Subject: Re: Self sufficient

From: [email-masked]
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 18:38:16 -0500

I think what most of are doing is winnowing the grain from the chaff. There's
no one I know that's into homesteading/self-reliance that wants to dump ALL
of civilization. I like things like computers and antibiotics and msuic on
CD. On the other hand, I like the freedom to grow and eat what I like, and
KNOW what goes into it. So what I'm doing is living in a place where I can
take what I like of civilization, but not be forced to live with the downside
of it. 
   Larry

---

From: Andrew Evans <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 22 Feb 1995 22:12:13 -0500 (EST)

Larry -

There is a Luddite contingent of self-reliance folks who abhor or at 
least distrust modern technology -- there is a magazine that caters to 
these folks, and the editor published a plea that no one even mention his 
magazine on the Internet, root of all modern evil.  For this reason I'll 
only mention how silly and sad I think this attitude is rather than 
telling you the name of the magazine, to at least partially comply with 
his wishes.  This magazine is part of a noble attempt to answer the needs 
that we all are expressing here, to get back to the land and away from 
the rat-race.  I think these people take it a bit too far, and in the 
process they miss out on the incredible opportunity to reach kindred 
souls in far-flung parts (like what we have here).  Heck, even the 
Shakers were gung-ho about technological progress!  I don't think you 
have to abandon technology - just apply it appropriately.

> take what I like of civilization, but not be forced to live with the downside

+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
|  Andrew Evans                      | Compu$erve: 70711,745         |
|  Compass Point Software, Inc.      | Internet:   [email-masked]   |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+
|         Home Page: http://www.cais.com/aevans/homepage.html        |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------+

---

From: MICHAEL BRZEZOWSKI <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 08:54:40 -0500 (EST)

> take what I like of civilization, but not be forced to live with the downside
  Yes, the self-reliance issue is a continuim (SP?).  I, personally, am
ditching computers and music on CD because they require to much.  To have
your computer and Stereo you need electricity (dependence).  If you want
to connect to the "net" you also need a phone or T-1 connection.  These
are all things I want to do without.
  Is there anyone out there, living in cold regions (NH, ME, Canada, etc) that
is currently electric and gas free?  If so, could you contact me so that we
may chat...?
Thanks..Mike

---

From: MICHAEL BRZEZOWSKI <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 11:34:42 -0500 (EST)

Do you have the name and publisher of that magazine????

   I do not HATE technology, but I understand that most of it is sinking us
down further, rather than rising us above.  Think of everything that must be
done to keep you net connection.
   I am fairly new to this thinking.  I have been a hardcore computer geek
for some time, and now I am working away from it....it is hard though.

- Mike

---

From: Willie Sullivan <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 17:04:55 -0600 (CST)

> is currently electric and gas free?  If so, could you contact me so that we
Dependence on electricity, in many ways is no different than the 
dependence on wood (for heating, etc.). You need not depend on the 
electric company. You could generate you own from solar, hydro, wind, etc.

Electricity is a "natural" phenomenon. Consider lightening, nerve impulses,
static electricity, electric eels, etc.

I think the important thing is to use tools and not let tools use you.

---

From: [email-masked] (Dwayne)
Date: Fri, 24 Feb 1995 09:45:10 +1100 (EST)

I peeled a grape, and found that MICHAEL BRZEZOWSKI had written upon it:
: 
:   Yes, the self-reliance issue is a continuim (SP?).  I, personally, am
: ditching computers and music on CD because they require to much.  To have
: your computer and Stereo you need electricity (dependence).  

Micro-hydro power. PV solar cells, whihc rae heading towards being able to
compete with mains electricity.

: If you want
: to connect to the "net" you also need a phone or T-1 connection.  These
: are all things I want to do without.

Radio modems.

Dwayne.

              -------> [email-masked] <--------
*  http://www.latrobe.edu.au/nexus/Permaculture/permaculture.html  * 
             r e t u r n   t o   t h e   s o u r c e
NEXUS:.settling.the.electronic.frontier..     mail [email-masked]
http://www.latrobe.edu.au/nexus/HTML/          "subscribe nexus-gaia" 

<a href="http://www.latrobe.edu.au/nexus/HTML/dwayne.html">Dwayne</a>
      ...our.aim.is.wakefulness.our.enemy.is.dreamless.sleep...