Subject: Re: vanilla / warfarin

From: [email-masked] (Shankar Bhattacharyya)
Date: 6 Sep 1996 21:10:11 -0400

In article <[email-masked]>, Jim Mau  <[email-masked]> wrote:

>I acquired, on a recent visit to Tijuana, a bottle of vanilla.  Looking 
>over other bottles of vanilla in another shop 'down the street', I 
>noticed on the label of another brand, wording to the effect of:  this 
>product is free of coumarin.  Being a med type, this caught my eye!  
>Does anyone working in food sci. know of a relationship of vanilla w/ 
>coumarin?  To my knowledge, coumarin is extracted from tonka beans 
>(genus Dipteryx) and vanilla from vanilla beans (genus Vanilla).  Can 
>anyone in food sci. enlighten me on this seemingly strange labeling 
>relationship, please?

Warfarin, sold as an anticlotting agent for people at serious risk of
heart failure, is sold under the trade name "Coumadin". Lots of people
who remember that vaguely decide that coumarin is the same thing.

Coumadin, by the way, is a coumarin derivative but it is not the same
thing.

Coumarin has been used in perfumery for a long time. The Merck index
lists some review articles and such. I have no opinion on the toxicity
of coumarin, except that I am persuaded that it isn't anything like as
toxic as warfarin. Don't take that as a recommendation that you should
ingest coumarin, though.

I have heard it alleged that a lot of Mexican vanilla is actually an
extract of the tonka bean, which would make it basically a solution of
coumarin. The "No coumarin" label thus makes a claim of authenticity.

I have also read disputes as to how much of Mexican "vanilla" is in
fact made from Tonka beans. I have no opinion on that, either way.

- Shankar

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From: Jim Mau <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 06 Sep 1996 12:06:45 -0700

dear food sci. guys

	jimmau

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From: [email-masked] (Jay Mann)
Date: 8 Sep 1996 21:04:11 GMT

Jim Mau ([email-masked]) wrote:
: I acquired, on a recent visit to Tijuana, a bottle of vanilla.  Looking 
: over other bottles of vanilla in another shop 'down the street', I 
: noticed on the label of another brand, wording to the effect of:  this 
: product is free of coumarin.  Being a med type, this caught my eye!  
: Does anyone working in food sci. know of a relationship of vanilla w/ 
: coumarin?  To my knowledge, coumarin is extracted from tonka beans 
: (genus Dipteryx) and vanilla from vanilla beans (genus Vanilla).  Can 
: anyone in food sci. enlighten me on this seemingly strange labeling 
: relationship, please?

I think that coumarin is the main flavour component of fenugreek seeds, 
which are used in Indian cooking.

Jay D Mann  <[email-masked]>
Christchurch, New Zealand

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From: [email-masked] (Pierre Jelenc)
Date: 9 Sep 1996 10:36:31 -0400

> anyone in food sci. enlighten me on this seemingly strange labeling 

Coumarin is the principal ingredient of Woodruff (Asperula odorata),
widely used in Europe to make May Wine and for the green syrup that is
added to the sour "Berliner Weisse" beer. 

It has a sweet, pleasantly flowery aroma.

Pierre
-- 
Pierre Jelenc              Know what's weird? Day by day nothing seems to
[email-masked]             change, but pretty soon everything is different.
[email-masked]                                         Calvin & Hobbes 
                   http://www.columbia.edu/~pcj1/

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From: Richard Mateles <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 09 Sep 1996 11:03:24 -0500

J
> Christchurch, New Zealand

I think you are confusing coumarin with cumin!!
-- 
Candida Corporation
Suite A-1706
175 W. Jackson Blvd.
Chicago, IL. 60604
U.S.A.

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From: roger turner <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 07 Sep 1996 08:07:25 -0700

Jim Mau wrote:
>         jimmauDear jimmau,

Coumarin WAS used as a flavouring ingredient many years ago, it is no 
longer permitted for use in flavourings (at least in Australia). Coumarin 
has a synrgistic effect with Vanillin (the main active flavouring 
ingredient in Vanilla flavourings) increasing the strengh of the vanilla 
character, additionally coumarin "rounds out " the flavour.

I would guess that the label you saw was trying to give the impression 
that the product was more pure than competing products.

Regards,
Roger T.

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From: [email-masked] (Jay Mann)
Date: 14 Sep 1996 19:15:38 GMT

Richard Mateles ([email-masked]) wrote:
: > I think that coumarin is the main flavour component of fenugreek seeds,
: > which are used in Indian cooking.
: > 
: > Jay D Mann  <[email-masked]>
: 
: I think you are confusing coumarin with cumin!!

No, I wasn't.  Fenugreek and cumin are two distinct spices of Indian 
cooking.  But I can't find the fenugreek-coumarin reference just now.  In 
Tyler's book on medicinal plants, he says that the taste of fenugreek 
seed is "somewhat reminiscent of maple syrup", and is sometimes used in 
imitation maple syrup.  Interestingly, here in New Zealand where maple 
syrup wasn't always available, ex-patriate Yanks sometimes made 
artificial maple syrup by adding vanilla flavouring to sugar syrups.

Just as an aside, did you know that fenugreek (and alcohol) were the two 
princiapl ingredients in Lydia Pinkham's Vegetable Compound?