but boil all used boxes before using ROD PS I started with one hive and now have 8 hives and love it !!!! // =8{})))- // Article 49603 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: Yellowjacket problem is fixed - by Nature!! Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 14:28:51 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 14 Message-ID: <3ab222bb.65004593@news1.radix.net> References: <3ab04939$0$39878$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> <3AB0B21C.57DBCD3E@together.net> <3ab0e399$0$39877$e2e8da3@nntp.cts.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: p8.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49603 On Thu, 15 Mar 2001 07:45:06 -0800, "Dave" wrote: >Actually, I live in San Diego, California. The yellow jackets were very >active up until that point. I still see several hovering around my hives >today. > >Dave > If you had followed my advice you would have had a lot of fun. It could have been good father son bonding as well. beekeep Article 49604 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!skynet.be!isdnet!wanadoo.fr!not-for-mail From: "Jean François LONGY" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Apitherapy ressources / Beekeeping Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 18:46:46 +0100 Organization: Wanadoo, l'internet avec France Telecom Lines: 17 Message-ID: <98tjd7$s1p$1@wanadoo.fr> NNTP-Posting-Host: alyon-102-1-1-36.abo.wanadoo.fr X-Trace: wanadoo.fr 984764647 28729 193.251.26.36 (16 Mar 2001 17:44:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: abuse@wanadoo.fr NNTP-Posting-Date: 16 Mar 2001 17:44:07 GMT X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49604 Hi, www.beehoo.com create a specific page dedicated to apitherapy => http://apitherapy.beehoo.com A specific webring called " apitherapy ressources" is open for webmasters at the same adress. Best Regards. -- Jean François LONGY www.beehoo.com The beekeeping directory Article 49605 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.icl.net!diablo.netcom.net.uk!netcom.net.uk!easynet-monga!easynet-melon!easynet.net!btnet-feed5!btnet!mendelevium.btinternet.com!not-for-mail From: "Peter W Hawkey" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Rape Honey Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 22:21:47 -0000 Organization: BT Internet Lines: 7 Message-ID: <98u40p$a7s$1@neptunium.btinternet.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: host213-122-41-30.btinternet.com X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2615.200 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2615.200 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49605 Last year I was surrounded by rape fields and the honey crop (about 40 pounds from a couple of hives) has set like concrete. I dont want to have to heat up a jar of honey every time I want some so has anyone any ideas how to permanently soften it up, or is it all destined for mead (not an entirely bad idea!). Article 49606 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!dispose.news.demon.net!demon!grolier!btnet-peer0!btnet-feed5!btnet!newreader.ukcore.bt.net!news.cali.co.uk!212.1.136.115 From: "Ann - Scotland" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping,alt.hobbies.beekeeping References: <98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net> Subject: Re: New wanna"bee" beekeeper... Lines: 214 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 Message-ID: <3ab2a2aa.0@news.cali.co.uk> Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 23:33:03 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 62.172.47.10 X-Trace: newreader.ukcore.bt.net 984785583 62.172.47.10 (Fri, 16 Mar 2001 23:33:03 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 23:33:03 GMT Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49606 alt.hobbies.beekeeping:1391 All I can say is - Good Luck! it'll probably cost you, but if you enjoy it like I do then go for it. Ann - Scotland "Don Bruder" wrote in message news:98j0m3$87h$1@nnrp2.phx.gblx.net... > > Greetings from northern California... > > For the last several years, I've been kicking around the idea of getting > into small-scale beekeeping. When I say small-scale, I mean *REALLY* > small - 2, maybe 3 hives max. Nothing that even remotely resembles > commercial level stuff. I don't much care about turning a profit, I just > want a hobby-type setup that might turn out some honey for the biscuits. > > Recently, I've come into contact with a fellow who used to be into the > game in a big way - We're talking several hundred (thousand?) hives that > he used to shuttle around the area orchards for profit. From the way he > tells the tale, mites hit him hard about 5-6 years back, and between > that and his age, he decided it was time to bail out of the biz. As a > result, he's got literally hundreds of abandoned hives, supers, frames, > etc. piled in