Subject: RE: home made gas forge

From: [email-masked]
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 1996 16:01:17 EDT

>From: Steve Smith <[email-masked]>
>Dear Vance,
># My biggest hassle is the top of the forge.
># Can refractory wool be used right up against the burners?
>I think you have zeroed in on the main problems in building a
>gas forge, brick or otherwise. One guy suggested using an
>appropriately high temp wool supported with raku (clay) buttons.

What is a clay button? I don't know what I'd hold up the wool with.
A circular design would presumably hold itself up, right?

Also can refractory wool or rammable take direct flame, like
surrounding the business end of the burner?

>You need a respirator (I use a positive pressure one).

I think I know what a positive pressure respirator is, but where did
you get it and how much did it cost?

Thanks
Vance

 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
*  Message From : BURNS, VANCE A.       *
*  Location     : US-HOUSTON(IS3) LAN   *
*  KOMAIL ID    : FVAB94  (IS3     )    *
*  Date and Time: 04/15/96  12:09:00    *
 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

---

From: Steve Smith <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 16 Apr 96 14:45:48 MDT

Dear Vance,

> What is a clay button? I don't know what I'd hold up the wool with.
Make a lump of clay sort of shaped like a golf tee. Wide on one end,
skinny on the other. The skinny end needs a hole to tie up with wire.
The fat end is what supports the wool. The fat end is sort of like a
button on your sofa, with the skinny end sticking (up) through the
wool to a wire hanger.

Jere Kirkpatrick does the following:
To hold up roof wool: Make horizontal beams from 316 stainless welding
rod (1/8"). Tie these together with welding wire 316 stainless (twist
ties).  See after my signature below for more info. This sounds lots
easier than making clay buttons.

> A circular design would presumably hold itself up, right?
I assume circular means a tube forge. Mine uses 2" wool and it holds
itself up just fine.

> surrounding the business end of the burner?
Right next to the burner is not the hottest--opposite the burner is.
I've got 2400F wool in my tube forge and it seems to work pretty well.
The 2400 stuff was about $5 / square foot, while the 2600F stuff was
about $30! I'm a weekender, your results may differ. I bought the 8
pound per cubic foot stuff from Uniwest in Denver for $5/sq ft. Let me
know if you need their number.

> >You need a respirator (I use a positive pressure one).  
Mine is from a company called Airstream. They advertise in Fine
Woodworking magazine. It was about $200. I amortized it over the 20
forges I'm making. Hard to justify for one forge. It has a belt pack
which has batteries, fan and filter in it, a hose goes up to the
headpiece. They have several styles, including one with a carbon
filter (good for fumes, NOT good for the kind of dust insulation
makes). They are pretty good helmets as they don't fog up (airflow).

This type of respirator is pretty important if you are cutting silica
(as in the fucial foam insulation I'm using). The wool insulation
isn't supposed to be as bad. Do you have the Anvil's Ring article
"Forges and Fibers"? That is about as good a source of information as
I have found. It's hard to tell what information is reasonable
precaution and what is cya.

--
Steve Smith
[email-masked]

From: "[email-masked] 415.855.5707" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: home made gas forge

I just spoke to Jere at Valley Forge & Welding - they have Inswool in 1" and 2"
thick.

(from the Artmetal resource list)

Jere Kirkpatrick's Valley Forge and Welding
     30-C E. San Francisco Street
     Willits, CA 95490
     707-459-2523
     800-367-5373
     Manufactures treadle hammer kits and other blacksmith tools and supplies.
     Catalog available.

It is 2' wide and is sold by the running foot.  For each 1' x 2' x 2" piece it
is $12.90.  The 1" thick version is about half the cost.

They also have a product to stiffen the inswool, which I think is a liquid.  I
haven't used this stuff, but what if you mads some sort of "shell" filled with
inswool and used the liquid to stiffen it?

(I once swore I'd never resort to ascii graphics, but...)

------------------------
|  fill here w/      |
|  inswool           |  <--- metal framework, open at the bottom where exposed
to fire
---                   ---

This might work even better with a castable refractory as the 'lip' would serve
to retain the material.

Joe McGlynn

I called Jerry. He doesn't know the temp rating of the inswool. He
uses Mizzou castable for the floor and others. Doors he casts in a
frame out of "Castolite 30" which comes out much lower density than
fireclay. 

To hold up roof wool: Make horizontal beams from 316 stainless welding
rod (1/8"). Tie these together with welding wire 316 stainless (twist
ties). 

steve 4/10/96

Checking with the friendly lady that runs Firebrick Supply in St. Paul on
Marshall Ave (612) 646-1311 

I got per sq. ft. quotes of:

                        6# density               8# density

1 inch thick              $2.50                    $3.30
2 inch thick               5.00                     6.60

Standard width is 24" though she says she's got some 6# 2" at 48"

Lining the inside of a twelve inch pipe would be about 6.5 sq. ft.

How thich are we talking?

Gene

 The Studios of Gene Olson and Chris Wilson - Working in Metals, Stone,
Mixed Media
    8600 NE O'Dean Ave, Elk River MN 55330
   fax:  612-441-5846  Phone:  612-441-1563
 email:  [email-masked]    URL:  http://www.cris.com/~mettlewk/