Subject: Re: Clear Coat

From: Hays/Cash <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 2 Sep 1996 21:37:32 -0400

Does anyone have any suggestions for a good clear coat for raw steel?  
I have used epoxies (excellent, but very time consuming to mix, especially
in small "touchup" quantities.  It also requires really harsh solvents.)  I
have tried several different other types and have settled on polyurethane.
It seals most patinas very well and seems to last forever for interior pieces.
Thought someone might know of something they liked better.

--Doug Hays and Penny Cash

---

From: Bill Roberts <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 03 Sep 1996 08:02:40 -0400

Dugnpen-
I've settled on polyurethane also. Quick and easy. This is a good 
thread, can't wait to hear what others are using.
 Happy Hammering-
Bill

---

From: David Wilson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 1996 12:01:52 -0600

Doug Hays and Penny Cash said,
>Thought someone might know of something they liked better.

Doug and Penny,
There was an excellent post about a month ago on this. Someone searched the
archive and found some very good sources. Wish I'd kept it. Well anyway,
recently, I called Sculpt Nouveau (1-800-728-5787) and they currently
suggest Agate Lacquer #8A. It's available at phone number 1-718-784-0660,
in quarts and gallon sizes. If I recall, you can mix powdered dyes with it
and/or use it over patinas for internal and external use. I have some dyes
but have yet to order the Agate Lacquer. Sounds like some fun to me tho'.

--
David
http://www.flash.net/~dwwilson/
[email-masked]

---

From: "Steven O. Smith" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 3 Sep 96 13:38:28 MDT

Here it is. What I saved from the past discussion. I was just going to
send it to the individuals, but there seemed to be enough interest to
post it to the group. 

--
Steven O. Smith
[email-masked]

Date: Thu, 07 Mar 1996 16:32:47 -0400 (EDT)
From: BILL PATE <[email-masked]>
Subject: Clear Finish for Exterior Ironwork

>I have not been able to find a clear finish which will last more than a few
>months outside on iron work. I am a little familar with the phosphate
>
>Does anyone out there know of any such thing as a clear finish which will
>last outside?
>Thanks,
>Clay

I put a clean sanded piece of steel, half of it sprayed with automotive
clear laquer finish, on a nail outside my shop in August, 1994 (I also 
stamped the date in it). It is in the sun and rain daily.

The air down here on the coast could almost be considered a corrosive
gas, but the piece has only begun to show a little rust under the finish
within the last few months. I think they were from small bubbles in the 
original aerosol spray job which caused thin spots.

I think that a better spray job, with something other than a K-mart spray can
would last longer. Maybe the clearcoat from an automotive paint supply.

Bill Pate.

Date: Fri, 8 Mar 1996 08:53:58 -0500
From: [email-masked] (Bill Fiorini)
Subject: Re: Clear Finish for Exterior Ironwork

Francis Whitaker told me once about a product called Val-Oil.  It is a type
of  clear varnish, maybe plasticisized, that you can purchase through paint
suppliers.  I believe this is what he uses on outside architectural
ironwork.
Bill

Date: Fri, 5 Jan 96 20:30:46 EST
From: Susan Covington <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Finishes

Dear Folks,

I like the finsish I learned from Francis Whitaker, and he I
beleive from Samuel Yellin.  To wit:

	1 part turpentine
	2 parts BOILED Linseed oil
	1/4 part hard wax (I like bees wax)

	Melt the hard wax in the liquid in a DOUBLE BOILER
arrangement.  After you take it off the heat, add 2-3
Tablespoons of Japan Paint Dryer (available from
Sherwin-Williams).

This will make a paste like mixture - more wax harder, less wax
runnier.  Excellent for inside applications and perhaps ootside
if you live in Nevada - and then you won't need the paint dryer!

Good luck,

Nol Putnam

([email-masked])

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 1996 18:19:12 -0500
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Clear Finish for Exterior Ironwork

At a recent SWABA workshop, Robb Gunter recommended Val-Oil or Val-Spar for a
durable exterior finish, available in New Mexico from Furrows.  He say
Sherman-Williams makes a multi-purpose flattening agent, which he mixed 20%
with Val-Oil, which takes some of the sheen off.

