Subject: RE: knowing and learning (was Sobering Stats)

From: John Schinnerer <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 11:08:33 -0700

Aloha,

-----Original Message-----
From: Lawrence F. London, Jr. [mailto:[email-masked]]
>And other than what he taught you and others by word of mouth (did you
>write it all down or tape record it?) that body of knowledge will pass on
>with him when he dies. Had he a computer and an ISP he could have shared/
>recorded/syntheszed that knowledgebase with the rest of the world. 

I don't imagine that he could have shared much of his embodied knowing via
computer and internet (and certainly not with "the rest of the world" - only
with the tiny percentage who have internet access).  It doesn't transmit, it
doesn't digitize, it is too rich and complex for such a one-dimensional,
non-living manner of transmission.  And it is a process, not a collection of
data.  Some "facts" could be recorded, no doubt, but to me (and, I suspect,
to our species) it is the whole experience that matters.  Otherwise we are
simply repeating the mistake of thinking that the whole is nothing more than
the sum of its parts.

It's fine to take advantage of the technology we've got while we've got it,
but I don't favor depending on it or expecting it to do things it can't.
It's much too fragile.  The oral culture of Hawai'i maintained and
transmitted the knowledge required for food, shelter and community systems
(not to mention open ocean navigation, etc.) for thousands of years (and
there are plenty of other examples all over the world...).  That's what I'd
call a fault-tolerant data storage system... ;-)  Traditional Polynesian
navigation is now being revived in the only way it can be - through
apprentices living the experience until they know it with all of themselves.

That's what I like about the best of permaculture at present - it's people
living bioregionally appropriate processes and inviting other people to
learn by getting involved in those processes.  Inviting people
from/traveling to other bioregions provides necessary cross-fertilization.
It all comes down to human relatings...

John Schinnerer

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From: "Lawrence F. London, Jr." <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 15:05:44 -0400 (EDT)

> simply repeating the mistake of thinking that the whole is nothing more than

Something is better than nothing. He needs an interpreter to observe,
understand and record his knowledge as best he can, someone like Mollison,
who could put it into print, later converted to electronic format,
with snippets submitted to discussion forums like this one for synthesis.

> apprentices living the experience until they know it with all of themselves.

I'd say electronic media is farm from fragile and is getting more 
permanent as technology develops; and there is microfilm and print on
improved paper (hemp?). 

> It all comes down to human relatings...

Quite right & we need more of that but until then many of us will rely on
electronic means of building community.