Subject: Re: Mite Solution

From: [email-masked] (Andy Nachbaur)
Date: Sat, 29 Jun 1996 20:04:00 GMT

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FYI* Good tread from the BEE-List.
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DB>From: douglas baty<[email-masked]>
  >Date:         Fri, 28 Jun 1996 14:15:23 -0500
  >Subject:      Re: Mite Solution: Queen Locating: Smoker Fuel

DB>I used 'mite solution' for the first time last fall.  Prior to its use I
  >had lost 23 of my 30 hives to Varroa mite.  Although I had earlier used
  >Apistan, I did not want to continue using it.  I placed the mite solution
  >in with grease patties in the fall, again this spring.  A month ago I
  >checked for Varroa, both in drone brood and with Apistan with sticky
  >boards, and found NO Varroa.  I don't know why it works, but from my
  >experience, it does work, and the bees are once again healthy and busy in
  >our gardens.

Hello Douglas,

This is good information, "it does work". You will see some comments
>from  others that will fault you or try to lay some kind of guilt trip
on you for using a product that is in dispute with government regulators
or is not properly registered. Please do not take these comments for
anymore then what they are worth which is someone's educated or
regulatory opinion who has nothing to lose from your own personal loss
of your bees because you did not use an all natural product, other then
the time they spent in posting the standard regulatory disclaimer that
this is a NO NO..!  I think that most of us know what is legal and what
is not and I for one do not recommend anyone use anything that is not
legal, but do not fault anyone who does and appreciate the reports of
anyone's failure or success in doing something that I would not do
myself for what ever the personal or job reason I have for not doing so
myself.

Much of the history of beekeeping is full of home remedies that work
but can not be explained, and this includes almost all of the
scientific work on bee medicines in use today, like sulfa drugs, (not
used today) and TM which no one knows exactly even today how they work
or even if they are intended to treat individual bees, bee grubs of one
size or age, or the hive of bees as a whole. Sulfa is no longer legal to
use in much of the bee world, not because of the dangers in its use by
beekeepers but because of more general use in large animals for
slaughter. TM is still allowed (in the US) but has been under attack
several times and if it is denied because of problems outside of the bee
industry you can be sure it too will be gone for use by beekeepers.
There are other antibiotics and drugs that work as well as these on
individual bee problems but because of the unrealistic costs of
registration and not the dangers they could be misused are not available
for use on bees.

At the same time it must be acknowledged that in recent times when
beekeeper have turned their attention to agricultural pesticides for
the control of bee pests their have been some grand mistakes made by
beekeepers, some beekeepers have managed to shorten their own time on
this earth by their lack of knowledge on how to use pesticides. One case
in California that resulted in the loss of all use of one chemical in
use by the bee industry to kill diseased bees and also control wax moths
for thirty five years without problems happened because a bee regulator
who also was a beekeepers used the material without using common sense
God gives us all and almost killed himself, result none of us, including
bee regulators can use the chemical. In France and other places
beekeepers have reported a decline in their own personal health because
of the fogging of apiaries with pesticides to kill mites, so no fogging
is now allowed. I could go on and on, but I won't as accidents do happen
and it makes no difference if the product is approved or not.

It is sad that the laws are such that no matter how good a home brew
product of natural ingredients is there is no practicable way anyone can
formulate it without spending large sums of money on standardized tests
that may or may not protect the public or the user and do little more
then add to the everyday cost of living and/or keeping our bees healthy.
If the manufacture or formulator of this "mite solution" had sold it
only as a bee food additive he may have been able to do it without
serious legal problems because the laws are different for animal food
additives then they are for pesticides. (You need no permit, licence,
or should you need to fear feeding bees sugar, and other food
replacements, even though it is possible that these can get into the
honey if not used appropriately. The addition of other natural
ingredients, such as the so called "mite solution" to bee food should
be no different then adding TANG to standard insects diets which is/or
was a standard practice for many years outside of the bee industry, done
without any research to back it up other then the fact those who fed
insects did it because it did no harm and they felt it was useful.)

In this case I believe the ingredients are well known, readily
available, natural, and safe to use, and may have even been or are
being tested by the USDA for effective control of V. mites. Hopefully
some time in the future we all may be able to purchase and use them
without fear or problems from regulators. In what year or century I do
not know.

And my congratulation on being the first beekeeper in the United States
to report being able to get off the pesticide treadmill if only for a
short period of time.. I only hope it will not be to late for us all as
we wait for the USDA or whoever is going to find the non chemical
solution to the V. mites and gets the appropriate regulatory approval
as an alarming number of bees that were treated with Apistan according
to all recommendation and regulations were reported as dead this spring
>from  V. mites or PMS. If V. mites cause PMS then controlling the mites
should solve the problem and our bees should be healthy or at least not
dieing from V. mites or PMS. All PMS does is give the chemical
manufacture of Apistan an out when beekeepers find their products is
not working as advertised as they will say, "our product worked, your
bees must have died from PMS" and "the proof our product works is every
beekeeper is using it, and if it did not work they would not be doing
so", "and its registered, regulated, and recommended by our agents the
USDA, bee regulatory officials, and those in higher education and bee
research". They won't tell you that none of the above is any more adapt
at keeping their bees alive then you are, that is the few that have any
live bees.

                            ttul Andy-

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