one corner of his alfalfa field, some in various states of > rotting away, others in near-new condition, several buzzing merrily away > with swarms he says he hasn't done anything with other than look at as > he drove past on the tractor for the past 2-3 years, but most dead and > silent. Since I've got an interest (and not much of a budget) I asked > him about 'em. I got the whole story of him bailing out, and to make a > long story short, I'm welcome to however many of 'em I feel like carting > away, including, if I feel brave enough, the ones that are buzzing, so > long as I leave one "live one" for him to maybe tinker with if he gets > the urge to do so. > > So yesterday, after putting a load of hay on the pickup, I stopped on > the way out, he helped me do some picking and choosing, and I loaded up > the makings for a 10-frame hive in the cab - bottom box (an 8-ish inch > high super with bottom board/landing platform nailed on) a second 8-ish > inch super, 20 frames, 15 with plastic foundation, 5 with bare wires for > wax foundation, and a lid that's rigged for a 2-liter bottle feeder. > Plus, of course, I can go back and get whatever else I think I might > need next time I go get a load of hay from him. > > "Great," sez I... "I've got me a Bee-starter-kit. Just add bees, > sugar-water, and brain-power." > > So the first thing I do after getting home and unloading the hay is get > on the phone to a local apiary looking for how much it's gonna cost me > to install a batch of buzzers in my nifty new box. > > This is where I got "stung", you might say... > > Joe Beekeeper (not his real name, obviously) did everything he could, up > to and including flat-out telling me that I was friggin' NUTS, to > persuade me that I didn't want anything to do with the game, that all I > was gonna get out of it was a box of dead bees and disappointment, I was > gonna spend money from here to tuesday and not see anything come of it, > and just basically "YOU DON'T WANNA DO THIS, but if you insist, I'll > cheerfully take your money, supply you with bees I know are going to > die, and then tell you "I told ya so" when you decide you've had enough > frustration and offer to sell me your hives, which I won't give you > anything for because I've already got so many I can't use 'em all for my > own operation." > > A seriously "rosy" picture... > > A frat-hazing to the tune of "You maggot!" might have been a tad easier > to swallow, but I'm not one to take "no" for an answer, and slowly, as I > kept insisting that I was going into the game with eyes open, no > delusions about swimming around in a lake of honey and/or money, was > willing to bust my hump (after all, I know about hobbies where your > money literally turns to shit - I'm a horseman) for little or no return > other than the enjoyment of doing it, and so on, he finally started to > "lighten up" a bit and actually dispense some information. > > In the end, we reached an agreement: On Thursday night, I'm going over > to his place to set his computer up for internet access, show him the > basics of going online, and get him hooked up. In exchange, I'm gonna > get a queen and some bees, some basic tools, and as much bee-education > as I can soak up. Barter in action at it's finest! :) Now to get the > hive I have cleaned up and ready for new inhabitants... > > Now, the point of this whole ramble: > Is the "NO YOU CRAZY FOOL!!! DON'T DO IT!!!" speech fairly typical (this > is about the third time I've gotten it over the last 3-4 years and 4-5 > inquiries to various beekeepers in three states) or have I just stumbled > onto folks who are sour on the whole biz? I mean, are we talking a > "boot-camp" style hazing that every rookie gets to try to gauge their > "serious level" and weed out the ones that think they're gonna turn a > quick buck without effort, or has beekeeping really become as difficult > as the folks I've been talking to seem to imply? George (the fellow I'm > getting my boxes from) tells me he was pretty much wiped out by mites, > but the "wave" seems to have passed, since he's had several of his > abandoned hives "come to life" and survive for 2-3 years with no > intervention. As evidence, I can only offer his claim and the 4 hives > (that I could tell... there may have been more) that are buzzing right > now out there in his "junkpile" - If those weren't healthy, happy, > fully-functional bees that were so thick they were bouncing off me as > they came and went, then I'm a TOTAL idiot. The one that sat on (nope, > she didn't sting - why would she?) my finger long enough for me to get a > good look at sure didn't appear to have any problem other than slighly > ratty wings - Not real surprising, since she's probably been mondo-busy > wth the almond orchard that's in blossom on the other side of the > alfalfa field. > > Finally, what, if any, information would you guys (and/or gals) here