From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 1 May 90 09:14:09 -0400

Date: Tue, 1 May 90 09:14:09 -0400
From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]

Received: by woodb.UUCP (uucp on woodb)
To: mimsy!MC.lcs.mit.edu!pdp8-lovers
Subject: Subscription and a PDP11/34

Subject: Subscription and a PDP11/34
To: woodb!mimsy!MC.lcs.mit.edu!pdp8-lovers
Date: Tue, 1 May 90 7:56:16 CDT
From: [email-masked] (Don Ingli)

First of all, if many of you are knowledgable on the pdp11/34 or
believe this list will benefit a pdp11/34 owner then please subscribe
me to this list.....

Second, I am planing to buy a pdp11/34.  The owner says it has
multi-user BASIC on it but comming from a UNIX environment, I would like
to have SySV (if possible) UNIX on the 11/34.  Also, can I have your
reactions on this machine.  Is it easy to obtain manuals for it and
is there alot of cheap to free software for it???

Please send your comments here-------------+
                                         \ | /
                                          \ /
                                           V
-- 
Don Ingli - USDA/Soil Conservation Service - Information Resource Mgmt.
INTERNET: [email-masked]    PHONE: (314) 875-5344
               UUCP: ...!uunet!mimsy!woodb!scsmo1!don
         These are my opinions and I represent only myself.

Date: Wed 2 May 90 21:23:34
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]

Date: Wed 2 May 90 21:23:34
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Hi, Don.

First: Welcome to the pdp8-lovers, even if you don't have a pdp8.
I'm sure Rob will add you to the list ([email-masked]).

Second: The pdp-11 is maybe the best machine ever designed, if you
ask me (I love my eights, but the eleven is great!). There is lots
of software, even free for it, and UNIX has a lot of versions for the pdp-11.
I guess it will cost you some $$$ to get that, though...
The multiuser basic could be RSTS/E. If so, that's a pretty good OS.
It might also be another OS, which I'm quite unfamiliar with, which
is not that good. However, if you can spare the bucks, go for it.
It's a nice machine, even if a little small, by all standards.

The only fault I ever found in the eleven was the fact that address
space is limited to 16 bits, ot 64Kbytes for each process.

	Johnny

Posted-Date: 3 May 90 14:36:10 PDT (Thu)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: pdp11, pdp8
Date: 3 May 90 14:36:10 PDT (Thu)
From: [email-masked] (M.R.Murphy)

Posted-Date: 3 May 90 14:36:10 PDT (Thu)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: pdp11, pdp8
Date: 3 May 90 14:36:10 PDT (Thu)
From: [email-masked] (M.R.Murphy)

The PDP-11 has an instruction address space of 16 bits and a data address
space of 16 bits (kind of like I-FIELD and D-FIELD, no?) but the memory
management hardware had all the hooks to run a complete virtual system. That
means that had someone (DEC, anyone else, whoever) wished to implement OS
and compiler support, processes could have been limited in size only by the
amount of external memory devoted to swapping and paging. The major limitation
is that the I/O is not mapped through the memory management unit. Since
physical memory could have been non-contiguous and, in fact, not monotonic
with respect to virtual memory, this would have made direct I/O into user
space a real kick. However, buffered system I/O wouldn't be a problem except
for real-time performance. Since the 11 was a real-time product (RSX,RT,et.al.)
, oh well... enough PDP-11

Back to the PDP-8. I have modified the DECUS-C FOCAL to run under SYSTEM V.
Really simple to convert it to BSD, it would be.  The directory stuff and file
load, file write works. I've really missed FOCAL, and I liked it better than
BASIC. If anyone wants it, E-mail. I'm in the act of typing in a manual, but
you all did keep your DEC FOCAL manuals, didn't you?

I've completed the first shot at a PDP-8 simulator, again to run under
SYSTEM V, and again easily convertable to BSD. It has the following features
(or bugs, if you prefer)

 o support for multiple fields

 o interrupts

 o simulation of IOTs for device 01, 02, 03, 04

 o currently executes at 65% of the speed of a PDP-8S on a 10MHz '286 running
   Microport SV/AT :-) Hand optimized assembler would produce code that would
   run quite a bit faster than PCC generated code.