One of the troubles with not keeping up here is I have no idea if this has
already been posted!  O.K., I'll catch up Sunday!                ENJOY!
          John Seaver

Date: Thu, 7 Mar 96 16:11 EST
From: Mike Linn <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Clear Finish for Exterior Ironwork

At 04:02 PM 3/7/96 -0500, you wrote:

>
>Does anyone out there know of any such thing as a clear finish which will
>last outside?
>Thanks,
>Clay
>
Clay,
        I got ahold of a can of stuff from the company I used to work for in
Colorado, the stuff was to thrown out but I grabbed it and kept it. Its a
clear liquid plastic finish called Varathane. According to the can made by
Flecto International Ltd., Oakland, CA.94604 and Flecto Coatings Ltd.
Richmond, BC. 

exerpt from can :

Varathane is a clear plastic coating for interior and exterior surfaces.
...produces a clear, satin finish which has a lifespan twice that of
varnish. Varathane resists alcohol, acid, abrasion, marring, chipping,
peeling and exterior weathering. ... acts as its own sealer but can be
applied over previously lacquered, varnished or stained surfaces.

I tested this stuff on a flag holder I made last year. I sprayed half the
holder with Varathane and left the other half bare metal. as of today (after
1 year in the elements) half is nice and metallic grey/shiney and the other
half is coated with rust. This stuff works but I cant find anybody who
carries it. Ive only got 1/2 a can left and I hoard it like gold.

I told Alan Kress about it last year, maybe he found out something. If
anyone else out there can find some info, PLEASE post it. 

later,

mike
                                    _///_
                                   /(o o)\
===============================o000o=(_)=o000o====
               Michael Linn 
            Artisian Blacksmith
              AFC Web Master
 http://www.the-matrix.com/afc/index.html
==================================================
Smile, it makes people wonder what you've been up to.

Date: Sat,  9 Mar 96 09:30:14 CST
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Clear Finish for Exterior Ironwork 

On Thu, 7 Mar 96 16:11 EST  Mike Linn wrote:
>At 04:02 PM 3/7/96 -0500, you wrote:
>

>        I got ahold of a can of stuff from the company I used to work 
for in
>Colorado, the stuff was to thrown out but I grabbed it and kept it. Its 
a
>clear liquid plastic finish called Varathane.
>
>I tested this stuff on a flag holder I made last year. I sprayed half 
the
>holder with Varathane and left the other half bare metal. as of today 
(after
>1 year in the elements) half is nice and metallic grey/shiney and the 
other
>half is coated with rust. This stuff works but I cant find anybody who
>carries it. 

Varathane is availalbe at many lumber yards.  The wooden floors of my 
home have three coats of the stuff!!  However, I also have tried it for a 
metal finish and I didn't get nearly the results you did!!!

In my expiriments, the metal oxidized "under" the plastic finish.  While 
they remained smooth and clean to the touch, the metal itself became a 
classic black-brown in color with silver highlights.  It was a very 
spectacular effect.  Not what I was trying for, but the customer loved it 
and bought it anyway.

I haven't had any problems finding the stuff around here.  Try your local 
lumber yard paint store in the paints/varnishes section.  If all else 
fails maybe I could arrange to ship you some, but the cost on something 
that heavy may not make it worth it.  The offer is there though...

-----------------------------------------------------
Name: Franklyn D. Garland        A Hobby Is Hard work
E-mail: [email-masked]          You wouldn't Do For
Date: 03/09/96                     A Living.

http://www.mcs.net/~frnklyn/homepage/

For PGP Public Key finger [email-masked]
-----------------------------------------------------

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 10:46:42 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Roger Olsen)
Subject: primer for natural iron finish

the product mentioned a few days ago as a primer for a natural iron finish
is called "MICROSEAL" it is available from the microseal corp. PO Box 541,
Rome N.Y. 13440.  tel: (315) 337-2720. as i understand it, it was developed
and is used as a clear primer for outdoor bronze sculptures which were
being eaten by acid rain. it can be used under a hot wax application (but
not to hot, think warm, not hot) or under any other type of clear coating.
if used as a final and only treatment it produces an interesting brown
oxide that is appealing with the right mind set.
                        good luck, R. Olsen