on > the newsgroups offer a new-but-not-dumb person trying to get a hive > started? I've already got a book (If memory serves me rightly, the title > is "Practical Beekeeping" - I can't remember author right now. I do > recall seeing a picture of it on one of the web pages I hit last night > while surfing for bee-info, and noticing that it was listed as one of > the highly recommended references) and I've done a fair bit of research > over the years since I first considered the idea, so I'm not going in > TOTALLY blind. I either already have, can easily get, or can make much > of the hardware needed. About the only thing I'm missing right now > (aside from knowledge and experience) is the trendy white coveralls, the > veil, and the bees. > > So, what say you folks... Am I out of my mind, or do I stand a chance? > We're talking about a backyard hive or three, with hopes of maybe > getting some comb-honey out of the deal, but no delusions about turning > a profit in any way, shape, or form. Am I really lining up for a chance > to beat my head against a concrete wall, as the folks I've talked to > seem to imply, or is their "don't do it" speech just intended to "weed > out the whiners, weaklings, and get-rich-quick types"? > > Hoping to hear some useful information, since I've already had the "you > don' wanna do dat" speech... > > -- > Don Bruder - Dakidd@primenet.com <--- Preferred Email - unmunged > I will choose a path that's clear: I will choose Free Will! - N. Peart Article 49607 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Mr. Dixon" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: weak hive Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 19:32:57 -0500 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Newsreader: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.50.4133.2400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 X-Complaints-To: newsabuse@supernews.com Lines: 13 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49607 I have a weak hive that's about to die. I opened it up today and there is probably 2K or less bees in there. It has 2 brood boxes. I don't know what happened to it. The top box has plenty of honey in it. The bottom box has some honey and the bees. Both boxes have a bad wax moth infestation. I opened the box a month ago and did not detect any moths. I guess I'm just going to remove the lid and let the cold night temps kill the remaining bees. I have another hive about 30 feet from this one. Will it hurt the good hive if it's bees rob the honey from the dying hive? Should I destroy the wooden frames and buy new ones? How can I keep the moths out of the good hive? thanks Article 49608 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!not-for-mail From: honeybs@radix.net (beekeep) Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: weak hive Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2001 00:54:37 GMT Organization: RadixNet Internet Services Lines: 27 Message-ID: <3ab2b4b7.102376550@news1.radix.net> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: p40.a1.du.radix.net X-Newsreader: Forte Free Agent 1.21/32.243 Xref: news1.radix.net sci.agriculture.beekeeping:49608 On Fri, 16 Mar 2001 19:32:57 -0500, "Mr. Dixon" wrote: >I have a weak hive that's about to die. I opened it up today and there is >probably 2K or less bees in there. It has 2 brood boxes. I don't know what >happened to it. The top box has plenty of honey in it. The bottom box has >some honey and the bees. Both boxes have a bad wax moth infestation. I >opened the box a month ago and did not detect any moths. I guess I'm just >going to remove the lid and let the cold night temps kill the remaining >bees. I have another hive about 30 feet from this one. Will it hurt the >good hive if it's bees rob the honey from the dying hive? Should I destroy >the wooden frames and buy new ones? How can I keep the moths out of the >good hive? >thanks > > If the other hive is good and strong and you don't have any major disease in the dying hive, just put the boxes on top of the good hive bees and all. They will combine, kill that weak queen if she is there at all, and clean out the wax moths. Wax moths don't kill bees, beekeepers do. Then in a months time you can split the hive back and have two again. Just make sure the queen goes to the new hive stand. beekeep Article 49609 of sci.agriculture.beekeeping: Path: news1.radix.net!newspeer.radix.net!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!newsfeed.stanford.edu!sn-xit-01!sn-post-01!supernews.com!corp.supernews.com!not-for-mail From: "Rodney Isom" Newsgroups: sci.agriculture.beekeeping Subject: Re: European hornet problem Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 19:47:40 -0600 Organization: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com Message-ID: Reply-To: "Rodney Isom" References: X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Ne