I saved several magnetic tapes made on a PDP-8 about, oh, 18 years ago. All
but one, cleverly, made in core dump mode 9-track, and therefore, unreadable
on our current drives :-(. The one remaining tape was made on another PDP-8
and was readable. It is a dump of an OS/8 system disk. The boot block looks
OK, and I'm in the act of implementing support for a disk device for the
simulator, writing the OS/8 system driver for that device, patching it into
the disk image, and getting set to run OS/8 under SV.

Seemed like a good thing to do at the time :-)

Does anyone have an OS/8 paper tape distribution that they'd part with for
a while? I'd hate to be missing something that isn't on that one disk image.
Even better would be a nice 9-track dump that is readable. Or a TSS-8
distribution. If someone from DEC reads this, and is in a position to speak
or speculate, what's the current status of OS/8 or TSS-8, for that matter?
Could I make this stuff available? Would anyone care? Kind of makes me feel
like I imagine that people who rebuild steam engines just to hear them run
and watch the governer spin feel about what they do :-)

Would people please let the rest of us know what PDP-8 systems they have
running, almost running, or just sitting? We got rid of our last PDP-8a
about 2 years ago.

More's the pity...

Regards,
Mike
--
Mike Murphy  Sceard Systems, Inc.  544 South Pacific St. San Marcos, CA  92069
[email-masked]        {hp-sdd,nosc,ucsd,uunet}!sceard!mrm      +1 619 471 0655

From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Need DECtapes
Date: Thu May  3 19:06:13 1990

From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Need DECtapes
Date: Thu May  3 19:06:13 1990

My PDP-8 runs fine, but the DECtapes are dead.  Where can I get some?  And
where can I get OS/8 & utilities?  

					-- David Schachter
					   [email-masked]
					   ...!uunet!mips!llustig!david
					   [email-masked] (MAYBE)

					   +1 415 328 7425
					   Palo Alto, California, USA

Date: Fri, 4 May 90 08:11:53 EST
From: Robert E. Seastrom <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]
Subject: Need DECtapes

Date: Fri, 4 May 90 08:11:53 EST
From: Robert E. Seastrom <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: [email-masked]'s message of Thu May  3 19:06:13 1990 <[email-masked]>
Subject: Need DECtapes

   From: [email-masked]

   My PDP-8 runs fine, but the DECtapes are dead.  Where can I get some?  And
   where can I get OS/8 & utilities?  

I'm confused.  Are you looking for DECtapes, or are you looking for
TU-55 for TU-56 DECtape transport units?  Your posting doesn't make it
clear.

If you want to get some brand-new ones, you might want to try
DECdirect; they might have a few left in stock (last I checked you
could still order paper tape from them!) - make sure you aren't
getting DECtape IIs though.

A related thought:  Once the magnetic stuff goes to hell, has anyone
had any experience winding 1" video tape or some such onto the empty
DECtape reels?

                                        ---Rob

Date: Fri, 4 May 90 10:23:39 PDT
From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re:  pdp11, pdp8
Cc: [email-masked]

Date: Fri, 4 May 90 10:23:39 PDT
From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re:  pdp11, pdp8
Cc: [email-masked]

Mike,

We still have two PDP-8/I computers in operation.  These are 32K machines with
EAE and dual TU-55 DECtape drives.  The machines also have some custom I/O
interfaces of our own design.  One of these provides support for dual 8-inch
floppy drives which emulate all DECtape functions, with the exception of
read/write reverse, and will thus run nearly all DECtape software transparently.
These machines can also read/write 9-track magtape at 800 BPI (NRZI) and 1600
BPI (PE).  Other peripherals include a Tektronix 611 Memscope, DECwriter,
Calcomp plotter, and RS-232 interface.

I have DECtape distributions for OS/8 Version 3, and also a large number of
DECtapes from DECUS symposia of the 1976-1979 era; these contain lots of
interesting OS/8 utilities.  I would be happy to copy these if DEC indicates
that there is no problem in doing so.

