Subject: Mollison bashing

From: Kirby Fry <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 9 Oct 1997 08:23:59 -0400

Hi Gene,

Thanks for encouraging us to take heart and tighten our (money) belts.  I
agree that it's hard to make a $20 or $30 thousand dollar income from
teaching and consulting but perhaps if you can get by on a $5 or $10
thousand income then you're getting somewhere.  My wife and I have made it
on as little in the last four years.  We don't even have to file for taxes.

I didn't read the article in the Activist but it sounded like teachers felt
Bill and Scott were pulling students away from other courses.  We hosted
five courses with Scott and Bill over the last four years and none of them
brought in a landslide of students.  # of students per design course - 60,
35, 17 (earth works), 30, 20 (advanced design course).

Anyhow, even though Bill can be gruff and grate his host the wrong way if
they're not straight with him, I'm still glad to have him around here in
the states.

        KIRBY [@ Cross Timbers Permaculture Inst. on Lake Buchanan, TX;
512-756-7878; web address csf.colorado.edu/perma/]

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From: Lee Flier <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 1997 11:09:57 -0500

After reading Kirby's comments I am compelled to repeat: those who are the
most successful PRACTITIONERS of Permaculture - i.e. *don't need much
income* (or have income from other diverse sources) - seem to also 1) be
the most successful teachers and 2) be the least competitive amongst each
other.

Kirby, you also disproved another statement I have heard in PC Activist and
elsewhere that people who've hosted courses for Mollison never do it a
second time.  Thanks for debunking that one!

As for not bringing in a landslide of students, I still think there has
been somewhat of a concern among some (including Bill) that permaculture in
the U.S. has not taken hold in the way that it has elsewhere.  Dan seems to
allude to this also (in saying the US can't support teachers).  I don't
think we've yet reached that "critical mass" in terms of numbers that
allows for real work to be done outside of the small pockets of intense
activity.  In the US, you often have to "market" yourself and that seems to
be what most permies, understandably, are loathe to do.  Dave Blume did it
and now he along with Bill is taking heat for it.

Thanks Kirby!

= Lee =

==================================
Lee A. Flier
[email-masked]
http://lflier.home.mindspring.com
Atlanta and Ellijay, Georgia, U.S.A.

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From: Lee Flier <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 09 Oct 1997 11:09:57 -0500

Thanks Kirby!

= Lee =