Date: 10 Mar 1996 13:17:56 EDT
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Exterior clear coat

Clay,
I've used, with some success, a number of different automotive acrylic
top coats.  The ones I have used have all been two part paints.  They
vary in price from moderate to expensive.  They are all high gloss but
can be dulled with compatible flateners sold by the automotive paint
dealer from which you purcased the acrylic topcoat.  Some of these can
be recoated in 5 minutes and ready for delivery in 2-4 hours.  However,
they are all solvent based, read labels carefully follow explicitly.
I have also use a water-borne acrylic clearcoat with varying results.
If you are interested let me know and I'll follow up with more details.
Roger Carlsen
Ephraim Forge, Inc
Frankfort, IL
[email-masked]

Date: Sun, 10 Mar 1996 19:19:56 -0500
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Clear Finish for Exterior Ironwork 

Good clear coatings are very hard to come by, yet they are so very important.

I Have a few clear coatings that I've been using which seem to be pretty
good.  None of these coatings will last forever,   although they are the best
I've tried so far, the different elements will change the life span of a
coating.  Sun and salty sea air will be the harshest.  Try to keep an eye on
the piece or at least give a disclaimer when it is sold or installed that it
will need to be maintained.  Make sure that there isn't any rust on the metal
before you apply the coating.  You need to seal all sides, cracks,
everything.   If you don't do either of these two things it dosen't matter
too much which brand of coating you put on.

Okay here they are - Agate Lacquer, tel:718 784 0660  add: 11-13 Forty-Third
Rd. Long Island City, NY 11101 / ask for #8A Lacquer and #8A Lacquer Thinner,
it mixes 50/50.   Next , Syncralac, made by Peacock Lab in Philadelphia tel:
215 729 4400 this is made for copper and bronze so you should add a corrosive
inhibitor for ferrous metal.  Ciba sells corrosive inhibitors -add: 540 White
Plains Rd - Tarrytown NY 10591 tel: 800 431 1900.  Ask for Irgacor #153.  You
add about 1% by volume to the coating.  Last one, XIM Company in Westlake,
Ohio tel: 800 262 8469.  Ask for the #900 Protective finish for ferrous
metals. 

You can always put a wax on top of the clear coating to add more protection,
then maintain the wax.  You may also apply a hot coating of wax over the
metal (or the finish you have on the metal) then apply the clear coating then
the other layer of wax.  Get a good microcrystalline ( a good brand is
Liberon or Libertine) that wont gum up or yellow.  Call Bryant Lab in
Berkeley, California 800 367 3141 

Try these coatings on your metal and throw them out back for a few seasons.
 Let me know what happens.  Just so it's a fair test to the coatings make
sure that there isn't any rust on the surface before you put the coating on.

If you can get a good clear coat you will be able to apply a transparent
finish (patina, dye, pigment, whatever) and then the metal will show through.
 Your work wont look like it is plastic or paint.

I would love to try out a coating that you like.  Let me know what your
using.

Ron Young

Date: Mon, 25 Mar 1996 10:28:34 -0800
From: [email-masked] (Roger Olsen)
Subject: exterior clearcoat

i was at the local quarry last weekend and while in their show room i
noticed that they sell a clear coat for river rock, i wondered if it would
work on metal so took down the manufactures number and made some calls.
their tech support person recommended another product they also make to be
used on exterior ironwork, he claims it will work wonderfully and once put
on it is there to stay, and resistant to virtually any type of chemical,
acid rain or other abuse.

the manufacturer is the Tamms Corp. tel: 1 800 21tamms, their customer
service can tell you of a distributor in your area.