Robert Kibrick
Lick Observatory
Natural Sciences 2
University of California
Santa Cruz, CA 95064-1012
(408)-459-2262

[email-masked]
[email-masked]

From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: DECtapes again
Date: Fri May  4 12:08:58 1990

From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: DECtapes again
Date: Fri May  4 12:08:58 1990

My request for a source of DECtapes was meant as an inquiry about the physical
medium, not the drives (TU-58, et. al.) used to read and write them.  My drives
work find (or so my Significant Other tells me) but I haven't any good tapes
(DECtapes) for them.  (DECtapes, not DECtape II's.)

					-- David Schachter
					   [email-masked]
					   ...!uunet!mips!llustig!david
					   [email-masked] (MAYBE)

					   +1 415 328 7425
					   Palo Alto, California, USA

Date: Sat 5 May 90 02:42:04
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Need DECtapes
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]

Date: Sat 5 May 90 02:42:04
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Need DECtapes
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Hi, David.

Are you having problems with the drives or the tapes?
If you need tapes, I can provide some.

OS/8 and utilities can be dumped down on DECtape as well.
What system do you have?
Do you have any disks?

	Johnny

Date:    Fri, 18 May 90 16:39 CDT
From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Looking for M840 PC8E reader/punch controller

X-Delivery-Notice:  SMTP MAIL FROM does not correspond to sender.
Date:    Fri, 18 May 90 16:39 CDT
From: [email-masked]
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Looking for M840 PC8E reader/punch controller

Hi Guys,

I require an M840 reader/punch controller.  Anyone out there have
one they would be willing to part with?  I will buy or swap for one.
I also am still hunting for RL8A and FPP8A circuit boards.

I still have a good selection of Unibus boards I would like to
swap for Omnibus or Qbus cards...

Many thanks,
                Richard F. Lukes
                Computer Science Department
                University of Manitoba
                Winnipeg, Manitoba  R3T 2N2
                Canada

                [email-masked]

Summary-line: 21-May   [email-masked]  #drives
Date: Mon, 21 May 90 19:27:33 EDT
From: [email-masked] (Goerge Frajkor)
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject:  drives

Date: Mon, 21 May 90 19:27:33 EDT
From: [email-masked] (Goerge Frajkor)
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject:  drives

    I have an old PDP8 with a six-foot tall rack of RKO5J drives which
looks awfully impressive but in fact holds only 16 meg or so of
memory.  Has anyone ever tried to cable up the standard small

Winchester drives of today (Seagates, Quantums, MicroScis, etc., )
to an 8E?  Is there any hardware/software reason it cannot be done?
this thing is using OS8 right now.  I would dearly love to get rid of
the rack and the drives and cobble up the cables so that the 8E could
use a RAINBOW type hard drive (or indeed, a floppy -- some of the
new high density floppies carry more than the old 500k RKO5.  
    Also, I once read that some students at Ryerson Polytech in
Toronto were working on converting a PDP8 to run MSDOS software. That
struck me as impossible.  Am I right?

Date: Tue 22 May 90 22:15:36
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked],
        [email-masked]

Date: Tue 22 May 90 22:15:36
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked],
        [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Hi, Goerge (or should it be George?)

Connecting modern drives to an omnibus eight? Well, there are two aspects
to this. Hardware: Sure, no problems. It is very possible, but you will
probably have to build your own controller, which interface to the omnibus.
The omnibus is quite capable of handling such a device.
However, software is a pain in the ass. OS8, which is the operating system
you, and everybody else use, has a serious limitation. No device can
have more than 4095 blocks. An RK05 actually holds 3 meg, or 6000 blocks
(approx.). OS8 solves this by regarding one RK05 as two drives, of approx.
3000 blocks each. It gets worse if you have an RL02, which takes 10 meg.
OS8 needs to handle this as five drives, of 4000 blocks each. This leads
to problem #2. OS8 can only have 16 devices at the same time. Clearly this
gives that you have no big use of large hard disks, unless you write a
new OS. Plans for new OS' sure exists, but no more than plans. The problem
is getting software. All software is written for OS8, and some of that
software is really good, such as the macro assembler. If that could become
free, maybe something funnny could happen.

