Subject: Re: Homesteading and society

From: "Matthew W. Hamel" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 15 Mar 1995 17:08:05 -0500 (EST)

On Wed, 15 Mar 1995, Karl Henning wrote:

>        One thing I want to be able to do on the land I'm on is build
>        whatever type of shelter I want and not have to worry about 
>        someone elses concept of aesthetics.  I wonder, if this idea
>        (homesteading) gets really popular will it go the way of herbalism, 
>        namely all kinds of gov. intervention into something they know nothing
>        about, thus once again limiting our freedom, what little we have,
>        in the name of "protecting us from ourselves".

Not to push this too far, but I think this is the role of zoning in my 
parts.  Our County Board of Health is citing the pants off a conservative 
Amish farmer due to his privy construction and greywater discharge.  At 
the hearing (and I was there) the stoolie from the Board hemmed and 
hawwed trying to cover up the fact that they did no soil analysis, no 
drainage survey, etc...  And this is *really* in the sticks.  The catch 
is that next door to this fellow is a retirement community surrounding an 
artificial lake populated by oldsters from Akron, Columbus and Cleveland 
(in Ohio) that didn't want "country living" (whatever that is these days) 
with the odor of spring fertilization wafting on the breeze.

The county has also made it difficult for those wanting composting 
toilets, grey water irrigation (even if you agree to not use 
phosphorus-based soaps) and I'm sure there's a hefty amount of red tape 
when a homeowner goes solar.  And I thought zoning was so the plummer 
could put his kids through college ;)

Matt Hamel
[email-masked]

In the Chevy Chevette of the Information Superhighway

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From: Andrew Evans <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 16 Mar 1995 14:36:27 -0500 (EST)

Jeff et al -

I'll see that and raise you one.  My thinking on the subject of local 
community has changed since I started getting into the spirit of 
homesteading - I realized that one of the saddest things about the corner 
of suburbia in which I currently live is that none of my neighbors feel 
compelled to introduce themselves to each other, let alone cooperate on 
anything.  The closest anyone on my street has come to communicating 
since we moved here was a lawsuit over the placement of a fence.

My parents, on the other hand, live in a rural community where their 
nearest neighbors are 1/4 mile away, yet there is a strong sense of 
community and a group of folks willing and able to help each other out at 
a moment's notice.

There was an interesting discussion about this on misc.rural a while 
back, where someone noted thatwhen they lived in the suburbs, their 
neighbors failed notice (or report?) break-ins or suspicious activity 
around each other's homes.  When they moved to the country, before they 
even moved, their neighbors 1/4 mile away checked up on their house when 
they got suspicious about a contractor driving up with a different color 
truck one day!

I think you *have* to nurture your ties with the local community in some 
way when homesteading - at the very least, you can build a local "labor 
economy" akin to the Amish practices of barn- and house-raising and 
taking in crops.  It is my humble opinion that the breakdown of community 
(and family) interdependence is the root cause of many of the social ills in 
American society.  Once people stop depending on each other, they begin to stop 
caring about each other.  At best they ignore each other, and at worst 
they sue and shoot each other.  When we left the land-based life and 
moved to the cities and suburbs, we left communities behind to a large 
extent (with a few notable exceptions, but not nearly enough).  I feel 
that just moving back to the land is not enough - we need to rebuild 
communities as well - in rural as well as non-rural settings (back to the 
idea of "homesteading" in the urban landscape).

On Thu, 16 Mar 1995, Jeff Owens wrote:

>   My natural tendency is to withdraw from society and try to
>   create a sane environment.  But, this isolationism will
>   produce lots of suspicions and make people nervous.  I
>   think the answer is some level of involvement in the local
>   community.  My wife does a little volunteer work and try to
>   maintain contact so people will know that we are tolerant
>   of others viewpoints.  This isn't a complete answer to the
>   homesteader vrs the government issue, but having an
>   understanding local government helps a little.  If we all
>   do it then we become part of big government and the our
>   influence is felt.  If we don't get involved then we become
>   outsiders who will be the local joke or blight.
> 
> Jeff (vote with your lifestyle)
> 

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From: [email-masked] (Jeff Owens)
Date: Thu, 16 Mar 1995 10:09:30 -0500

Karl henning wrote:
>        this might be an interesting thread.  Potential gov. intervention
>        into those uppidy folks who don't want to play the Society game.

Jeff Owens responds: