Subject: Re: Can I make a living from permaculture? (Long post approx 2800 words)
From: "Myk Rushton" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 10:11:06 +1300
Newsgroups: alt.permaculture

Mongolian Horde <[email-masked]> wrote in message
news:[email-masked]...

> Can I make a living from permaculture?

Here is a long post containing some posted to the Permaculture Action
Learning mailing list at the begining of August. I don't have a work visa
for NZ so have about a year to dedicate myself to permacultural activities
and forming a business plan for a Pc design Co.

Myk wrote (04Aug99):

The following text may or may not be considered connected with Action
Learning but as its something I'm working on at the moment in connetion with
my action pathway I thought I'd share it with others who are perhaps in a
similar situation. Maybe the diplomats can shed some light on this topic.

During my design course little attention was paid to the topic of earning a
living from permaculture design as a graduate or a diplomat (excluding PASE
forms, and teaching) and I now find myself asking questions such as how do I
describe the services I can offer? What type of services can I offer? How do
I go about dealing with a client? How do I schedule the full implementation
of a design? How much do I charge? How do I charge - fixed rate, hourly?
etc.

So to answer these questions I've been looking through landscape design
books (I figure landscape design is the closest analogous business to
permaculture design) to try and find some answers. Below are some of the
answers I've found adapted to fit in with permaculture, with notes on design
procedure that I'm trying to follow and some other landscape strategies
which may be useful (Thus the awful subject line :))

This list is not extensive or cast in stone so all input, discussion,
corrections, criticisms  etc.  will be useful

Okay here we go

POSSIBLE SERVICES OFFERED BY PERMACULTURE DESIGN COMPANY/BUSINESS

CONSULTATION:
Visit. Give verbal advice and no more
CONCEPT PLAN/DESIGN:
A design to scale but lacking detail - only providing a broad concept,
provisional zones/sectors etc.
SITE DESIGN:
A detailed design, showing layout, planting details etc, specifying other
features and components but not specifying the construction detail of hard
landscaping (e.g. the plan may indicate the location of a wall and say it is
to be built with stone, but it won't specify foundations, drainage etc. to
be incorporated into the wall, or that the soil is to be improved or
drainage required but not how) or management routines
FULL DESIGN PLANS AND SPECIFICATIONS:
These contain full and fine detail, including construction details of
structures e.g. soil improvement methods, plans of how to build the wall,
showing drainage, foundations etc, management routines, watering,
composting, planting regimes, crop rotation routines, harvesting routines,
propagation methods etc.

CONSULTING WITH CLIENT
It is important to both understand and identify the client's requirements,
desires, expectations etc, and that the final design meets these
requirements and fits within the finical budget.
It is at this stage that good listening skills (SOMAR) and application of
the appropriate tools (PASE, mindmapping, sketching etc.) play an important
part in the overall design.
Inform the client of impossible requests, suggest compromises be prepared to
compromise.
Begin identifying boundaries. Client: financial, commitment, time, beliefs
etc. and site: Legal site boundaries, neighbours, aspect, topography, soil
types, council regulations, existing permanent features etc.

DESIGN PROCEDURE - SADIM
SURVEY
Observe and record macro and micro components of the site, existing species
and their condition, shade areas, exposed areas, and characteristics of the
general neighbourhood of the site - is the site next door weed ridden or
heavily managed? Is the site next to a main road? etc.
Prepare a basic plan of the site, indicating boundaries, aspect, topography,
fences, buildings - including orientation, entrances, exits, windows,
permanent features i.e. drives, verandas, decks, balconies etc, position of
mains supplies i.e. water, gas, electric, telephone, sewage, drainage etc.

Take photographs from all angles of site and unique/permanent features, try
to take photos that will fit together to get larger continuous views
(photocollage?)

Research local climate.

ANALYSE
Analyse the data from the client consultation and the survey and form design
concept for zones, sectors, earthworks, constructions.
Carry out element analysis and feedback to design concept. Create concept
map overlays

DESIGN
Develop design concept Using further map overlays, showing zone and sector
details, major areas, guilds, paths, beds, larger plants - trees,
windbreaks, structures etc, aesthetics etc.  concentrating on those areas
which will be implemented first i.e. retaining walls, ponds, paths, zone 1
etc.
N.B. I am also trying (not always succesfully!)to include copious design
notes showing the how, what, why etc... of the design and feedback loops
etc. And to provide forecasts i.e. This tree will grow to 5m providing a
windbreak and allowing the later addition of more tender species in its lee
at a later date. To show that the development of the system has been
considered and that changes to the design with the progression of time have
been anticipated.

Begin preparing client management strategies and routines - I can create
designs because I study, work and accrue knowledge and skills, to manage the
designs I create will also require knowledge that the client may not have.
I've been suggesting to some clients who (appear committed to a permaculture
of their land or garden) at consultations (as detailed above) that they get
a year long page per day diary in which they record their own observations,
weather, plants, bugs etc. to get them involved in their garden right from
the start and create their own permaculture design diary. On an existing
permaculture site the adoption of a diary has help streamlined existing
routines and structure/schedule future events. (Whilst writing this I think
that for a commercial design to be successful the client will require
existing gardening skills and be taught, or prepared to self learn the
skills required to manage a permaculture in it's early stages and maintain
it in the future)

I have provided my first full client with a report to show them the rational
behind the permaculture design of their garden, to let them know what to
expect from the design, what my commitment is to the design and what their
responsibilities will be after installation.

CHAOS V's ORDER?

Some designer believe that good permaculture design looks good and that if
the clients/publics view of the site/design is one of chaos/mess then the
design is flawed (the exception being in the early stages of installation
and development).  The incorporation of some landscaping techniques may help
avoid such criticism.
UNITY
Repetition of pattern to create unity. The use of connecting elements to
visually join elements together i.e. hedges, paths, water features, mowing
strips, tyre walls etc. (although all elements of the system should feedback
to at least three other elements within the system rather than just be added
for aesthetic reasons)
BALANCE/EQUILIBRIUM
Symmetry (duplication on either side of an imaginary line or asymmetry
(placement of dissimilar elements on either side of an imaginary line) in
such away that equilibrium exists
PROPORTION
The size and scaling of elements within the design
HARMONY
This is considered to be the prime objective of landscape designers and
describes the way that the landscape fits together
CONTRAST
The opposite of harmony. To much contrast gives the appearance of chaos.
Contrast is used by landscape designers to create eye catching features.
RHYTHM
Repetition of similar elements within the design usually created by
repetition and transition of elements
IMPLEMENTATION
Implementation of the design should be carried out in stages as either
finance, preparatory works, client development, soil development etc...
allow. Never attempt to do everything at once or to take on to much.
Implement the design in stages concentrating on zones 00 through to 1,
installation of infrastructure and areas of slow permaculture roll out i.e.
sheet mulching in other higher zones, temporary windbreaks etc...

Well that's as far as I've got so far

[end]

Mark Fisher wrote (04Aug99):

Thanks Myk for opening one of the less easy debates in Permaculture.

As a diplomat in the UK, my prime aim is to infiltrate Permaculture into the
mainstream. Thus colleagues and myself teach through established adult
education systems such as further education colleges and the Workers
Education Association. These strategies broaden the reach of Permaculture
(compared to bunking off into the wilds for two weeks) and often they
attract subsidy for those on welfare benefits.

Design services in the UK also require a different emphasis. In the main,
land use designs are not in much demand as access to rural land for most
(80% of our population) is non-existent. Thus design skills mostly have to
be used on urban projects, dealing with community design as much as small
area land use. Fortunately, Permaculture is perfectly suited to this and I
suspect we may be providing examples of design in peoplecare that are
defining.

What to charge depends on your circumstances and those of the client. My top
rate is 400 pounds sterling a day - but as you can guess, I rarely get that
(but it will come as paying for sustainability becomes more accepted). Often
I am quite content with some pittance that really doesn't make any economic
sense! (Such is the advantage of not having to rely on permaculture for an
income).

I have found working as part of a team more rewarding than being on my own.
I learn more that way and can bring the minds of many to bear on the work.
It is quite simple to set up a non-profit company (run as a co-op) with
others and market services on that basis. It gives clients some confidence
as well.