As to converting a PDP8 to run MSDOS software, it sure is possible, but
pretty stupid. What you would need to do is amulationg the 8086 processor,
which can be done. And moving and converting the BIOS. Also, no software
which directly addresses the screen memory, or uses graphics would work.
Note that you would need to implement virtual memory to be able to run
MSDOS, since it expects to find 640K memory, or so, and the pdp8 only have
32 KW. Such an emulation would be very slow, and would not give much
of an improvement to the eight (the opposite in my mind... :-)

Has anybody made any plans for an SCSI interface for the eight?
Or any other modern interface for big disks?

	Johnny

Date: Wed, 23 May 90 21:01:25 -0500
From: Danger Mouse <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject: Re: drives
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]

Date: Wed, 23 May 90 21:01:25 -0500
From: Danger Mouse <[email-masked]>
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Subject: Re: drives
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]

>Has anybody made any plans for an SCSI interface for the eight?
>Or any other modern interface for big disks?
 
I have decided to go a different route, and that's to write an MS-DOS device
driver for the unused PDP-8/e I have.  The eight will (hopefully) just see a 
terminal ... or maybe I will want my PC to act as the boot device for the PDP, 
I don't know yet.

Has anyone done anything like this yet?  

+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
| Loren E. Heal | Internet: [email-masked] (from *net, you figure it out) | 
|(Not a spokesman for the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign)      | 
|(I may work there, but I still own my own mind!)                          |
+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+

Date: Thu, 24 May 90 02:15:12 EDT
From: [email-masked] (Larry Stone)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: drives

Date: Thu, 24 May 90 02:15:12 EDT
From: [email-masked] (Larry Stone)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: drives

> Date: Tue 22 May 90 22:15:36
> From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Re: drives
>
> Connecting modern drives to an omnibus eight? Well, there are two aspects
> to this. Hardware: Sure, no problems. It is very possible, but you will
> probably have to build your own controller, which interface to the omnibus.
> The omnibus is quite capable of handling such a device.

Most modern disk-drive interfaces are designed to do DMA into system
memory.  The Omnibus had "data break" I/O, but it looks pretty hairy,
and I think it requires an extra data break controller card.
Fortunately, I think a SCSI (or SASI - the proto-SCSI) interface can be
built using good old programmed I/O, and still be "fast enough".  A
SCSI disk unit has its own sector buffer, so it can send bytes to the
host asynchronously at whatever rate the host wants.

> However, software is a pain in the ass.

Writing the software -- a standard OS/8 file structured device driver --
is probably the easiest part.  I agree that the limitations are a pain,
but after being spoiled by tree-structured directories on Unix, I'm not
sure that I'd *want* more than 2 meg in a single "directory"!

> Has anybody made any plans for an SCSI interface for the eight?
> Or any other modern interface for big disks?

Yes.  I've been thinking hard about a SCSI host adaptor (i.e.  a
controller board) for the Omnibus.  It looks pretty easy to build one
out of an NCR 5380 SCSI controller chip.  That chip handles all the
logic and handshaking on the bus, and presents a much simpler interface
to the computer, which fits the PDP-8 programmed I/O model nicely.  I
roughed out an interface that provides the IOTs a device driver would need.

It's easy to get a SCSI disk.  I picked up an Adaptec ST506-to-SCSI disk
controller (at a hamfest) which can be slapped on top of any cheap 10-Mb
drive to create a SCSI disk.  Thanks to the PC market, ST506 disks
are available and inexpensive.

All I need now is the physical platform (a kludge board or Foundation
Module), the NCR 5380, and a bunch of free time [the hard part!].

By the way, the Omnibus Foundation Module (M-something, it's in the 1977
logic handbook) is a wonderful board for building a custom interface.
It has all the bus drivers and receivers, and a good bit of the decoding
logic already done.  There is also a generous kludge area with 16-pin
*and* wide (24- or 40-pin) DIPs, edge connectors, and 40-pin Berg
connectors available on wire-wrap pins.  I've got one of these beauties,
but my Diablo HyType-I and music interfaces are on it now so they'd need
to be torn down and moved to a plain kludge board.

