Subject: [permaculture] RE: Re: Does Permaculture have to be so expensiv

From: Thilo Pfennig <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 16 May 1999 11:39:37 +0200 (MEST)

On 14-May-99 Xavier Dequaire wrote:
 
> If permaculture training might be expensive, is expensive for some body,
> applying what you learn is definitly opening for a much less expensive
> lifestyle, and most people will be fast paid back their little investment
> in training.

This is a good point. But if you see it this way: People who are looking for a
cheaper lifestyle may not, like me have a 1000$. So it seems to me that it is
absurd to try to bring a cheap lifestyle to poorer people with high costs for
the courses. But maybe we really should differ between courses for teachers and
courses for _everybody_?

-- 
Thilo Pfennig 
<http://Alternativ.Net/>

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From: Xavier Dequaire <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 08:56:51 +0200

>If we manage to distribute our information faster and better as the one of
>Monsanto or Shell, this may really change things.

This is one of the keys of some success of information about Permaculture
and other alternative solutions-
against Monsanto, coca cola and such others using billions in propaganda,
Permaculture has to also use the advanced tools.
Today internet and networking are the strongest and only affordable to us.
MLM/network marketing was mentionned: there is a lot to learn there: the
laws of duplication. MLM is very modern and basics and has strong tools.
 That is where some (too) intellectual and theoritical aspects of
permaculture come short,
Theory can be learned through books and internet, I design myself
interactive learning solutions (CBT-Computer Based Training), and I know it
is possible to use the Internet technologies to create a fantastic and very
efficient course to provide the theories.
As imho Permaculture implies a shift in lifestyle, theory must be
reinforced by practice, practicle training, that is: courses and meetings:
gather people, exchange ideas on a small local basis where people have FUN
doing it: this builds up the network.
Some can make a living to organize those.

This list is a network building up, it is ok, but after a while it gets
somehow boring, I'd rather be in my garden discussing with you my
micro-climates, compost, stove or edible pond or whatever makes
sustainability and DO it.

Peace

Xavier

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From: Kelley <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 10:49:27 -0400

Okay, techies, I don't think it's just me missing a bit of this conversation.  What is
XML?  SGML?  T-1?  etc??

Kelley

Larry London wrote:

> http://metalab.unc.edu/london   InterGarden
> [email-masked]   [email-masked]
>
> On Wed, 19 May 1999, Thilo Pfennig wrote:
>
> > But this is not the question. And teachers who get ten times more in pay would
> > not be the solution of the problem, either. An teacher who get nothing paid are
> > also not a solution. This is a structural problem and has one of his roots in
> > the property rights for information. The freedom of information is too
> > expensive for most people.
>
> Short of having our own T-1 lines with webservers on them we still have
> access right now providing us with the ability to exchange large
> quantities of info: CD's, tapes, web/ftp sites. The format in which the
> info is delivered needs working on. Hence, SGML, XML via the Web and
> tools for creating CD's with well organized/structured information: text,
> multimedia, interactive features, indexing, searching. CD's with turnkey
> databases (XML?) that we can add our own resources to.
>
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From: Kelley <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 10:57:16 -0400

Yes, but one would hope that PC would use a more ethical way of disseminating info than
corporations such as Monsanto or Shell.  MLM doesn't seem very socially sustainable to
me, then neither does the internet.

Kelley

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From: Thilo Pfennig <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 16:27:45 +0200 (MEST)

> sustainability and DO it.

:-))

You made me laugh. Thank you for that!

Shalom,

Thilo

-- 
Thilo Pfennig 
<http://Alternativ.Net/>

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