Good luck

Myk wrote (04Aug99):

Thanks for the input

Just a quick reply before I go out. Judith probably has a better idea of the
type of rural lifestyle block design that I've found myself involved in down
under in the southern hemisphere and its defiantly not urban although like
you say permaculture is equally at home in a rural or urban setting. (in the
near future I'll have a web page together showing elements of my work and
that of others I'm working with (designs, installations: the chicken
tractor, the pig tractor and pens, pruning, plantings etc...)

You write that 400ukpounds is your top line, what services do you provide
for that charge? As for the pittance that really doesn't make any sense I've
been freelance computer training at 30NZdollars/hour the same amount I'm
earning on a daily basis at my main permaculture site! The amount of action
learning and hands on experience on the permaculture site more than offsets
the financial difference though.

You also mention that paying for permaculture design (sustainability) will
become more acceptable in the future. That may be the case in the UK but
here in NZ with the published Green party manifesto demanding 50% of NZ
farming be organic by 2010 and the remaining 50% in transition (yes they
want a 100% organic NZ), the NZ soil and health association manifesto
demanding a 100% organic NZ by 2010 (yes they also want a 100% organic NZ),
The backlash against genetic engineering, the current concern about food
quality and general health i.e. pesticide residues, and the knowledge that
for an agricultural nation the economic sense a catering to the demand of
the huge international organic market etc... paying for permaculture design
is already a feasible reality.

I have also come to the conclusion kindred spirits to work with is
important, finding as I do that most of the flora that I know and would use
in a design are classed in NZ as a noxious weeds! and my knowledge of native
species (growth habitat, nutrient requirement, hardiness/tenderness, mature
size, growth rate, inputs/outputs etc...) is poor. I have been putting out
feelers for landscape designer who may have heard about, been asked about or
can generally see the inevitability of permaculture with a view to working
with them or forming a new venture (Design tribe plc :-) ) [NB 22Oct99 There
is already a company in NZ with this name - this was not known at the time.
Myk]

Anyway got to ryd

Graham Burnett wrote (04Aug99):

Learning

I though Myk & Mark both raised really interesting points in their
respective emails, and I found
both really valuable & useful in helping to formulate my own ideas, and full
of practical
information nicely distilled...

A couple of people I know, both friends & on LETS, have asked me to do
'Permaculture Designs' on
their gardens, but what they've wanted hasn't been 'permaculture' at all...
I think they were
getting a bit mixed up with the 'instant gardening' mentality I was going on
about earlier on the
other list, which is fine, but perhaps not the approach I had in mind...

Unfortunately there's so many misconceptions about the word 'permaculture',
and it is a set of
ideas/philosophy/design strategies/overall approach that CANNOT be summed up
in a one sentence
sound bite answer (don't you just hate it when people say "Come on then,
what IS Permaculture?")-
I've kind of said to people that I'd be happy to bring my limited knowledge
and experience about
gardening & growing to their gardens and talk through ideas, etc, but if
they really want a
PERMACULTURE design I'd be alot happier if they would first attend a PC
introductory course in
order to gain the underlying knowledge of what the word means, the ethics,
principles, patterning,
observation, design strategies (SADIM, etc), how everything links together
(ie, you can't consider
your garden as seperate from your house, or your house as seperate from your
community, or your
community as seperate from the planet, or your planet as seperate from you &
so on)- maybe even
holding a mini design course at their house/ in their garden might be
appropriate-

As for payment, at present I'm more than happy to accept anything above
expenses in local LETS
currency, or a few beers if they arn't LETS members- but I'm still very much
a learner myself, and
I don't think my design work would be of particularly high quality at the
moment- though I'd make
it clear to the client that any design work I did would be as much a part of
the learning curve for
me as for them (it would also be a part of my 'payment' that there is an
understanding that any
design produced would be a part of my Diploma Portfolio)- I've chatted about
this to a couple (good
friends) who have asked me to look at their garden, though nothing has come
of this yet...

2 more questions/comments (to myself as much as to the PAL forum)

1) Is the diploma about earning a living from Permaculture (eg, quitting my
full time job and
becomming a teacher/designer full time as an eventual aim) or is it about
applying a deeper
understanding of permaculture to how I am currently earning a living or
might earn a living in
future?