I also just picked up a Unibus quad WW kludge board with some 40-pin DIP
sockets, which could be adapted.  (Don't just plug in blank Unibus
kludge boards, though, some power traces may short the wrong lines and
need to be cut!).  All the Omnibus WW boards I've seen have only 16-pin
DIP sockets, so plugging in the SCSI chip would be a pain.

Whenever I finally get this done, I'll make all the notes, logic design,
and software available.  It may be a while, since I just moved
and the pdp-8/e is still in pieces!

> Date: Wed, 23 May 90 21:01:25 -0500
> From: Danger Mouse <[email-masked]>
> Message-Id: <[email-masked]>
> Subject: Re: drives
>
> I have decided to go a different route, and that's to write an MS-DOS device
> driver for the unused PDP-8/e I have.  The eight will (hopefully) just see a
> terminal ... or maybe I will want my PC to act as the boot device for the PDP,
> I don't know yet.

I thought about that, too, but didn't have an unused (or any,
thankfully!) IBM PC lying around the house.  There was a DECUS "VAX
driver" for OS/8, but I think it was just a one-shot file transfer
program; you open the device and it reads or writes a file on the VAX.
I may have the source to this on line, when I get the '8 back together anyway.

If you want the PC to supply a file-structured device to the pdp-8, the
easiest thing to do might be to link them with a simple parallel (DR8E)
or even serial (extra console/TTY board). Have the device driver use
a simple protocol (like XMODEM) to get the blocks of a virtual "disk" -
a big file on the DOS side.

	-- Larry

Orig-To: [email-masked]
Rewrite-To: apollo!mit-eddie!ai.mit.edu!pdp8-lovers
Date: Thu, 24 May 90 10:21:31 PDT
From: [email-masked] (Bob Armstrong at EDA West)
To: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: drives

Orig-To: [email-masked]
Rewrite-To: apollo!mit-eddie!ai.mit.edu!pdp8-lovers
Return-Path: <teda!bob>
Date: Thu, 24 May 90 10:21:31 PDT
From: [email-masked] (Bob Armstrong at EDA West)
X-Vms-To: TEDA::"ai.mit.edu!pdp8-lovers"
To: [email-masked]
Subject: RE: drives

>memory.  Has anyone ever tried to cable up the standard small
>Winchester drives of today (Seagates, Quantums, MicroScis, etc., )
>to an 8E?  Is there any hardware/software reason it cannot be done?

  How about just buying a DECmate-II ?  These have both a ST506 disk
controller and a RX50 available, and are quite nice machines.  You can
get used ones, including the RD5x controller, for less than $1000. And
an OS/278 kit, including almost correct sources, is available from DECUS.

  Do you have other special Omnibus hardware that you can't part with ?

Bob

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:07:21
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:07:21
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Date: Thu, 24 May 90 02:15:12 EDT
From: [email-masked] (Larry Stone)
Subject: Re: drives

>Most modern disk-drive interfaces are designed to do DMA into system
>memory.  The Omnibus had "data break" I/O, but it looks pretty hairy,
>and I think it requires an extra data break controller card.

Hmmm. I don't want to imply something, Larry, but Data Break is the
same thing as DMA. More specifically, Data Break is one way to
implement DMA. Nowadays it is called cycle stealingg, but it is
the same thing. DMA always is a little pain to build, however.

>Fortunately, I think a SCSI (or SASI - the proto-SCSI) interface can be
>built using good old programmed I/O, and still be "fast enough".  A
>SCSI disk unit has its own sector buffer, so it can send bytes to the
>host asynchronously at whatever rate the host wants.

If SCSI interfaces are possible to make program controlled might be true,
dec built the "modern" DECtape controller as a program controlled device.
However, there are some serious setbacks with this design. You cannot allow
interrupts with this design, and since I'm interested in writing a "nice"
operating system, or using one of the existing multiuser OS, I cannot
seriously consider that approach.
I believe that designing a Data Break interface nowadays should not be
to hard. There are advanced circuits available to simplify things.

>Writing the software -- a standard OS/8 file structured device driver --
>is probably the easiest part.  I agree that the limitations are a pain,
>but after being spoiled by tree-structured directories on Unix, I'm not
>sure that I'd *want* more than 2 meg in a single "directory"!