application: on a CLEAN piece of iron first apply a coat of dura-prime
metal primer, over this put a coat of aquathane clear, this will give ypu a
gloss finish that will always look wet, for a matte finish put a coat of
aquathane clear matte over the aquathane clear. you have to put the gloss
coat on either way, you cannot put aquathane matte on over just a coat of
the primer. it can be sprayed or brushed on, it is a thin product and thin
coats are recommended, drying time is a few hours.

i have not tried this product yet, but their salesman for my area has
assured me I won't find anything better. i'll believe when i see but it
sounds hopeful.

if anyone else trys it please post your results.

                good luck, roger

Date: Wed, 27 Mar 1996 23:11:03 -0500 (EST)
From: "John W. Pollins, III" <[email-masked]>
Subject: Finishes

        I said I'd report on my experiment with a single coat (brush) of
polyurathane.
The fourth winter did it in. streaks of rust all over the place.
        The piece with an undercoat of boiled lindseed oil is still bright
and shiny but it's only been out two years. I think the lindseed oil stays
slightly viscus under the polyurathane/varnish and reseals the thing every
time the sun comes out.
        Stand by. We'll see how it looks after a couple more years.

                        Pollins

Date: Mon, 3 Jun 1996 13:26:58 -0400
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Incralac vs. Syncralac/ Ron Young

Hello,
 So glad you are finding out about "good" coatings.  Incralac was the first
coating out made by a company called Stan Chem.  (I'll put all the addresses
below)  The formula was developed by the Copper Foundation.  It is really
nice to use and holds up well  even outdoors.  Incralac has corrosive
inhibitors for copper, bronze, brass, UV protectors and great binders.   It
doesn't last forever,  nothing does, but it is far, far better than most
coatings.  With good maintenance you'll be happy.  Incralac is easy to apply
(you should always spray  on your clear coating for the best the protection.
 Spraying eliminates ridges that collect dirt which breaks down the coating
faster)  
 Now, Syncralac is the same thing.  It's the same formula made by a different
company - Peacock Lab.  There isn't supposed to be any difference.  The only
difference is between Stan Chem who last I knew only sold in 5 gallon
containers and Peacock who will sell a quart if you want.  Both companies
have a thinner to go with it.  I would suggest that you buy their thinner as
it will have the UVs, binders, etc. that the coating does.
 There is another company Agate lacquer that also has a good coating.  Agate
is what is on the Statue of Liberty.  It dries less glossy than Syncralac,
it's stronger, and less expensive.  I am using Agate Lacquer more these days
than Syncralac.  Agate is mixed 50/50 with it's thinner.  They have many
types of lacquer and the people who work there delight in confusing you.
 Order #8A lacquer and thinner.
 It is always a good idea to apply a good microrystalline wax over whatever
clear coating you use.  Bryant Lab in Berkeley carries the good waxes.  800
367 3141.  Wax will add a lot of time to the life of a coating.  Also you can
maintain the wax by cleaning with a non ionic soap(Amway) then re apply wax.
 This way the coating is always protected

 Syncralac - Peacock Lab. Philadelphia, Pa. 215 729 4400
  great stuff, UV's binders, corrosive inhibitors (non-ferrous)
 Sculpt Nouveau - New water base clear coating.  Spray on over      patinas
and finishes.  800 728 5787        
         Agate  Lacquer-  11-13 Forty Third Rd. Long Island City, NY
              11101 / 718 784 0660 fax 718 482 9551.  Has a nice look.
              Very strong.  Ask for #8A lacquer & thinner.
         Incralac - The original coating, same as Syncralac  made by Stan
                Chem 203 828 0571.  They only sell in 5 gal minimums.  They
have    developed a water base Incralac that seems terrific
 XIM - '900 Protective Finish' Westlake, Ohio 800 262 8469
  Specify for ferrous or non ferrous metals
 Pro Line - San Diego, Ca. 619 231 2313
  made for coating Navy ships.  Seems great so far.  Two part,    solvent
base. Ask for #4018 A & B

Hope this helps,
Ron Young

Date: Mon, 3 Jun 1996 18:26:25 -0500 (CDT)
From: Hank Kaminsky <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Incralac vs. Syncralac/ Ron Young

At 01:26 PM 6/3/96 -0400, [email-masked] wrote:

> There is another company Agate lacquer that also has a good coating.  Agate
>is what is on the Statue of Liberty.  It dries less glossy than Syncralac,
>it's stronger, and less expensive.  I am using Agate Lacquer more these days
>than Syncralac.  