2) I liked what somebody (Mollison?) said that in fact the client already
has the necessary
knowledge to create a design, and that the 'design' is already in any
landscape or situation- the
role of a good permaculture designer is to empower and bring both out, in
much the same way that
the sculpture is within the uncarved block...

So good PC design is the diametrical opposite to the usual set up wherin
'professionals' take great
pains to mystify and gate-keep their 'specialist knowledge' by using
academia, jargon,
'professional bodies', freemasonry, etc...

Judith Hanna wrote (09Aug99):

Responding quickly to a couple of Graham's points -- will come back later to
the very useful Myk/Mark material, and my own experiences.

Graham Burnett wrote:

>2 more questions/comments (to myself as much as to the PAL forum)
>
>1) Is the diploma about

earning a living from Permaculture (eg, quitting my full time job and
>becomming a teacher/designer full time as an eventual aim)

This option would take a long time to work up to, so not good as a reason
for doing a Diploma

or is it about applying a deeper
>understanding of permaculture to how I am currently earning a living or
might earn a living in >future?

But this seems to me the right approach -- whatever we do, apply
permaculture understanding to doing it.

>
>2) I liked what somebody (Mollison?) said that in fact the client already
has the necessary
>knowledge to create a design, and that the 'design' is already in any
landscape or situation- the
>role of a good permaculture designer is to empower and bring both out, in
much the same way that
>the sculpture is within the uncarved block...
>
>So good PC design is the diametrical opposite to the usual set up wherin
'professionals' take great
>pains to mystify and gate-keep their 'specialist knowledge' by using
academia, jargon,
>'professional bodies', freemasonry, etc...

Absolutely -- and one of my sections in the UK teachers handbook, on
'dealing with official systems' is about encouraging people to challenge
jargon and 'expertise'. Real expertise is encouraging people to design for
themselves, drawing on their own knowledge, understanding, research and
experiment -- not about delivering patly packaged 'solutions'.

Cheers,

[end]

That's it. If you got this far you deserve a cup of tea :-)

Myk
--

From: "Myk Rushton" <[email-masked]>
Newsgroups: alt.permaculture
Subject: Re: Can I make a living from permaculture? Platitudes
Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 10:19:55 +1300
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The below was post by Stefania of Green Adventures in Brixton (09Aug99).

[Start]

Permaculture Action Learning

I know this can be difficult to swallow when you're looking for income, but
I am having to remind myself of this quite regularly, quite simply because
it is what has worked for me and for others who ended up doing jobs they
love.  A huge amount of integrity goes into ending up with a job full of
integrity, & we have to be willing to do the walk - focusing too much on the
money just doesnt' work.

soheregoes:

platitude no.1
do what you love doing, and what you have a real passion for, using
whichever opportunities present themselves - sooner or later you will end up
making a living out of what you love

platitude no. 2
don't ask yourself what they world needs [you to do], rather ask yourself
what makes you come alive - because what the wold needs is people who have
come alive
[and alive people are in huge demand in employment]

platitude no. 3
diversification - do lots of things that you love and trust in the bounty of
life.

I've called them platitudes because that's how I myself feel about them now
that I'm having to look at the stark realities of having to make an income
(one contract coming to an end) and surenough I'm finding myself looking at
jobs I wouldn't last 5 minutes in, and considering it.... yuck.
But I know they work.

This is what Kahil Gibran has to say about work, and I like it:

....................
You work that you may keep pace with the earth and the soul of the earth.
...
When you work you are a flute through whose heart the whistering of the
hours turns to music.
...
when you work you fulfil a part of eath's furtherst dream, assigned to you
when that dream was born.

... Work is love made visible.

And if you cannot work with love but only with distaste, it is better that
you should leave your work and sit a the gate of the temple and take alms fo
those who work with joy.

For if you bake bread with indifference, you bake a bitter bread that feeds
but half man's hunger.
And if you grudge the crushing of the grapes, your grudge distils a poison
in the wine.
And if you sing though as angesl, and love not the singing, you muffle man's
ears to the voices of the day and the voices of the night.
....................................

[end]

Myk
--