Well, I was thinking of something other than OS/8. I agree that I don't
need more than 2 meg in one directory, but MULTOS has several
directories on one disk, for example.

> It looks pretty easy to build one
>out of an NCR 5380 SCSI controller chip.  That chip handles all the
>logic and handshaking on the bus, and presents a much simpler interface
>to the computer, which fits the PDP-8 programmed I/O model nicely.  I
>roughed out an interface that provides the IOTs a device driver would need.

Does that chip supply and DMA signals?

>It's easy to get a SCSI disk.  I picked up an Adaptec ST506-to-SCSI disk
>controller (at a hamfest) which can be slapped on top of any cheap 10-Mb
>drive to create a SCSI disk.  Thanks to the PC market, ST506 disks
>are available and inexpensive.

Since I already have en RL8-A controller, I can already use 10 meg disks.
What I would like is something with atleast 30 meg, preferrably more...

>By the way, the Omnibus Foundation Module (M-something, it's in the 1977
>logic handbook) is a wonderful board for building a custom interface.
>It has all the bus drivers and receivers, and a good bit of the decoding
>logic already done.  There is also a generous kludge area with 16-pin
>*and* wide (24- or 40-pin) DIPs, edge connectors, and 40-pin Berg
>connectors available on wire-wrap pins.  I've got one of these beauties,
>but my Diablo HyType-I and music interfaces are on it now so they'd need
>to be torn down and moved to a plain kludge board.

I'd like to get my hands on a board like that. However, it is only
usable for programmed I/O operations, and maybe interrupt (I'm not
sure).

>Whenever I finally get this done, I'll make all the notes, logic design,
>and software available.  It may be a while, since I just moved
>and the pdp-8/e is still in pieces!

I hope you get to it. I'd like to see what comes out of it.

>  There was a DECUS "VAX
>driver" for OS/8, but I think it was just a one-shot file transfer
>program; you open the device and it reads or writes a file on the VAX.
>I may have the source to this on line, when I get the '8 back together anyway.

Yup. The device driver had some special handling when block 0 was addressed
(my guess), which sent a DCL command over the serial line, either typing
a file, or copying TTY: to a file. The close operation made the device driver
send a ^Z. Pretty easy to write.

>	-- Larry

======================================================================
Everybody know that the DECstation	- I'm on a bus
is a pdp8, which is a RISC, but		- on a psychodelic trip,
where did MIPS computers get into it?	- reading murder books
					- and tryin' to stay hip.

	- Johnny Billquist		- Billy Idol

[email-masked]
[email-masked]
======================================================================

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:16:25
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:16:25
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: RE: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Date: Thu, 24 May 90 10:21:31 PDT
From: [email-masked] (Bob Armstrong at EDA West)
To: [email-masked]

>  How about just buying a DECmate-II ?  These have both a ST506 disk
>controller and a RX50 available, and are quite nice machines.  You can
>get used ones, including the RD5x controller, for less than $1000. And
>an OS/278 kit, including almost correct sources, is available from DECUS.

The DECmate II uses the CMOS-8, by Harris or Intersil. This machine
is not an Omnibus machine, but has its own special multiplexed bus
(I believe).

>Bob

======================================================================
Everybody know that the DECstation	- I'm on a bus
is a pdp8, which is a RISC, but		- on a psychodelic trip,
where did MIPS computers get into it?	- reading murder books
					- and tryin' to stay hip.

	- Johnny Billquist		- Billy Idol

[email-masked]
[email-masked]
======================================================================

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:38:49
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Subdirectories for OS/8...
To: [email-masked]

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:38:49
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Subdirectories for OS/8...
To: [email-masked]

In case anybody is interested, I have a subdirectory program
and device driver for OS/8.

This is something for you who thinks the diskspace is too large.

It works in the following way:

You create a file (a few 100 blocks or so) on SYS or other resident
device. The program configures the SFD: driver for the proper
directory, and modifies PIP and RESORC accordingly.
The SFD: driver is then a filestructured device, which can be zero:d,
and so forth. It works, but is very crude.

If anybody is intersted, I can post it here.

Note: You can have several subdirectories, but you cannot nest them.