A note from past practice:

The first portrait bust here in Arkansas was for the University of Arkansas.
It was cast at a foundry in Tulsa (called Turkey Track now defunct) and they
asked me how I wanted it finished. They recommended Incralac. I ok'd it. 

Results, on an indoor piece, very shiny and over the years no changes at
all, no effect from students rubbing the forehead for luck on the way to
exams.  

Since then I have been doing all the work myself (except the casting) on the
finishing and mold making etc. and I finish with paste wax. Noses get
brighter now over time and the luck is probably better. 

Hank
Hank Kaminsky, Sculptor <[email-masked]>
Studio: "The Art Experience," 641 West 6th Street, Fayetteville, AR 72701
http://www.uark.edu/ALADDIN/artexp/hank/hankhome.html

Date: Fri, 05 Jul 1996 16:59:51 -0700
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Clear coat

David,
  I have used a coat of Tung oil (Formby's) with success for several 
years.  Don't bother with cheaper brands, it flakes :-(
  One coat for things which sit and look pretty, two coats for something
someone will use...towel rack, fireplace tools, curtain rods etc.  Leave
at least 24 hours between your finish color coat, and each coat of Tung 
oil.  When customers ask me where I get such a thing, I tell them from a
local disc jockey, but YOU can get it from any local lumber yard/hardware
combine, or farm supply store, or anywhere finish products are sold.
   Bob

Date: Sat, 6 Jul 1996 12:16:43 -0500
From: [email-masked] (David Wilson)
Subject: Re: Clear coat

>I would like to know what ye all recommend for a clear coat finish on
>interior ironwork.  Say you have a patina on steel, or want to leave it
>natural; what is the best to use for a clear, protective coat?  How
>about matt or satin versus glossy?  I believe someone once mentioned
>ValOil - is that a good finish clear coat?  I've used polyurethane, but
>don't like the result.  Any recommendations would be appreciated.
>
>D.C. Hufford
>Richmond, KY

The Serious stuff;

Sculpt Nouveau now recommends (instead of Syncralac);
Agate Lacquer
11-13 Forty Third Rd.
Long Island City, N.Y. 11101
718-784-0660
fax 718-482-9551

Sculpt Nouveau sez it's: "Very Strong, Ask for #8A laquer & thinner"
They sell it by the quarts and gallons. I don't know if it comes in Gloss,
Semi, or Matte.

BTW, their info sez Syncralac has UV binders, corrosive inhibitors
(non-ferrous), maybe the Agate Lacquer does too?

The Non-Serious Stuff;

Fine print, Semi-YAK: I haven't tried Agate Lacquer, jest the messenger,
not a employee etc., etc., (doing my best imitation of Yul Brynner, you
should have been here to enjoy it , must be the heat getting to me! My
keyboard is turning into Blue Bell Ice Cream, the cats licking it.)

Date: Sat, 6 Jul 1996 13:29:20 -0400 (EDT)
From: [email-masked] (Gene Olson and Chris Wilson)
Subject: Re: Clear coat

No experieince on this one Dave, but I picked up this reference on
rec.crafts.metalworking back on Mar 1 re. clear coats for copper

from a  guy named Doug Von Gausig [email-masked]
http://www.sedona.net/~dougvg

"We use a water souble clear coat from Trip. Their phone is 213-261-7301
They have a wide range of copper coatings and we have found all of them to
be excellent.  OUr shop produces decorative copper Items, from photo frames
to switch plates etc."

Now Copper is a totaly different beast and harder to bond to than steel, so
I don't know if the bonding chemistry would be appropriate. If they are as
good as this guy thinks they are, they may have an enlightened opinion.

Good Luck.

