Subject: Vegetable Plants From Seeds - NOT!

From: [email-masked] (James Villard)
Date: Fri, 10 Mar 1995 19:16:02 GMT

Last year I tried growing vegetables from seeds. I read several books
on the subject - but seemed to do everthing wrong. I planted tomatoes
and peppers from seeds because I was told these were very easy to do.

1) I used peat pots instead of the plastic pots. When it was time to 
   transplant no matter how careful I was every pot broke open and 
   all the roots spilled out. 

2) I used 2 shop lights for a total of 160 watts of power only about
   six inches away from the pots. When the plant started to grow they
   were long and stringy - I was told I needed more light. They also
   grew straight at the nearest light curving the stems - I tried rotating
   them every few days - finally they look like a silly straw. Yes I
   tin foiled all the way around. 

3) I was told both seeds would germinate at room temperature - only the 
   tomato plants did I had the heat up the pepper seeds to get them to
   germinate. 

4) They did not seem to grow much. The first 2 weeks they did great - then
   after about 2 - 3 inches high - they just stopped growing - nice and
   green but didn't grow any more.

5) Another thing I don't get is the cost, the trays, the seeds, the soil.
   The electricity is 12 weeks,16 hours a day,160watts, $0.11 a kilowatt.
   That comes up to $23.65 just for electric. 

   I can get good solid plants for $1.99 for 6 - thats at least 72 plants
   I can buy from the store from the money for the electric.

Am I missing something or is growing plants from seeds very hard to do
and only for fun and not economically a good idea. 

I live in Rochester N.Y. (upstate)

I would like to try it again this year - I think I would enjoy it but the 
how-to books really put me on the wrong track. Last year I tried the hi-tech
expensive way of growing seeds - purchasing everything I needed. 

Is it possible to just get some good outside topsoil, seed it and put it 
in the window. Whats the best thing to use for containers, I am looking 
at about 40 tomato plants and 20 pepper plants. Is the March and April
sun in upstate N.Y. even strong enough of should I just forget about it. 

 ___________________________________________________________________________
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|  James M. Villard                         E-mail: [email-masked]             |
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From: [email-masked] (Tomas Hybner)
Date: Mon, 13 Mar 1995 09:56:00 GMT

In article <[email-masked]> [email-masked] (James Villard) writes:

I'm unfamiliar with what "shop" lights are but given your description of the
result in growth of the plants that they don't produce the sort of light
seedlings need to grow. Normal light bulbs gives of light mainly in the red
and green parts of the spectrum and seedlings needs blue light in order to
grow properly. (I think that red light stimulates plants into growing
vertically while blue simply stimulates them to grow in every possible
direction.) Also, seedlings have a way of tilting their stem so that the
leaves receive the most light, there isn't much to do about it other than
making the light shine from directly over them. (If not you could always rotate
them but I imagine that wastes a bit of the seedlings energy.)

It's all a question of what is considered being "room temperature". Amongst my
friends "room temperature" is somewhere between 17 and 23 deg C. Although the
difference between 19 and 21 deg C might not seem much to a human seedlings
seems to be more sensitive.

I see your point...

It is hard to say whether or not it is economical or not, are you supposed to
count the time spent on nursing them as a loss of income? Never the less it
is definitely fun!

If you are interested in cutting costs you could bring up the seedlings in
newspaper-tubes. Tear a strip of paper from a newspaper, roll it around your
fingers or something to make it look like a tube, fill it with whatever soil
you're using and put the seeds in there. When they've grown their first set
of real leaves (which is neither of the two first ones) you can transplant
them into tetra-paks (like the ones you buy milk and juice in made of paper
with an inner coating of plastic). In relation to other plants tomatoe plants
need a ridiculous amount of water, almost to the point where your best bet
would be planting them in a bucket of water. I don't know about peppers though,
you'd better ask someone else...

Good luck!
Tomas

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From: [email-masked] (Tomas Hybner)
Date: Mon, 13 Mar 1995 10:29:08 GMT

About using top-soil from your garden. Sterilize it first! You can do that by steaming
the soil. Fill the bottom of a cooking-pot with small clean rocks up to about two
inches, pour water over it so that the whaterlevel does not rise entirely above the
rocks and then put the soil in (don't stir!). When the water simmers/boils the steam
will find it's way through the soil and heat it to approximately the boiling point
of water. This will kill almost everything in the soil that you don't want but it
will preserve the things that you do want. Don't let it get too hot!
When the soil is steaming you have hopefully succeeded in sterilizing the soil.
Don't use the lowest layer of soil and don't blame me for any unwanted effects this has
to whatever pot you were using!

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From: [email-masked]
Date: 13 Mar 95 14:20:27 -0600

> to whatever pot you were using!

Steamed soil (or baked soil) stinks up the house pretty badly in the
process (unless you're like me and LIKE the smell).  Put the steamed
soil in covered cans (a dinner plate over the can will do), and let it
set for several days before you use it.  The steaming or baking process
often produces some unwanted products of decomposition that can slow
down or stop plant growth.  So far, I believe, these products haven't
been well characterised.

Kay Klier  [email-masked]

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From: [email-masked] (JULIANNE WEIGHT)
Date: Mon, 20 Mar 1995 20:17:48 GMT

James Villard ([email-masked]) wrote:
: Last year I tried growing vegetables from seeds. I read several books
: on the subject - but seemed to do everthing wrong. I planted tomatoes
: and peppers from seeds because I was told these were very easy to do.

: 1) I used peat pots instead of the plastic pots. When it was time to 
:    transplant no matter how careful I was every pot broke open and 
:    all the roots spilled out. 

I like the Park Starts Pak.  With few exceptions (and the seeds were 
noted by the supplier to be in the "hard to grow from seed" category), 
these work marvelously well.  The root ball is compact and doesn't fall 
apart.  Yesterday I planted 40 plants (peppers and tomatoes) and they 
look great so far.  You can go directly from the starter pack to planting 
outdoors, without transferring to a larger pot (unless you started your 
seedlings too early, they're getting too big for the pack and you can't 
plant outdoors yet).  The packs can be re-used -- you just order new 
plugs from Park.  As you can probably tell, I'm really sold on these.  
I've never had an easier time starting and transplanting.

: Am I missing something or is growing plants from seeds very hard to do
: and only for fun and not economically a good idea. 

: I live in Rochester N.Y. (upstate)

I do it because I like to try different varieties and what you get from 
the local nurseries is limited.  I mean, it's okay for your first garden 
or two, but after awhile most people want to more variety.  I'm a good 
customer of about four different seed catalog companies and I've loved 
everything I've tried.