======================================================================
Everybody know that the DECstation	- I'm on a bus
is a pdp8, which is a RISC, but		- on a psychodelic trip,
where did MIPS computers get into it?	- reading murder books
					- and tryin' to stay hip.

	- Johnny Billquist		- Billy Idol

[email-masked]
[email-masked]
======================================================================

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:32:29
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Small disks
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]

Date: Mon 28 May 90 16:32:29
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Small disks
To: [email-masked], [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Hi, Wally..

Since you didn't manage to send you letter to pdp8-lovers, I'm
sending it for you, along with some comments of my own.

>Return-Path: <[email-masked]>
>Posted-Date: Fri, 25 May 90 08:31:13 -0700
>Message-Id: <[email-masked]>
>To: [email-masked]
>Subject: Re: Small disks
>Date: Fri, 25 May 90 08:31:13 -0700
>From: [email-masked]
>
>There seems to be a flurry of interest in IBM style disks for the '8'.
>I got your comments on that and thought I'd throw in a little. Maybe
>it should all go to PDP8LOVERS or however you manage to send it to
>everybody. I don't know for sure just who was interrested in this.
>Anyway, the disks (10-30 megs) can be purchsed new for around $200
>here. A controller is $100 or so. A person could mount the controller
>on another board with the unibus terminals to fit into the backplane
>of the 8 and then with a little interface circuitry, go into the '8'.
>Also of course, your suggestion of bying the interface chips and 
>doing the whole thing from scratch. I believe that making a DMA 
>interface is no more difficult than making a programed I/O type. I 
>have the specifications handy for either. If anybody should want to
>try somthing like this, I would be glad to become involved a little. 
>I have access to the ALTERA PLD system which allows 7400 logic to be
>packed into PLD's evean a small PLD will easily replace a dozen or so
>7400 logic chips and the little ones cost about $10.00 each. 

I'm pretty interested in making a SCSI DMA controller for the OMNIBUS.
Unfortenately, I'm living in Sweden, so I will probably be of more
moral than physical support. However, I think that designing a
controller would be a nice project, which some more people
would be interested in.

As I have said earlier (to Wally at least), another project
I would be intersted in would be a four or eight line
serial TTY controller.

I have some ideas about this. If enough people are interested
in this, we could maybe work something out.

======================================================================
Everybody know that the DECstation	- I'm on a bus
is a pdp8, which is a RISC, but		- on a psychodelic trip,
where did MIPS computers get into it?	- reading murder books
					- and tryin' to stay hip.

	- Johnny Billquist		- Billy Idol

[email-masked]
[email-masked]
======================================================================

Date: Mon 28 May 90 15:38:38
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked], [email-masked],
        [email-masked]

Date: Mon 28 May 90 15:38:38
From: Johnny Billquist <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: drives
To: [email-masked]
Cc: [email-masked], [email-masked], [email-masked],
        [email-masked]
In-Reply-To: <[email-masked]>

Hi, Loren.

>I have decided to go a different route, and that's to write an MS-DOS device
>driver for the unused PDP-8/e I have.  The eight will (hopefully) just see a 
>terminal ... or maybe I will want my PC to act as the boot device for the PDP,
>I don't know yet.
>
>Has anyone done anything like this yet?  

I have some old DECUS 12bit sig letters, and in one of these there is an
article about using DECtape II on a pdp8. The DECtape II is a device which
is connected via RS-232. It is smaller than standard DECtape, but bears
much resemblance otherwise.
I believe this is something a little like what you are thinking of.
The one who connected DECtape II to a pdp8, connected it via a KL8-E,
and wrote a two page device driver for the eight, which worked fine.
I can check things up a little more, if you are interested.

>+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+
>| Loren E. Heal | Internet: [email-masked] (from *net, you figure it out) | 
>|(Not a spokesman for the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign)      | 
>|(I may work there, but I still own my own mind!)                          |
>+--------------------------------------------------------------------------+

======================================================================
Everybody know that the DECstation	- I'm on a bus
is a pdp8, which is a RISC, but		- on a psychodelic trip,
where did MIPS computers get into it?	- reading murder books
					- and tryin' to stay hip.

	- Johnny Billquist		- Billy Idol

[email-masked]
[email-masked]
======================================================================