Gene

>I would like to know what ye all recommend for a clear coat finish on 
>interior ironwork.  Say you have a patina on steel, or want to leave it 
>natural; what is the best to use for a clear, protective coat?  How 
>about matt or satin versus glossy?  I believe someone once mentioned 
>ValOil - is that a good finish clear coat?  I've used polyurethane, but 
>don't like the result.  Any recommendations would be appreciated.
>
>D.C. Hufford
>Richmond, KY
>
>
>

 The Studios of Gene Olson and Chris Wilson  Metals, Stone, Mixed Media
  8600 NE O'DEAN AVE, ELK RIVER, MN 55330
  URL: http://www.concentric.net/~mettlewk/

Date: Sat, 6 Jul 1996 18:32:17 -0400
From: [email-masked] (fred clark)
Subject: Re: Clear coat

>>I would like to know what ye all recommend for a clear coat finish on
>>interior ironwork.  Say you have a patina on steel, or want to leave it
>>natural; what is the best to use for a clear, protective coat?  How
>>about matt or satin versus glossy?  I believe someone once mentioned
>>ValOil - is that a good finish clear coat?  I've used polyurethane, but
>>don't like the result.  Any recommendations would be appreciated.
>>
>>D.C. Hufford
>>Richmond, KY

Here's something Franklyn Garland at UMBA was kind enough to let us copy
and put in our newsletter - it might be what you're looking for:

"-The way I put a blue/black =DEnish on is to buff off the scale, heat until
the metal turns about the color or colors I want and then spray with WD-40
and wipe when cold. I use this =DEnish on bathroom towel bars, and haven't
had a rust spot yet."  William Hightower, in the Upper Midwest Blacksmith
Association newsletter

=46red

Date: Sat, 6 Jul 1996 20:03:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: Russell McCrackin <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: Clear coat

At 01:41 PM 7/5/96 -0400, you wrote:
>I would like to know what ye all recommend for a clear coat finish on 
>interior ironwork.  Say you have a patina on steel, or want to leave it 
>natural; what is the best to use for a clear, protective coat?  How 
>about matt or satin versus glossy?  I believe someone once mentioned 
>ValOil - is that a good finish clear coat?  I've used polyurethane, but 
>don't like the result.  Any recommendations would be appreciated.
>
>D.C. Hufford
>Richmond, KY
>
>
I have used a product called "Deft" on kitchen drawer pulls, cabinet door 
handles, towel rings, drapery rods, etc.  It is labeled as a clear wood 
finish, but I have great success with it on metal.  Comes either gloss or
semi=gloss.  Dries to the touch in about 30 minutes.  Wait 2 hours between
coats.  Easist "bar top varnish" I have ever used.  Finished a dresser with
it many years ago, used a powder puff to spread it, leveled quickly, and 
came out fine.  Only have trouble with brush marks if you use too little of it.
Clean up with lacquer thinner.  Used paint thinner once, and got a lot of "Junk"
on the brush, but when it dried, the brush came clean with a little rubbing.
Mkaes a good clear coat that resists wet hands, etc.

Rusty

Get it hot and hit it hard.

Never use force, get a bigger hammer.
 [email-masked]

Date: Sat, 6 Jul 1996 23:10:20 -0400
From: [email-masked]
Subject: Re: Clear coat

One thing to keep in mind when using WD-40 for a clear coat.  It has a
hardener in it; so let it work.  Don't immediately wipe off the piece after
you've coated it.  Allow it to harden for 24 hours or so.

Eric

From: [email-masked] (Gene Olson and Chris Wilson)
Subject: Re: Need some Information!!

>Ron Young is giving the patination course and has heard of a clear sealer
>for all metals:steel, aluminium, bronze, etc. Has anyone used it, got a
>source where to get it????

I caught that wonderful blast of clear info that Steve echoed back to us.
Shuuurre makes one see the value of this interchange.  

Too two things I didn't notice in the list.

There is a good clear practically universal primer avail. under several
brand names.  The one I've got in my cabinet is called Steelcote. It's
really great if you are trying to combine dissimilar materials. Steel,
copper base, and aluminum (don't forget to electrically isolate the steel
and aluminum or use stainless at the joint in contact with the al.) Mind
you, it's only a primer not a sealer, it goes on like water dries mat clear
and most any paint will stick to it. Dilution is with isopropyl alcohol if I
remember right though it's generally not needed.

The other came from Rusty on the forge for finishing steel. "Deft" avialable
in fine woodworking stores.

Gene

 The Studios of Gene Olson and Chris Wilson  Metals, Stone, Mixed Media
  8600 NE O'DEAN AVE, ELK RIVER, MN 55330
  URL: http://www.concentric.net/~mettlewk/

From: [email-masked] (Gene Olson and Chris Wilson)
Subject: Re: Clearcoats

>Gene wrote:
>
>> There is a good clear practically universal primer avail. under several
>>  brand names.  The one I've got in my cabinet is called Steelcote. It's
>>  really great if you are trying to combine dissimilar materials. Steel,
>>  copper base, and aluminum (don't forget to electrically isolate the steel
>>  and aluminum or use stainless at the joint in contact with the al.) Mind
>>  you, it's only a primer not a sealer, it goes on like water dries mat
>clear
>>  and most any paint will stick to it. Dilution is with isopropyl alcohol if
>I
>>  remember right though it's generally not needed.

 (Dip painting applications may need it)

Steelcote is the company name , Steelcote mfr. co. St. Louis MO 63103

The product is called _"Stays-On" Metal Primer_   and I quote the can,

"Provides ideal adhesion fo finish coat on any surface.

Steelcote "Stays-On" Metal Primer is a compounded from synthetic and natural
resin liquids that provide exceptionally fine universal adhesive properties
that make it stay put on any surface.  It provides the perfect "key" and
ideal base for the successful application of any finishing coat material,
including lacquer. It works on cadmium plate, steel, zinc, and aluminum die
cast, chrome, brass, copper,zinc, galvaneal, tin, glass, etc.  It eliminates
etching the surface on difficult to paint metal surfaces.  Where "Stays-On"
is used only normal good painting practice in prepping the surface is
required.  "Stays-On" is colorless.  It has no body to impart any
appreciable coating to the surface over which it is applied,  It dries very
quickly - in 3 to 5 minutes, and may be recoated a once.   It is primarily
made for spray application with air pressure  at 30 to 35 pounds.  It should
be used as it comes prepared in the original containers.  It requires no
thinning. Application may be made by dipping or on very small surface areas,
it may be applied with a brush.  Clean brushes spray gun, material supply
hose and other equipment immeadiately after useing with Steelcote diluant A.
(GENE notes: the The man at Savitts paint in Minneapolis said that was
Isoproplyl alcohol.  I have used regular denatured alcohol for clean up an
it seems to work ok. EXTREME Care on that, cause ethyl alcohol is very
flammable)

Caution: Surfaces to which this material is applied should first be made
absolutely clean and free from all foreigh matter including rust." 

end quote.

Gary Stock at Warner Industrial Supplies said that it and the competing
brand they sell were basicly synthetic shellacs. Which is consistant with
the alcohol thinner.
  
>>  
>>  The other came from Rusty on the forge for finishing steel. "Deft"
>avialable
>>  in fine woodworking stores.
 Also, is "Deft" the same as your "Steelcote"?

Deft is a marketed primarily as a high end wood finish.  It is pretty much
idiot proof,  we used to use it back in seventh grade shop, as I remember
there were a number of us that nearly qualified.  It can  be had mat, semi,
and high gloss.

Must be off to work.  

Gene

 The Studios of Gene Olson and Chris Wilson  Metals, Stone, Mixed Media
  8600 NE O'DEAN AVE, ELK RIVER, MN 55330
  URL: http://www.concentric.net/~mettlewk/

---

From: Tom Vincent <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 4 Sep 1996 22:32:30 -0500 (CDT)

OK, just to add one level of complexity to this coating discussion...Here 
in the southwest, the rust finish is quite popular. Does anyone know of a 
coating that will preserve the rust coat, but protect adjoining surfaces 
from the rusty piece?